Prong Collars

[MonElite]

Personally I'd love to hear some (unemotional, mature, intelligent) criticism of prong collars because I think it's important to know the good and bad of any training equipment and have an open mind about it all.

As most here know Im pro prog but if you want some criticisme here it is as well

1. if you get a poor quality one and you have a mega strong dog that will launge it can break the collar

2. if you dont put the collar on correctly - that is the links will not lock fully the collar will come undone

3. if you purchase one with a snap like you have on the lead for the quick release, yes it will release really quick, when you least need it.

4. most will rust with time.

Plus other than the general apperance of them I cant find anything wrong with them.

Hope this helps.

[Erny]

Personally I'd love to hear some (unemotional, mature, intelligent) criticism of prong collars because I think it's important to know the good and bad of any training equipment and have an open mind about it all. Getting all emotional and pissy about it ain't going to accomplish that (that's directed at tds and that other nutbag who crashed a prong thread)

You're right JB. I like to explore the downsides as well as the upsides. It makes you more aware of the equipment, its useage and effect.

Because of the nature of the links, I find the occasional time when the dog's neck is an "inbetween" size.

The only other 'hassle' with the prong is (especially when it is new and the links are not as pliable as they can be) when you're trying to fit it to a wriggly, squirmy, difficult to control dog. Especially ones with lots of coat. And try fitting one on when you have had your working hand damaged from a dog bite or some such.

An upside that I don't think has been mentioned is that the prong does not damage the coat as does a check chain or headcollar (which often leaves marks in the fur across the bridge of the nose).

Edited December 2, 2006 by Erny

[FreyaJade]

TDS no longer has access

;)

um im sorry but i dont understand why someone would be denied acess to a public forum just because someone disagrees with you? personally im not wading into the prong debate but i thought we lived in a democracy not a fascist dictatorship. why is it a good thing that someone has been denied the right to free speech? who gave the administrators of this forum the right to terminate the membership of people who have done nothing but express an opinion? it doesnt matter what that person said, i cant believe that you think this is a good thing. someone here even has a signature that quotes volatire about the not agreeing with what someone says but respecting their right to say it!

what sort of forum is this? you accused that person of being close minded but what does denying them access say about this forum? :p

ETA: this is actually NOT the opinion of tigerjack but user name kylieandpossum, sorry i was logged on via someone else's computer and didnt realise....oops

Geez, I AM really copping it sweet aren't i?

Kylie, I think this particular user may had been banned for a little more of a reason that just disagreeing. He/ She did post some comments directly after my post which one would quickly come to the conclusion that I was not training my dogs & posting lies.

'Why not train your dogs instead of all this hiding, justification & lies' was posted by tds after my post. I feel that's pretty damn personal. From what I can read too, I didn't get personal with anyone.

After all, I just had a behavioural consultation with K9 Force just this morning & learned yet another great deal of knowledge I will be using to train my dogs. But oh no that's right I forgot....I'm not training them though......according to tds.

And I'm still wondering where I lied & about what? Hiding? Clearly to come onto a forum before first introducing yourself & your dogs, just to 'get up someone for using a prong' as tds's very first post is an indication that this user will 'hide' themselves before coming out of the woodwork under yet another nic, to troll up yet another thread about prong collars.

I suggested using a scarf to 'hide' the prong so that ppl who feel it is their duty to condemn me for it can just keep on walking in their own little world.

As for justifying myself, well I didn't do that either. All I did was talk about my experience with both a prong & a choke chain.

If a user goes against the forum rules, that's enough of a reason for them to get banned. The admin here have every right to. And it DOES matter what the user said, if it is against forum rules. You don't have to know why they were banned Kylie....that's the admins job. I feel it is a good thing, because there are too many trolls in the forum world. I'd rather not waste my time on them.

I've been flamed on another forum for using a prong anyway, so perhaps I'm being followed by a troll. :D

Might I add here, I haven't always been pro prong myself. I hated the sight of them & was never interested in anyone trying to encourage me to use them. BUT, I NEVER used personal attacks on those who were pro prong & firmly beleive in 'each to their own' I disagreed with their views, but left it at that. Just because I didn't like them, didn't mean that I should accuse ppl of lying, not training their dogs or worse off...being cruel.

Now that I am pro prong, I still do not use personal attacks to those who disagree. I don't ell ppl they are wrong or right. Their dogs may not need a training tool like a prong & good for them.

Now like jaybeece posted, if the critisim aimed at prong collars was of an intelligent, mature & unemotional manner then noone would be getting banned. I certainly wasn't when I was anti prong. I was one with an open mind.

Edited December 2, 2006 by FreyaJade

[jaybeece]

Thanks for letting me know Make you wonder why if they are safer than a choker? would I be correct in assuming some scaremongering was involved in getting them banned?.. But that doesnt happen in modern day Australia does it?... Oh I love sarcasm

I posted what the gov't had to say here: http://forums.dogzonline.com.au/index.php?...t&p=1372083

You're actually pretty right about the scaremongering :p They based the ban on public opinion and what animal "welfare" societies had to say. Any adverse medical or behavioural side effects were not mentioned/considered/submitted, in fact they even stated that they received a testimonials from users of prong collars who recommended their use.

Silly government

[Emily Howard]

I think the biggest down side to the prong is people not using them correctly.

And as for them not teaching the dog anything, well after using a prong for awhile I've been able to "down grade" to a martingale and my dobe is lovely on the lead. What it taught her was to pay attention to me when nothing else was getting the message through, without harsh corrections or reducing her drive. Now I don't need it anymore. They are a great piece of training equpment.

[FreyaJade]

Excellent post Emily!!

[arby]

Some great testimonials from those of you who have used it and have "down graded"

I agree with alot of pro prong people, the main problem is not having these fitted out properly. Some people have no idea how to measure it out. Others have the problem of having a dog that has an "in between" size. Unfortunately in Australia this problem occurs due to the fact these collars arent redily available. If we had more of them available I'm sure we'd be able to get more appropriate sizes.

[FreyaJade]

The downgrading level is what I'm in order of achieving myself. It's worked already for my staffy, Tess. I've had her walking loose leash with the prong for ony a few months. Already I've switch down to a choke chain & alternating with a prong. One walk with choke chain, the next with the prong.

In the next few weeks I'll be trialling a flat collar. GD needs more training as she is the more stronger dominant dog. Same trainer & same training for each dog....one just needs more practice than the other.

I still feel in times of need, ie when the dog's drive is set off, that the prong is much safer in regards to resisting to pull hard. With Tess I've already seen this in play with both prong & choke chain. On the prong she's resisted to pull towards other dogs close by, but with the choke chain she's been more tempted to pull & start choking herself. I guess it is that reason that the prong is a better training tool. It pinches the skin around the neck & doesn't strangle or choke them, but resist them from pulling harder. When Tess pulls on the choke chain, she'll cough & splutter.

Just my experience so far with both collars...no justification required. :D

Edited December 3, 2006 by FreyaJade