Licking? *pic Added*

[MsDani]

I have a 4yo Female JR x and her licking is driving me mad.

She's not licking me, but my 15 month old nephew. My sister and I have just bought a house together and this is the first time my dogs have been around children this age fulltime.

I usually do a sharp and loud growl with my voice and she moves away only to go back and do the same thing again.

Do you have any suggestions on what I can do to get her stop it?? If it's not his face she's licking, it will be his hand or whatever body part her tongue can get to. Is she doing it because she is such a timid dog??

TIA

Edited April 4, 2007 by Goosey~Gander

[♪♫LMBC♫♪]

You're doing the right thing with the growling, but if you're not already, you need to praise her as soon as she backs off.

Have some treats or toys handy and as soon as she leaves bub alone, reward her with a play or treat. Its basically about distraction, and teaching her that there are more interesting things to do than lick the baby.

Failing this, you could try putting something yucky tasting on the baby's feet/hands/wherever. This could make the lickign not so fun. Most dogs don't like the taste of anything citrus, so maybe some lemon juice could work. Obviously, you wouldn't want to put it on baby's face in case it gets in his eyes. The only problem here is that we are talking about a baby, rather than an object, so you are limited as far as deterents go. If it was chewing the furnature you could easily apply a commercial deterent, but obviously you can't really do this with a baby.

I think at this point the growl/distact thing is the go. Just make sure you are consistant, don't reprimand sometimes and not other times.

As far as why she is doing it, maybe she is just feeling maternal and is trying to do to him what she would do to her pups. Or it could be that it is just all new to her and she doesn't quite know how to react.

Good luck

[Cosmolo]

Does the dog lick at every interaction with the child? If so, you need to be careful with the corrections your giving because the dog may begin to think that every time the child is interacting with him, he gets in trouble. Set up the interaction on lead if its that reliable so that you can give an effective correction but then keep the dog near the child with lots of rewards so that he understands what the correction is for- not the child, the licking.

[MsDani]

Cosmolo - that's what I'm really worried about. She does it everytime she goes near him. Yesterday when she went to go lick him, I told her to sit, but then my nephew would reach out his hand and she'd start licking like crazy again.

So not only was I telling the dog to stop, but I have to tell my nephew to as well. I'm worried that I'll push them apart and they will be to scared to interact with one another.

It's driving me barmey!!

[BC]

Dont know if this is the case, but I did read that licking is a sign of submission ??

Just thought I would add that in.

One of my dogs is a real licker, his tongue just jumps out of no where before you even know it.

I always told my dog off, but instead of just growling anything, I always used the same thing. Not very imaginative but I would always growl, "No licking". Once he stopped I would then reward him.

I think that if you are just saying "no", the dog could take this as, no I cant be near you, no I cant cuddle you etc etc as NO is very general and then he may think that it is a bad thing to be near the baby.

I find that now when I say no licking, he knows its OK to be near me, or cuddle me etc, but he knows not to lick.

It does take a while though and occasionally my dog will still sneak a wet one in but I have found this has worked for me.

Good luck.

[MsDani]

Here is the Pic of the Three of them. My nephew, AJ (Male Tan & White) and the licker Nikki (Female Brown)

I don't know if I'm doing this right, but I don't discourage my nephew from feeding the dogs biscuits. ATM he's at the age where he is putting everything in his mouth. One for you, and You and one for me, kinda thing.

Because of this, I will wait until he is out of this stage before I let him start feeding them their main meal of chicken necks, don't know about you, but the thought of my nephew trying out the chicken necks makes me a little lol

Should I be discouraging it??

BC Lover: thanks for that. When I tell her no, I actually say 'No Kisses'. Nikki is completely different dog compared to AJ. AJ only has to be taught something a couple of times before he gets the hang of it. Nikki, Well......... She's gorgeous, but a little dopey sometimes LOL

Edited April 4, 2007 by Goosey~Gander

[BC]

No kisses is a good one too. Just as long as the dog can distinguish between and general NO and a NO, not to do a particular act. Picture is cute

It does take a while, well it did with mine. He is not silly (very clever actually), but a very happy and energetic dog. He just gets so excited when he sees people and loves giving them a big smooch on the face. It can be frustrating

[MsDani]

Oh just wanted to add on the feeding side of it. I also have two older nephews as well. I get them to feed the dogs their main meal, but Nikki won't go near the food until I encourage her over.

Usually when I feed them, she will only start eating once she see's that AJ is eating his. Is that because AJ is the dominant dog??

But won't touch hers, even if AJ is eating, if the boys do the feed!

[BC]

Oh just wanted to add on the feeding side of it. I also have two older nephews as well. I get them to feed the dogs their main meal, but Nikki won't go near the food until I encourage her over.

Usually when I feed them, she will only start eating once she see's that AJ is eating his. Is that because AJ is the dominant dog??

But won't touch hers, even if AJ is eating, if the boys do the feed!

Have you ever taught her to refuse food ?? Nikki might think she is doing something wrong as this is like accepting food from someone else, even though it is her dinner. I have never taugh my dog this but if someone else gives him a treat he wont eat it, but if I pick up the same peice he will then take it. Not 100% sure why they do this. Another member may be able to advise you much better than myself on this one.

I think in a wild dog pack the alpha will always eat first, I think, so this is maybe why so wont eat until she sees AJ eating.

[MsDani]

BC Lover - No I didn't teach her to refuse food. She will accept food from anyone if it's handed to her. She just does it when it's on her plate! Does that make sense??

Edited to add: I think I need to explain something so that you are better able to know how Nikki is! My XH was very heavy handed with her, actually with both the dogs. We had major agruments about it, I thought he finally realised that a dog doesn't need to be treated this way, until I found out that he was actually doing it when I wasn't home. Both a completely different vent.

So now when I growl at Nikki, she will actually roll over and expose her stomach and it breaks my heart. So basically I've got to teach her, somehow, that what she is doing is wrong and not to do it, but also at the same time, let her no that I am not going to hit her!! Does that make sense??

Edited April 4, 2007 by Goosey~Gander

[Steve K9Pro]

K9: In the pic supplied, the dog is either eating from the hand of the child or the dog is looking for food there.

This in itself is rewarding, dogs learn behaviours in three steps, experiment - gain success - make it a habit.

As the dog is going to the child it is in the third stage, it is making it a habit or it already is a habit.

By growling your desensitizing your dog to your growl, taking the aversive out of it, this needs to stop or you will have no way to communicate your feelings to your dog.

I would recommend that you crate train the dog, this will teach the dog that it can be around the child without interacting with the child & vice versa.

If you are not keen on that idea, I would suggest that you teach the dog it must stay in its place when the child is around so again, they can learn interaction skills.

The crate is by far the best option as it will prevent the child going to the dog also.

[Stitch]

Correction, whether it is by saying 'ahh' or if you need to growl 'no', whatever you say, is designed with a particular dog in mind. Some dogs need a really strong voice correction and others only need a quiet word. From what you describe the quiet ahh may be the most appropriate for a soft dog.

The most important thing is the light, happy, reward voice after the behaviour has been interrupted ie 'YES' in a really HAPPY, highpitched laughing voice. Then give the dog a treat immediately.

The tone of the reward voice is really, really important! :D

[Steve K9Pro]

Correction, whether it is by saying 'ahh' or if you need to growl 'no', whatever you say, is designed with a particular dog in mind. Some dogs need a really strong voice correction and others only need a quiet word. From what you describe the quiet ahh may be the most appropriate for a soft dog.

The most important thing is the light, happy, reward voice after the behaviour has been interrupted ie 'YES' in a really HAPPY, highpitched laughing voice. Then give the dog a treat immediately.

The tone of the reward voice is really, really important! :D

K9: The reward tone is very important, but only to a dog that is pack driven & is respectful of the handler...

Something you need to be aware of is that, the reward you offer to a dog must be rewarding to the dog...

Edited April 4, 2007 by K9 Force

[Arya]

Gorgeous pic!!! :D I personally wouldn't let your nephew feed the dog, even though both dogs are happy to have him around the food bowl. I just wouldn't go there with a child this young and the dogs feeding, no matter how good they are. Limit interaction until both nephew and dog know the ground rules. I would teach your nephew now that the dog's behaviour is not acceptable. I know he's only a little tacker but the younger you teach kids how to behave with animals the better, imho. And yep, crate the dog or get him to sit in his place, if you have trained him to go to his place. I have a mat for my dog and it's 'on your mat', then a reward so the mat is a pleasant spot to be, not a punishment if you get what I mean. Mat needs to be in a 'good' place in the house in the dog's mind though. Somewhere he can see what is going on, not out of the way. That pic is so cute though!

[Tangwyn]

I agree with K9Force. As soon as I saw the pic I got the feeling the dog is licking food off the child's hand. Given the seemingly endless sticky nature of my nieces' hands when they visit I would assume that any dog would find them enticing. If the dog has been re-inforced by finding some tasty treat smeared on those fingers it will be a difficult habit to break. Even worse is that a variable reward is most re-inforcing so even the occasional reward from those hands (or other part of the body) means the behaviour goes on.

Exclusion from the area of the child may be the only answer at the stage. Very tricky...

[MsDani]

First off I would like to Thank each and everyone of you for taking the time to reply to my post.

In the pic, my nephew actually has a biccie in his hand.

ATM When Nikki starts to lick, I say 'Ahh' and make her come sit next to me. On Sunday morning when she first saw him, she gave him a couple of licks, but after about 10 mins she would just go and stand next to him. But then Monday, we had to start all over again.

Also another thing I have picked up on is that she is becoming very protective of my nephew. Which suprises me as I thought it would have been AJ, being the male and dominate dog and Nikki being the timid one.

Eg. My nephew took a step back and accidently trod on AJ's paw, which made him yelp. Next thing I know is that it was on for young and old with Nikki and AJ. There were no injuries or anything, but I could tell that Nikki was not happy at all. Then when AJ went to go near nephew again, Nikki would place herself in between AJ and my nephew!!

The only time I've ever seen them behave like this is when they have been play fighting and one of them has accidently gotten hurt. It's like they are warning the other one that they are definately not happy about it.

Is that because Nikki, being female, is 'mothering' my nephew?? She's never had a litter.