cavNrott Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 (edited) . Edited June 7, 2009 by cavNrott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 edited post due to receiving hundreds of abusive and threatening emails Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teebs Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 (edited) Hello everyone! My name is Melissa, I'm Chewy's trainer, and as requested by many of you, here is my side of this rather interesting debate. By the way, I'm posting under my partner's username as he's never used it lol and mine was going to take too long to get back, and I had this afternoon free so I wanted to get this sorted out quickly! hmm Laron 23rd Feb 2007 - 02:15 PM Post #91 Forum Member Posts: 1 Joined: 22/2/2007 Member No.: 15,414 -------- joined yesterday Edited February 23, 2007 by Terrorbull Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 I commend you, for your post Melissa. From a personal view, the only positively trained dogs I have ever seen, who have obtained high standards, are owned by SARDOG, who posts on DOL from time to time. Heck, even guide dogs for the blind are trained, by methods which would be considered non positive by some. All the same corrections, need GENERALLY, to be conditioned. The dogs have to know, how to change their behaviour, to escape/avoid such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haven Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Hello everyone! My name is Melissa, I'm Chewy's trainer, and as requested by many of you, here is my side of this rather interesting debate. By the way, I'm posting under my partner's username as he's never used it lol and mine was going to take too long to get back, and I had this afternoon free so I wanted to get this sorted out quickly! hmm Laron 23rd Feb 2007 - 02:15 PM Post #91 Forum Member Posts: 1 Joined: 22/2/2007 Member No.: 15,414 -------- joined yesterday Yes I noticed that too, but it could be that her partner created the account when alerted to the discussion on the forum. Not sure about the "mine was going to take too long to get back" comment. As far as I understand profiles don't get deleted unless they are banned or ask to be de-registered for some reason. Hmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MolassesLass Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Haven, I think Troy has to approve all registrations these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haven Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Haven, I think Troy has to approve all registrations these days. Yes but Laron started that she was using her partners username because "hers would take to long to get back" which sound like it means that she was previously a member but had been de-registered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andoria1 Posted February 23, 2007 Author Share Posted February 23, 2007 (edited) tramissa " I do wish you could view the post that started all of this. It was about kicking the dog down the stairs to land on its back, slamming the dog in a door and performing a very aggressive alpha roll on the dog. Certainly not what you, nor Chris, have described. " "Perhaps if the truth was given in the first place, instead of a mess of exaggeration and mistruths, none of this would have occurred." Haven "She said you were rough on the dog, sat on it, pushed it down the stairs, slammed the door on it etc etc." What a load of crap did you actually read my first post? I never did say she kicked the dog down the stairs, i never said she sat on the dog and i never said she slammed the door on the dog. Maybe you should post exactly what i wrote instead of posting crap that both of you make up. That was not my post that started this, so dont state it as it was. I think you guys are exaggerating it a bit ? Edited February 23, 2007 by Andoria1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 What a farce this is becoming....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Does it matter? Did not her partner post in general? But then again.......I would like to know ALL Melissa's business. Melissa what did you have for breakfast, on 1st January 1992. Strike me nelly!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andoria1 Posted February 23, 2007 Author Share Posted February 23, 2007 I just dont like it when people make things up as they go along and then state it as fact. Thats all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haven Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 I think you guys are exaggerating it a bit ? I just dont like it when people make things up as they go along and then state it as fact. Thats all. Now that is just so ironc it's just ludicrous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andoria1 Posted February 23, 2007 Author Share Posted February 23, 2007 the post was my interpretation of the training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 AndoriaI, I suggest, time out. Take a deep breath, settle down. After all its Friday afternoon. Mere humans make mistakes. Heck, just visit any obedience club, any weekend, and see confused dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leopuppy04 Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 I commend you, for your post Melissa. From a personal view, the only positively trained dogs I have ever seen, who have obtained high standards, are owned by SARDOG, who posts on DOL from time to time. Heck, even guide dogs for the blind are trained, by methods which would be considered non positive by some. All the same corrections, need GENERALLY, to be conditioned. The dogs have to know, how to change their behaviour, to escape/avoid such. I agree ( well not about SARDOG coz to my knowledge i've never seen them work ). No child or animal can ever be completely trustworthy and what we call 'well behaved' without ever hearing the word 'no'. There is 'positive training' and then there is 'positive training'.... we just need to find a balance between praise and 'correction'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 I'm not going to have a go at Laron.. I don't agree with all of her training methods but show me two dog trainers and I'll show you a debate about that. I'll give you this Laron.. you've got guts coming on here to explain yourself and I'm glad you did. Seems to me that both DOL and you have been misrepresented to one another by the common demoninator in all of this. Andoria it seems to me that you owe your trainer an apology.. you really did exaggerate what happened. Then there are those 100's of abusive emails you told us Laron received... Lablover I don't know too many "purely positive" trainers but I do know a lot that use positive reinforcement AND some corrections. The two are not incompatible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 PF, I agree, the two are not incompatible. I tell you, my US import, needs certain tune ups, from want of a better term, from time to time. EEEEECCK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Lablover I don't hold with harsh physical corrections but I do find that voice corrections are very effective for some things. Indeed, I think voice is probably the best training aid we have for many things. Problem with getting "hands on" with a dog to correct placement, position etc is that it's a tough habit to break and completely useless if the dog isn't next to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 (edited) Andoria it seems to me that you owe your trainer an apology.. you really did exaggerate what happened. Then there are those 100's of abusive emails you told us Laron received... Absolutely. AND a full apology to all the members of DOL who came to your assistance with their support and suggestions - all based on your very exaggerated version of the sequence of events. Wasted a lot of time and energy, all due to the concern you raised because of personal embelishments to the truth. Your dislike of exaggerated truths is mirrored here and I am somewhat non-plussed and befuddled that you are seemingly unable to identify your own hypocrasy. What I'm curious about is, if the "method" used was calm and non-stressful, how come (according to Andoria) this led to the dog not allowing the owners near it and/or to touch its collar ..... even after 3 days beyond the "technique" being applied. I'd also appreciate clarification on the description of "biting". Is this a more forceful version of "mouthing" with a view to becoming/being dominant, or has it actually escalated to aggression and is it based in dominance or fear? I too applaude you for being courageous enough to join the forum and speak with us, Melissa. Not knowing what response you would receive, I imagine it would have been considerably nerve wracking. Like the others, I think you have some room to learn in more detail the advantages or disadvantages of various training aids (including the ones you mention). I don't believe you would be doing your skill any service by precluding them without knowing and understanding how they work when properly applied. Edited February 23, 2007 by Erny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Oh .... and Melissa. If you are reading and if you do feel inclined to re-visit, would you PLEASE satisfy at least one more query. The OP continuously refers to your technique as the "Destraint" technique. The rest of us here on DOL are thinking she means to say "Restraint". Kindly confirm. It will serve to put some debate to rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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