When People Say Obedience

[SwaY]

If someone said to you they do Obedience what do you think?

What is Obedience to you?

Do you think some Obedience people, fail to train there dog social manners, as there is no test for it?

( added some and people to make it make more sence)

And does your Obedience dog have the best social manners that it could have??

For the record i think ALL dogs should have social manners before anything else .

By social manners i mean, not jumping on people, not stealing food, not bullying young kids etc

Sociallly accetable dogs in my wording/eyes.

Edited May 1, 2007 by SwaY

[PAX]

If some one says that to me I think they compete in Obedience.

[ReXy]

i think socially acceptable dogs is first and formost..

being that they dont jump all over people snatch food etc, i try as best as i can to teach my dogs manners around others and to respect others space be it human or dog

obedience isnt just having as my husband says alphabet letters near your name..lol i like obedience its more a social thing for me i dont care if i never get titles its more for fun and interest

obedience for me is having a well mannered social dog who is enjoyable to have. who cares if i never get that left turn right turn down pat, i have stopped worry about that for now ,and am just enjoying my social happy little dogs. if obedience classes become a stress then we will stop going.

they for the most part are obedient at home have no dominance issues and are well mannered.

thats more than i could of ever hoped for in my dogs.

[Purpley]

When I first started obedience I would of thought it meant a socially acceptable dog, but now I would assume they are wanting to go to trials and get the letters after the dogs name.

I started obedience to have a socially acceptable dog, and having 2 young children, that was the most (and still is) important thing to me.

I know a few titled dogs, and dogs working up to titles whom I would call socially unacceptable.

I can guess that majority of the people that want socially acceptable dogs, will have kids.

**This is just my opinion**

Edited May 1, 2007 by isiss

[wheres my rock]

both i want a socially acceptable dog that i an also compete with

though my dogs may not always be the best in either area i work hard to try and make them the best they can be

i hate being jumped on by dogs especially big ones with long claws and i hate dogs that steal and go through your stuff

i like the idea of the cgc and therapy dogs as well as competition obedience.

But its the same everywhere there are so many badly behaved dogs in obedience showing and other sports

[SwaY]

I know a few titled dogs, and dogs working up to titles whom I would call socially unacceptable.

I think you are spot on there.

It's almost like it's not required, so why bother to teach it.

It seems the dogs can do anything they like, as long as they perform when the time is right.

I can guess that majority of the people that want socially acceptable dogs, will have kids.

I find that hardest to deal with, we have met quite a few dog people, who have no kids.

I would say on average there dogs are the worst.

I would even go as far as to say, some of the owners have no respect for others.

Maybe they have never had to think of there actions impacting on other people

I woudn't let me kids jumps on you, yet you think it's ok for your dog to do it to me.

My kids don't steal your food, so don't let your dog steal mine.

Manners be it dog or child is important, even if there is no test or letters to be obtained.

[SwaY]

both i want a socially acceptable dog that i an also compete with

The problem i see is, many want to compete, and they train for it.

But they don't train for basic manners.

But its the same everywhere there are so many badly behaved dogs in obedience showing and other sports

I agree with that.

[wheres my rock]

here is an example of what i eman on the weekend i met some lovely young girls at our club there sister is trianing a dog there they loved dino and wanted to cuddle him and take him for a walk

I didnt have to worry he'd jump all over them

I didnt have to worry he'd pull them around

i didnt have to worry he'd snatch food or be rude

The only thing i had to wach was that they were safe and that no oter dogs cm near them in ase the other dog wasnt nice he was a real gentleman for them

I hope to have him assessed as a therapy dog next year

On the other hand i was helping a lady with her large naughty dog he jumped all over me snatched left bruises dow my legs mud all over me not enjoyable at all for me

on the other hand most epopel think of obedience as in trial work and a pet as being well trained

[poodlefan]

Sway:

But its the same everywhere there are so many badly behaved dogs in obedience showing and other sports

And there are plenty of equally or worse behaved dogs that never leave their backyards.

"Obedience" to me means general dog training AND that particular dog sport. I have noticed that what one person finds as unacceptable behaviour in a dog, another will tolerate without complaint. Eg.

Jumping Up

Whining

Begging for food

We get the dogs we train, or don't train. Dog sports dogs are all capable to a greater or lesser degree of focussing on their handlers and obeying some cues. I've met dogs that don't do either.

[wheres my rock]

actually most clubs these days are working more toward acceptable behaviour and pet trianing rather than obedience for competition only 3% of epople who trian dogs are serious about trial work though of course those 3% are often showies as well so they are more likely to be the ones you meet i know tonnes of triners that only focus on good manners

[SwaY]

Sway:

But its the same everywhere there are so many badly behaved dogs in obedience showing and other sports

And there are plenty of equally or worse behaved dogs that never leave their backyards.

And as sad as that is, there actions don't impose on others.

[wheres my rock]

i agree if your going to take your dog out in ublic then its important to be able to control i and teach it good manners that fit with our society

[SwaY]

Sway:

I have noticed that what one person finds as unacceptable behaviour in a dog, another will tolerate without complaint. Eg.

Jumping Up

Whining

Begging for food

And if those actions impose on others, i think it's rude.

What you do in your home, doesn't generally impose on the general public.

A few examples.

A dog show, yep you expect some noise barking etc, i can live with that.

But whining for 4 hours straight, and not being corrected is rude and imposes on others.

Letting your dog pee on peoples marquees, rude.

Letting your dog badger people when they have food, rude.

Jumping on people, rude.

[dogdude]

I think you could think of badly behaved dogs from both sides of the fence, but IMO, dogs that are pattern trained in, and for a ring are never usually successfull in either situation.

When the pattern is broken, they get lost.

If on the other hand that you continue to proof using real everyday situations, your dog will be reliable and well behaved where ever it is.

So when training, I will use a trial run through type session to see where we are at, but normal training is not conducted that way.

[wheres my rock]

oh i hate it when dogs sit and drool at the food i have or worse start offering behaviours to get the treat and your trying eat and they have giant goobers even i can see yuck

[SwaY]

oh i hate it when dogs sit and drool at the food i have or worse start offering behaviours to get the treat and your trying eat and they have giant goobers even i can see yuck

The offer of behaviours is a horrible thing.

Some do it as they crave attention, others do it because they think it will get them what they want, a treat.

I carry a drool rag around for Sway now, it's not nice.

[ReXy]

here is an example of what i eman on the weekend i met some lovely young girls at our club there sister is trianing a dog there they loved dino and wanted to cuddle him and take him for a walk

I didnt have to worry he'd jump all over them

I didnt have to worry he'd pull them around

i didnt have to worry he'd snatch food or be rude

The only thing i had to wach was that they were safe and that no oter dogs cm near them in ase the other dog wasnt nice he was a real gentleman for them

I hope to have him assessed as a therapy dog next year

On the other hand i was helping a lady with her large naughty dog he jumped all over me snatched left bruises dow my legs mud all over me not enjoyable at all for me

on the other hand most epopel think of obedience as in trial work and a pet as being well trained

aww what a good boy he was and such a gentleman, i get a huge kick when people say to me how well behaved and how gentle and great my dog is. ok hes not fantastic at obedience( hes getting tehre) but i know he will be a well mannered dog, i have had so many comments from the instructors at club saying how proud they are of him and that he is very social and well mannered, with my breed i think its important because of the bsl crap etc.

[leopuppy04]

If someone said to you they do Obedience what do you think?

I think of competitive obedience. I call manners 'manners training'..... obedience training to me is sit/drop/stand/stay/heel etc.

'manners training' to me is: not pulling on lead/coming when called/not stealing off the table and general household manners suited to your lifestyle.

What is Obedience to you?

see above.

Do you think some Obedience people, fail to train there dog social manners, as there is no test for it?

Yeah there are always some that don't.... but what is your definition of social manners?

And does your Obedience dog have the best social manners that it could have??

definately - I have never really taught my dogs not to jump because it doesn't bother me..... but they know not to jump on others and when I tell them 'settle' to do so. We are refining it a little coz Leo has tried jumping on ANYBODY to see what happens and he usually gets attention ;)..... but I don't want them walking up to someone and planting their paws on them.... they may jump when commanded.

IMO - my dogs have excellent household manners - they won't beg at the table, won't take food unless told, won't come inside unless told, don't barge through doors and 'generally' don't pull on the lead (generally coz I have a 9mth old steam train coz she hasn't been for a walk in 3 weeks!).

For the record i think ALL dogs should have social manners before anything else .

By social manners i mean, not jumping on people, not stealing food, not bullying young kids etc

Sociallly accetable dogs in my wording/eyes.

I agree that all dogs should have social manners - otherwise they are not a joy to have around and take everywhere.

But keep in mind that your definition of good social manners may differ from someone else.

eg: My dogs have a fairly lenient jumping policy - when I get all excited with them, they can jump (unfortunately this carries over to other people too ) but they are not allowed to step one foot in the door unless given a command - which may not be the case at your place..... so social manners does vary.

Likewise - My form of LLW may be different to yours - yours may be for the dog to walk right beside you - mine might be for the dog to have the length of the lead on either side so long as they are not charging....

[leopuppy04]

I can guess that majority of the people that want socially acceptable dogs, will have kids.

I dissagree - everybody wants 'socially acceptable' dogs as you would want to take your dog everywhere with you and for it to be a pleasure.

For me - the difference would be - social acceptance in people without kids may be different to those with kids (eg: allowing dogs to jump etc)

ETA: To add to that - I think my dog has brilliant social manners - both are accredited therapy dogs.....

I don't have kids - yet I can easily (and did so on sunday)

*give my dog to a child to walk and know that my dog won't pull on the lead (given that he can see me otherwise he will pull to get back to me).

*readily let my dog approach children knowing that they won't jump or bowl them over - the most he will do is try and lick their face

*have children eat in front of him and know that they won't steal the food - even if the toddler drops it (Kinta is still in training, but will leave it 90% of the time).....

*know that they won't badger for food - Leo does a little, but he isn't too bad- he will sit infront of them, but if I call him back or tell him to leave it, he will.

The only people that my dogs really do jump on and badger for food are the ones that have REWARDED it - ie: patted the dogs for jumping or fed the dogs after they have jumped (mine can chain behaviours really well!) or are the ones that constantly feed them no matter what their behaviour is like!!! LOL. But that means that these people DONT mind..... my guys will rarely jump on others that don't inadvertently reward - with a bit of training on my part

Edited May 1, 2007 by leopuppy04

[SwaY]

For the record i think ALL dogs should have social manners before anything else .

By social manners i mean, not jumping on people, not stealing food, not bullying young kids etc

Sociallly accetable dogs in my wording/eyes.

I agree that all dogs should have social manners - otherwise they are not a joy to have around and take everywhere.

Yet your let your dogs jump on people.

My dogs have a fairly lenient jumping policy - when I get all excited with them, they can jump (unfortunately this carries over to other people too )

But keep in mind that your definition of good social manners may differ from someone else.

Agreed

eg: My dogs have a fairly lenient jumping policy - when I get all excited with them, they can jump (unfortunately this carries over to other people too ;)) but they are not allowed to step one foot in the door unless given a command - which may not be the case at your place..... so social manners does vary.

And that jumping imposes on others.

Your back door is not in public, that doesn't effect the general public.

Im talking about your dogs actions imposing on others. Not what they do at your house, or in your back yard.