Ladders For Back Leg Work

[shoemonster]

Has anyone used ladders to increase back end awareness in their dogs?

I started tonight, just getting them to run up and down on the ladder

My reason is that they tend to be unaware of their back legs, when jumping etc

At the start I just guided them over the ladder and their feet went all over the place, tripping over, but after a few times they started to be more careful with where their feet went

Is there anything else I should be doing or will just walking up and down the ladder help?

I guess as they become more careful i can get them going faster

Oh when I say ladder, I mean a ladder laid down on the ground, not in the air! lol

I took a video today, of the 2 of them going over it! When doing the training I don't normally work with both, I normally do one at a time

Just ignore my big bum at the start too!

[Erny]

I have heard of this being done before. It is similar to cavelleti grid work with horses, which is what I did when teaching my horse to jump. It brings their brain down to their feet. In fact, most of the successful and worthwhile 'jumping' training I did with my horse was with the cavalleti.

Don't over-do it though, as it can be pretty tough work.

Edited February 15, 2007 by Erny

[sas]

Yep, I've heard of it being done.

I think it's so cute how they follow each other over!

[shoemonster]

hehe it was really cute! They seemed to pick up the gist of it pretty quickly too

I might just do a few times over every day, so its not too many times for their little legs!

I laugh in the video too cos at the moment you can hear their nails hitting the back of the rungs, and it makes a clanging sound

[m-j]

Hi

I have also used car/truck tyres laid flat on the ground spaced evenly at first, then I spread them out unevenly, then I rest them on their side on each other, initially the tyres are close so that it is easier for the dog then I spread them out. This worked well for my Dobe who I'm sure was totally unaware he had a back end. Another suggestion is walking along a plank that is raised a foot or so off the ground with different articles of varying heights and distances apart so the dog has to negotiate them. Morgan Spector (Ckicker Training for Obedience) also suggests a body wrap, I have never tried it so have no idea how good this is.

hth

cheers

M-J

If you are interested in spreading tyres around in your back yard I will try to con OH into taking a photo this evening so you can see what I mean, as my expanation isn't very clear

[shoemonster]

Oh yeah I think I know what you mean, would love to see pics anyway!

I wonder if tyres would be too tall for little stafford legs?

What's a body wrap? Will have to look that one up

They are pretty good on the walk at agility, unless they are too excited, then can soemtimes miss a back foot, we are only learning and I worry about their whole back end co ordination with that!

Ohhhh light bulb moment, walk with objects on it so they have to step over them, good idea

[shoemonster]

Just googled clicker training body wrap and have come up with a few interesting sites

and this one mentions body wraps and hair ties on ankles to increase foot awareness as well

http://www.canineuniversity.com/articles/h.../health_20.html

This one is the karen pryor stuff and says body wrap is different, it is the lead being wrapped around the bosy

"Body wrap: You take a 6-8 foot leash hooked to a martingale type collar with the snapped hooked to the "D" ring and with this up on at the back of the dogs neck (not under the dogs chin) and then loop the leash behind and under the front legs and then under and around the barrel of the dog and then feed the end of the lead back though the loop of the martingale collar. So you now have a pulley system around the dogs middle. "

http://www.clickertraining.com/node/545

Also found black dog ankle wraps for co ordination, this kind of thing could be good too, I might try to make something up

They would only go on the back feet wouldn't they?

Edited February 16, 2007 by shoemonster

[NaturallyWild]

All of this type of work is covered in t-touch work (by Linda Tellington-Jones). Body wraps, various forms of cavaletti and maze work, etc. All great stuff to create self awareness of limbs and muscles within your dog.

If you have the materials at home try setting up lengths of wooden dowel (or ant other substitute) at slightly differing heights, spacings and directional changes.

The other thing i find useful in increasing the back end awareness is teaching them to walk backwards.

[shoemonster]

Oh cool, we have started working on backing at freestyle

Thanks!

[haven]

Oh you mean like trotting poles, I get it.

Haven't done them with my two, but I have done the body bandage thing on Loki. I don't know if it's the same as those mentioned above, I just tried it out because it used to work well on the horses. Never really saw any benefits on Loki though.

[Mrsdog]

Thanks Shoemonster, that is really interesting.

Gives me something else to try - need another day in my week.

Noels.

[ReXy]

another thing that an instructor told me for back end awareness is just to shuffle around and ask them to find "heel" position.. do a step forward and then a 90 deg turn get the dog to swing bum around back in the heel position,, keep doing it so you kind of walk in a square shape, if you get what i mean..lol apart from practising the heel position, it makes them aware of their back end..

good vid they are so cute

[shoemonster]

Ed will go into heel like that but he still has no idea that his back legs are attached!

Gives me something else to try - need another day in my week.

I feel exactly the same! Though one less day work, trainign instead would be good too!

[helen]

I have done this with Chazer as part of an agility foundation course. He also had little/no back end awareness, I think I can see some improvement though. The things the instructors said to me that helped were to lure him with his head low and not to go too fast.

[Kavik]

I've only tried this once with Kaos - he was keen on getting the treat and paid no attention to the ladder! He tended to jump over it side to side. But that was a while ago, he is a bit older now so I will try it again. I think they have a ladder that would be ideal at training.

[shoemonster]

Yeah the first few times my 2 were way more interested in the treat and their feet were all over the place, but then i stopped luring and started only rewarding for a few good steps, and gradually got it to a whole ladder length

[Rebanne]

I used a body wrap - a long bandage in a figure 8 around the dogs body:- under the neck, around the chest, cross over the back, around and down the back legs, just under the buttocks at the top of the hock. I then laid poles on the ground, like pick up sticks, and walked my dog through them. Also you can leave the body wrap on and do some simple work with the dog. Worked wonders with my GSD.

[shoemonster]

Oh cool, I will check it out

I have millions of wide bandages from all the years of ops on my knees!!!

[Jibba]

I used a ladder about 6 ft long, and back then i was 16 and my instructor told me to do this so its how i did it, but we had the ladder set up and had the dogs climb it and go down, all very slowly of course, but it did wonders for my GSD when he needed it in obedience and agility and also tracking, he was very aware of his feet, and would never miss step.

I highly recommend the ladder, whether on the ground or not.