JimmyTheHuman Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Hi there, we have a 5 months old Kelpie called Jax - woohoo He is ace, we can walk in the reserve nearvy for 5kms and he will walk near us exploring, come when called 85% of the time, generally just perfect behaviour, although he always walks in front of us (myself, wife and 2 kids). If he is on the lead he pulls on the lead, like pulling me along (i am 100kgs hence all the walking) and pulls as hard as possibly can, clawing the ground if you slow down. If i stop walking as he pulls he will sit, then immedietely take off pulling as hard as he can again. He started off fine when we first got him - if he pulled i would stop when he sat we would take off again walk niceley for a while and then start pulling again. Now its almost impossible to walk him on the lead. I have read books that suggest all kinds of different things but nothing has helped so far. All of this pulling is infinitely worse if we have the kids on thier bikes riding in front, but it happens when they are all behind me as well. We have a regular collar and lead - no choker or anything. We are going to start odedience school, but probably not for a couple of months, after we move house. Whats the secret to getting him to walk nicely on the lead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pitchick Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Hi Jimmy I too have a dog that pulls like mad on lead. I have been to visit Steve from K9 force (also a member of DOL) and with the use of a special collar and training advice I can now walk Max without him pulling (I can actually hold the lead with 1 finger). Although we are still only in the early stages it is so much more pleasurable to walk him. I dont know where you are situated, but maybe you need to see someone about it as soon as possible to nip it in the bud now. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOE Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Get a Canny collar works like a halti but it is a collar with a martingale type halti attached. Excellent: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonymc Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Jimmy,without realising it People teach dogs to pull.Dogs want to get out and see whats about.You see People walking along with a Dog madly pulling on the Leash and bracing against the Dog.Constant bracing against the Dog,gives him something to pull against.These People are teaching the Dog that inorder to get somewhere he must pull.The Dog in these cases learns that he pulls and he gets to where he wants to go. We need to teach the Dog,that he can still get to where he is going, by leaving the Lead slack.Try this Jimmy,but it may take time and patience.I would while trying this approach take him out by himself and no Children on Bikes to excite or distract.Start off and as soon as he pulls,completely stop yourself and remain stationery.He will pull against you of course as that is what he has learnt.Stand there still and sooner or later he will either look back at you or move slightly back towards you.As soon as he does that the lead will slacken of course.The moment the Lead slackens,Praise him alot.When the Lead is slack then head off again.As soon as he starts to pull,repeat the above procedure of standing still,till he gives you a slack lead.This is not a quick fix and will require consistency and patience. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noisymina Posted March 13, 2007 Share Posted March 13, 2007 Our Dobe had been pulling like a locomotive for 4 years before we got her. She doesn't now. Lots of time and patience, no progress for pulling and sessions where I would simply stop and go the other way when she pulled - and often when she did not as well - seemed to help too. That way, she never knew when we were going to change direction and would stay closer to me. OK - so we are not going to win any comps on it even now, but a 32kg dog pulling a 55kg lady was just not on. At least I can comfortably take her out to the vets etc and feel quite confident doing so. There is little pulling and I have found she will often come with me if I use my voice to get her attention rather than a pull on the lead. I did stop using the check chain for a while - but a particular incident in a vets waiting room once (not her fault) has convinced me that it is wise to keep using it for safety reasons - as she is an expert collar slipper. She didn't actually slip it that time, but she could have - so it served as a lesson to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyTheHuman Posted March 13, 2007 Author Share Posted March 13, 2007 We need to teach the Dog,that he can still get to where he is going, by leaving the Lead slack.Try this Jimmy,but it may take time and patience.I would while trying this approach take him out by himself and no Children on Bikes to excite or distract.Start off and as soon as he pulls,completely stop yourself and remain stationery.He will pull against you of course as that is what he has learnt.Stand there still and sooner or later he will either look back at you or move slightly back towards you.As soon as he does that the lead will slacken of course.The moment the Lead slackens,Praise him alot.When the Lead is slack then head off again.As soon as he starts to pull,repeat the above procedure of standing still,till he gives you a slack lead.This is not a quick fix and will require consistency and patience. Tony I have done this, almost exactly, 5 days a week for 2 weeks. I walk, he pulls i stop, he sits, as we take off i say good boy and then he starts to pull really hard and we repeat. At first it worked, now it doesnt. I have read a book that says issue "corrections" a short sharp yank of the lead - but this doesnt feel right, its hard to imagine it having a postive effect. How old should he be before starting obed school? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReXy Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 imo you should start him NOW why wait till he is older and it just becomes a habit to him , i know time is hard , i have 4 kids myself try using food as a lure hold it at his nose height by yourside, continue feeding him while he is at your side lure him there, stop when he moves ahead lure him back there. he will soon learn that it is a good place to be, i have used with success the infin8 halter type. more like a martingale collar with great success. i know it dosnt fix it , but sure makes it a lot easier and you can work them off it. you can get all the advice here and very good advice from experienced trainers etc,, but IMO you need to get to an obedience club, they are there to help and show you, he will pick it up quickly , i wish you would come down to the club,, your not to far away and we could catch up on that drink hahaha joking, otherwise how is he going does he love his kennel? how is everything else with him, id love to meet him.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 How old should he be before starting obed school? He is old enough now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 I have done this, almost exactly, 5 days a week for 2 weeks. I walk, he pulls i stop, he sits, as we take off i say good boy and then he starts to pull really hard and we repeat. At first it worked, now it doesnt. On general walks I've been doing this with Ed, but instead of him sitting, I make him come back to my side, otherwise I am teaching him that I will come to him so he is still ahead And maybe if you want to use food when he does come back to you, then give him the food and start off again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReXy Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 exactly shoey, also try the find heel excersise, remys getting to know it real well. most times..lol as i said use food/treats to lure him back into position thats the best place to be !!.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 5 months old.. 5 km walks.. Jimmy have you ever considered you might be overdoing it with so young a pup? The ideal time to start dog school was 3 months ago.. the longer you wait, the worse this behaviour will get and he's only going to get bigger and stronger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 Rex, yep find heel is great for heeling, Jimmy, this is basically just praising or click/treating when the dog is in the right position For general walks I don't care if he's in heel position as long as the leads loose, but if he pulls and I have to stop its back to me again 5km is a very long walk for a 5 month old though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReXy Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 5 ks.. ohh i didnt see tht part. definatley to much for a young pup. id cocentrate on very short walks 5 mins even and getting his lead manners right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TangerineDream Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 The method that I have used with the last few pups and it works a treat.... pup on lead, start walking silently with your hands both clasped with the lead against your chest...and don't move them., dog rushes ahead, you turn silently and head off in other direction, pup comes to end of lead, discovers that you aren't there about turns and rushes past you again, again, silently, about turn and walk in opposite direction - etc etc etc.........you will most likley get dizzy the first few times you try, but they learn very qiuickly, without you having to correct them, that if they rush past to the end of the lead, you will disappear, and they start to both keep an eye on you (always a good thing) and also to stop pulling because they realise that if they pull you disappear and they have to change direction because they get to the end of the lead and that in itself is a correction.... If pup decides to get creative (which they do during this process) and tries to go around you or wrap you up in the lead, stop for 20 seconds, say nothing, then turn around in the way you have to to untangle yourself without using your hands and off you go again...if it happens again, stop wordlessly, wait then untangle and set off again .... it's a great method... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted March 14, 2007 Share Posted March 14, 2007 (edited) I'd be heading back to the backyard and teaching your dog to actually react to the heel command. I personaly don't find the 'stop' process works fantastic or perhaps I like to see results faster but we use the turn method, so as soon as the dogs shoulder goes past my leg, I say "Heel" and turn in the opposite direction and we keep doing this until the dog is responding. Make sure you give the command just before you turn so the dog can actually associate the command. Good Luck! Edited March 14, 2007 by sas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedStafford Posted March 15, 2007 Share Posted March 15, 2007 I'd be heading back to the backyard I dont have lots of dog experience, but with my pup working at walking in the backyard didnt help her, she would not easily walk on lead in the yard... go out the front or to a park etc, and presto no problems at all... so I don't necesarily agree that the 'backyard' is always the best place. I would take her somewhere quiet with as little distraction as possible and concentrate on periods of no longer than 5 mins to start with. Also reward (treats and praise) her as quickly as you can when she's on the slack leash - even if its every pace or 2 to begin with... (get some real yummy treat for her that can be eaten quickly so it doesn't cause her to stop walking and chew... like cheese or little bits of meat) Combine the treating with stopping once the lead is tight and it shouldn't take long for her to realise, walking and getting treats is far more fun than stopping. At the moment my staffy pup is quite good on the lead - its early days for her though but I am determined not to have a puller, otherwise my OH and son will not be able to walk her... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neomommytas Posted March 15, 2007 Share Posted March 15, 2007 The method that I have used with the last few pups and it works a treat....pup on lead, start walking silently with your hands both clasped with the lead against your chest...and don't move them., dog rushes ahead, you turn silently and head off in other direction, pup comes to end of lead, discovers that you aren't there about turns and rushes past you again, again, silently, about turn and walk in opposite direction - etc etc etc.........you will most likley get dizzy the first few times you try, but they learn very qiuickly, without you having to correct them, that if they rush past to the end of the lead, you will disappear, and they start to both keep an eye on you (always a good thing) and also to stop pulling because they realise that if they pull you disappear and they have to change direction because they get to the end of the lead and that in itself is a correction.... If pup decides to get creative (which they do during this process) and tries to go around you or wrap you up in the lead, stop for 20 seconds, say nothing, then turn around in the way you have to to untangle yourself without using your hands and off you go again...if it happens again, stop wordlessly, wait then untangle and set off again .... it's a great method... I'd give this a try. Many people I know have had get results with this method. My dad used it with his 4 Rotties, and now his Mastiff. I haven't tried it yet, as my Dobie walks beside me because he's so tall I normally have the lead wrapped around my hand so it's close to his collar. Sometimes depending where we are I can hold his collar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyTheHuman Posted March 18, 2007 Author Share Posted March 18, 2007 (edited) Rather than having a crack and trying to work it out from tips, i am going to go to obed school - will book in this week. Hastings is pretty far, probably do something a little closer to home. The kennel is awesome thanks, had some comments on it tonight actually. He has only just started to use it this week, i think the nice weather has home sleeping outside. 5km is a bit of exaggeration. Probably more like 3 or 4 and its off the lead and in bush tracks, he LOVES it. He's hardly even worn out. Its all at walking pace, my 4yo son can do it. We do it once a week at most, rest of the week is just around the block. He is very good at sit, and will stay if food is involved for ages until released. He is goo at leave it, and on yer bed, but come varies depending on distractions. Its the pulling that is the only big problem. As discussed i get straight off to obed school this week. Edited March 18, 2007 by JimmyTheHuman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffy and macca Posted March 18, 2007 Share Posted March 18, 2007 Hi Jimmy.....Thought i'd add my two cents worth..You have a kelpie ,which as you know are bred to work. he , is full of energy and is naturally inquisitive. I have 2 collies one is ok on lead the other pulls till he is almost choking himself. i tried the repetition , but no good with this determined boy. i purchased a"sporn halter" rudducks make them, from the pet shop. this halter , when he pulls applies pressure to his pressuren point between his shoulders at the back of the neck. He only pulled a couple of times and now walks happily beside me no fuss and enjoys his walk. Sounds drastic , but it works on macca , and did not squeal or yelp in pain when he pulls on this halter. When it's timme for his walk he runs to get his lead and halter !!!! Obedience will give both the dog and you the guidence you are seeking. Good luck , you are obviously doing well with him as you have overcome his other problems when walking him. the main thing is you have not given up and are looking out for the dogs best interest.!! I am certainly no dog expert, but am happy to pass on what orks for my dog and me. you guys will find what works for you so good luck with it all. Let us know how you go...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReXy Posted March 19, 2007 Share Posted March 19, 2007 sounds good jimmy. all the very best for you both, thats great he is getting the other commands he will learn quick, just time patients and perserverance.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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