Do Dogs Love?

[Flames_Daddy]

Do dogs "love" us?

Interested in opinions, thanks

I guess the true answer is - we don't know because we're not dogs, we can only assume until proven otherwise...however we can take into consideration some of the findings in the last 50-100 years.

The whole 'humanising a dog' thing really annoys me, it's almost like the 'dominance' thing....it gets overused and taken out of context far too often. I certainly do not feel that dogs should be treated as humans because clearly they're not as they have their own langage, they're own social workings and way of life, but there is no way a person can say with scentific evidence that a dog does not have emotions....they very well may not be the same as ours or are experienced to the same that ours are, however scientific clinical trials have shown that dogs are capable of complex thinking....complex thinking can very well include emotion/s.

I think 'Guilt' is one the emotions a lot of owners believe their dogs feel, however we can now tell you why your dogs cowers or gives you a look that is percieved as guilt.

However, emotions are many, does a dog feel Pain? Grief? Pleasure? Anger? Some would say of-course.....others would say you're humansing......those are the ones that bug me because science already tells us that animals feel pain, they feel anger, they feel pleasure, and in scientific clinical trials into behaviour, scientists were convinced that grief was also felt....the level of such an emotion is however unknown....we can't know...we're a different species.

HOWEVER.....how could we possibly admit that a dog is capable of feeling emotions as deep as humans do because then we are faced with so many ethical and moral issues.....

We've learned a great deal in the last 100 years, you would be horrified to learn (if you weren't already aware) that some of the most respected behaviourists back in the black and white days believed that dogs felt no pain, they we're simply giving off mechincal type reactions similar to that of a clock, for example if a clock fell from a wall and hit to floor you'd hear the inner workings of the clock clanger about, this is what the behaviourists way back when believed happened to a dog when you kicked etc......so therefore giving a dog a good old kick wasn't an issue because they felt no pain.....was this a way of justifying how poorly some dogs were treated back then?

Hey SAS that was truly an excellent piece of writing. Thank you so much for that. Your concepts are reminiscent of the writings of Stanley Coren and the Mexican "Dog Whisperer" (sorry forget his name). Bottom Line, treat animals like you would have them treat you. And just a quick question... how many of us bipeds enjoys being "trained" and treated like a dummy? Any hands up? Yeah, thought not. I'm off now to get some emotional honesty and the leash won't be needed.

[R00]

QUOTE(Terrorbull @ 24th Feb 2007 - 08:38 PM)

QUOTE(shoemonster @ 24th Feb 2007 - 04:07 PM)

Yes I have post before I read disease, which results in me posting crap that doesn't make sense

I will leave this alone now, as I'm sure I've made myself look like a big enough dickhead

Lets see if i can put my foot in it

does your dog do things for you because they love you, or because they get something out of it?

i believe we were talking about training with food, and someone said they dont use treads, that their dog does it because it wants to be with them, and loves them (did i get that wrong? it was early this morning i read it!)

so does your dog sit when asked, because it loves you, or because it knows it is going to get something - be that a treat, praise, a pat or whatever it is?

Thanks TB, that's how the conversation came up before I went brain dead and lost it!

I think you are referring to my post when I wrote that I don't use treats when I train my dog, because in my opinion I get different kind of responses.

It was my subsequent post where I stated that dogs do love their masters.

Please read my postings in the Stafford thread, I believe I have been paraphrased incorrectly. My point however remains.

[shoemonster]

Roo, it wasn't you that said it

[jbbb]

i dont know about that Jbbb - what about someone who loves a person who doenst love them? they get nothing out of that that could be called rewarding?

TB, I believe that would be explained as follows:

The rejection reinforces their negative self-image, therefore confirming what they already believe about themselves. As such, they are getting something out of it.... (just because it's not positive doesnt mean they dont get something out of it).

Okay, enough double negatives. I dont agree with it, but it's interesting to think about....

[Teebs]

Yes I have post before I read disease, which results in me posting crap that doesn't make sense

I will leave this alone now, as I'm sure I've made myself look like a big enough dickhead :D

Lets see if i can put my foot in it

does your dog do things for you because they love you, or because they get something out of it?

i believe we were talking about training with food, and someone said they dont use treads, that their dog does it because it wants to be with them, and loves them (did i get that wrong? it was early this morning i read it!)

so does your dog sit when asked, because it loves you, or because it knows it is going to get something - be that a treat, praise, a pat or whatever it is?

Thanks TB, that's how the conversation came up before I went brain dead and lost it!

thought that is what you ment ;)

i dont know about that Jbbb - what about someone who loves a person who doenst love them? they get nothing out of that that could be called rewarding?

TB, I believe that would be explained as follows:

The rejection reinforces their negative self-image, therefore confirming what they already believe about themselves. As such, they are getting something out of it.... (just because it's not positive doesnt mean they dont get something out of it).

Okay, enough double negatives. I dont agree with it, but it's interesting to think about....

Very interesting - too much for my small brain!

[damper]

Edited

Edited April 4, 2007 by damper

[sas]

Your concepts are reminiscent of the writings of Stanley Coren and the Mexican "Dog Whisperer" (sorry forget his name). Bottom Line, treat animals like you would have them treat you. And just a quick question... how many of us bipeds enjoys being "trained" and treated like a dummy? Any hands up? Yeah, thought not. I'm off now to get some emotional honesty and the leash won't be needed.

I have a great amount of respect for Stanley Coran, not only does he have a different way of thinking from some of todays (and very old fashioned) behaviourists but he backs it up with science.

Mexican Dog Whisperer is Ceaser Milan, he has some interesting concepts as well....he's more along the lines of exhaust a dog until it can do no wrong