My Dog Just Had A Fit Or Seizure

[olcoolone]

I have got a 5 1/2 yr old Lab Bitch that has been diagnosed with Epilepsy since she was 2yrs of age.

She is on medication and having Blood tests every 6mths to make sure her levels are within the acceptable range.

I have been told by a fellow Lab owner that they are feeding their dog Silverbeet and it is having less frequent Seizures.

Can anybody help me with any comments for and/or against feeding Silverbeet.

Has anybody been told not to feed Silverbeet to dogs etc.

Thanks

[~Anne~]

I have got a 5 1/2 yr old Lab Bitch that has been diagnosed with Epilepsy since she was 2yrs of age.

She is on medication and having Blood tests every 6mths to make sure her levels are within the acceptable range.

I have been told by a fellow Lab owner that they are feeding their dog Silverbeet and it is having less frequent Seizures.

Can anybody help me with any comments for and/or against feeding Silverbeet.

Has anybody been told not to feed Silverbeet to dogs etc.

Thanks

I have never heard of it. I will pm you a link for a world wide canine epi list. If anyone has tried it or knows about someone on this list will.

[CaseyKay]

So annoyed with myself. Daylight savings changed here on Sunday and I remembered to change the clocks but forgot about the meds. It was half an hour late as it was so that made it 1.5 hours late and she had a seizure mid-morning. At least I presume that was why. I know how close her meds are to JUST being able to control the seizures because I want as little sedation effects as possible. At least she only had one and the post-ictal was very short. Bang she had a seizure, zoomed around for another minute and then was ready to get back into playing (but I took her home!). I did give her an extra 30mg but she was fine afterwards.

[~Anne~]

Sorry to hear that KC had another seizure. Our daylight savings finishes in a few weeks so I'll have to remember to re-adjust the time to gradually bring Monte back to the right time.

I have discovered some info about the genetic link too which was very interesting. It was in the documents that Belljari sent to me but I haven't had the time to post it up.

[Staffy-Lover]

Not sure if i mentioned it before but my neuro told me to add 2 capsules of fish oil a day to my boys diet and it seems to be working well for him

[~Anne~]

Not sure if i mentioned it before but my neuro told me to add 2 capsules of fish oil a day to my boys diet and it seems to be working well for him

What does the fish oil do staffy-lover? When you say it is working well, do you mena in reducing seizures or the affects of the meds?? What fish oil do you buy?

P.S. How's your new career going? I hope all is well.

[Staffy-Lover]

Hey Puggles,

Dr Childs said that fish oil helps the brain and that although nothing is proven she thinks that fish oil can help epi's.

we started my boy on two capsules every night (just normal humans ones or u can get squirt one from the pet stores), i know that it is probably a mixture of a few things that Dr Childs taught us BUT since we have seen her and been using the fish oil my boys seizures went fantastic ... straight away they went from once a fortnight to once a month.

Also, she said the fish oil is just generally good for their health because of the meds.

and YES my career is going great. Some kids are driving me slightly mad but all in all it is great and i'm glad i made the move

hope all is well

[frufru]

Hi Puggles, just popped in to see if you had posted the new info about genetics and epi which you mentioned. Hope all the epi dogs out there are doing well. I tried the omega oils too and didn't find any benfit but I think I will give it another go and double the dose.

[~Anne~]

Hi Puggles, just popped in to see if you had posted the new info about genetics and epi which you mentioned. Hope all the epi dogs out there are doing well. I tried the omega oils too and didn't find any benfit but I think I will give it another go and double the dose.

Sorry, I have been really slack. I promise I will though as soon as I get the chance.

[SueM]

Still no seizures from Harvey touchwood since being on the medication

[CaseyKay]

Ok guys, here is a weird one. BTW have already spoken to my vet this morning and he says he does think this was seizure type activity.

Last night I got home after work and had to go out to a meeting. I took KC with me so I could give her her pills at the usual time. She came to the meeting with me and slept on the floor by my feet for 3 hours. She had her meds and dinner at the usual time. She was alone for about 20 minutes yesterday and was absolutely fine, no seizures.

I got home about 10pm. She sleeps in our bedroom, on the bed until about 2am when my husband gets home and then in her crate. She got very restless about 11pm, and she started licking and biting at the bedclothes. She made a noise like there was something in her throat. I turned on the light and had a look. She had done this 3 times before (all this year), she will chew at/lick whatever is on front of her and if you pull her head up her mouth will keep moving, she is staring into space and she will be rigid. She does not respond if you say her name. The other 3 times, two were at home outside, and one was on a walk, and both went about 10 mins max. She stopped doing this last night after 5 minutes and paced around the bedroom for a while. Then she jumped back on the bed and started turning around as if to lie down but went around about 20 times until I put my hand on her chest, and when I did that her front legs kept moving. Then she started biting things again. Then she paced around the bedroom and she was very restless for about an hour. I put her in her crate after a while but she did not settle, getting up and lying down and licking at her mouth and not biting things, but sort of a face like you woudl make if there was soemthing on the roof of your mouth. I stayed up keeping an eye on her and she fell asleep about 4am, she was fine again this morning.

I rang the vet 8am and described all this to him (and I had been reading up on complex partial seizures in the early hours!), he said no, that doesn't sound like seizure stuff. He thinks she probably did have something stuck in her throat and it was causing her stress (the other 3 times she has done this was all eating grass beforehand). He thinks I might have caused a problem because I do not give her the pills in food, I put them straight down her throat (she will not eat them in food) and has suggested I make sure she has a drink after the pills as they can get stuck if her mouth is dry. I wonder if this could be true as she doesn't seem to be trying to clear her throat and if that was the problem, would she not paw at her mouth etc? I might accept that if it had been the first time she has doen this but it was the 4th? The first time it happened I DID think she must have something caught and I had a really good look and feel around.

Why I think seizure activity:

Non response to voice

Staring

Rigid

Keeps doing the motions even when stimulus removed

Restless afterwards

Have checked up with my husband today and she is fine and feeling very playful.

[CaseyKay]

http://www.canine-epilepsy.net/basics/basics_main.html#types

If you go to this site, there is a video under a section called "Example of a focal seizure". KC's "normal" seizures are very similar to this except hers are a lot more violent, more foam etc.

I see that under both focal seizures and complex partial seizures it says "this type of seizure is normally associated with secondary epilepsy". Which is what KC has (due to head truama) and talks about scar or lesion on the brain. KC has never had a tonic-clonic grand mal. I am just emailed this link to my vet, see what he says.

[~Anne~]

I disagree with your Vet and it sounds like you do to.

It certainly appears to be a partial seizure by what you have described. Partial seizures, as you may know, only affect a part of the brain unlike the clonic tonic seizure that affects all of the brain. Each partial seizure can be entirely different becuase it depends on what part of the brain is affected.

An example of a partial seizure that Monte has had is one that has occurred while he was eating. I am assuming it happens at this time as he gets so excited about his food thinking that he is always starving. He will being to eat and then he will start to wobble while his head is still down near his food. He then starts to make a gaging sound and the wobble turns into a stagger and, to me, it appears that he is choking and is not getting enough oxygen. At this point he does not respond to me nor does he appear aware of his surroundings. He has then dropped to his side and begun to stiffen before he abrubtly gets up, staggers around gaggin a bit more and then goes back to eating. On some occassions the dropping and stiffening hasn't occurred but the rest has.

I will usually hold him back form his food as he is still wobbling and not quite conscious for a short while. Within a minute he is back to normal although restless.

Partial seizures can take on many forms including 'fly snapping'. I think you should discuss the possibility again with your vet and look at perhaps increasing his meds. The reason being is that the pathway becomes easier with every seizure ocurrence and the partials may lead to full tonic/clonics.

For further reading (and if you don't already know of these sites) I suggest having a search though these. They both contain a vast amount of info;

Cainine Eilepsy Resource Centre

Canine Epilepsy Guardian Angels

[pebbles]

I haven't read all the posts in this thread but perhaps a look at Canine Epileptoid Cramping could be worth a minute. This is being researched in Border Terriers and I don't know if it is in other breeds. There's quite a number of videos on UTube relating to this in the Borders.

[CaseyKay]

Thanks Puggles,

I know those sites well! I have also been reading about complex partials in people and it seems to me, this is definately what she had. The vet read what I sent (some cut and paste stuff from various sites) and wants to see her again early next week and re-do her bloods and talk about meds again. I know they have other epi patients and he has an epi dog himself but...their other patients with seizures are idiopathic. Also they do not have dogs on any drugs besides Pb. He still wants to do an MRI but I don't see the point. If they find something like a scar from her puppyhood trauma, there is nothing they can do anyway. She is 4.5 years now.

It has been 3 months since the increase from 30mg to 37.5 mg BID (Pb). I think we have some room to move up the meds, because she is quite happy and no side effects on 37.5mg (she weighs 12kg). Also she had a single seizure not quite two weeks ago. Not good. I might contact NZ's one and only vet school and see if they can help or maybe point me in the direction of someone.

Sometimes I get paranoid about things like fly-snapping etc, but a) I can usually see a fly if there really is one, or sometimes she is biting herself because she has an itch and b) if I say her name she will immediately look at me and/or come over. She is a very obedient dog.

I think I need to video things like what happened last night as they are hard to describe in words, but I never think of it at the time.

[CaseyKay]

Vet says not to worry too much about "minor seizures" and thinks only should up meds if having more "full seizures". She has been fine since last weds night. I have put in her log and if she has more or close together I might up her meds.

[Staffy-Lover]

it sounds like seizure activity to me.. not all seizures are full blown ones.

Just a question - u say that you don't give the tablets with food just put them down her throat

BUT all these tablets should be given with substantial forms of food. So do you give the food afterwards because if so then it can't be the tablet getting stuck.

I was giving my boy his meds with cheese only in the morning BUT when i went to the Neuro she said the tablets need to be taken with a decent amount of food. We have since been giving with weetbix and warm water with dash of milk and it actually helped with the seizures. we went from 2 weeks to 4 weeks.

[~Anne~]

I feed my dogs twice a day anyway and so Monte has always had his meds in his food.

Staffy-lover - what is the doseage rate for the fish oil tabs?? Monte weighs around 8.5 - 9 kilos on any given week. Also, do you break them open or give them to him as they are?

Edited - spellink.

Edited April 3, 2007 by Puggles

[CaseyKay]

Staffy-lover, I do feed KC straight after her meds, both am and pm, but she is a picky eater and I give her the meds by themselves beforehand to make sure she gets them and doesn't spit them out. I have tried giving her the meds in treats but she won't eat them. She doesn't seem to like treats at all. She has always been way too thin, although muscly and fit. i have found some food she likes to eat, and she has put on some weight in the last couple of months, enough that people don't look horrified when they pat her anyway. I still give her pills separately though because I need to know she is getting them and the exact right dose. I don't have to worry about her gaining weight with meds, thats for sure.

She has been fine now for two weeks, I wish I knew what happened last time.

[Staffy-Lover]

caseyKay, well if you are feeding her afterwards then it can't be the tablets being caught in the throat as the food would push them down. almost definately seizure but thank goodness it is gone for now. Have your tried her on a weetbix with warm water to soggy it and then a splash of low fat milk? My girl is fussy fussy but she loves it !

Puggles - my boy is 30kg and has two tablets a day - the neuro said you won't OD your dog on these, worst would be he starts to get a too oily coat and u know u r over doing it, so i would give your babe just one tablet per day.

You don't need to take them out of the capsule just put the capsule in the food and that's that.

In humans fish oil helps brain function and Dr Childs said that the fish oil also helps the brain function of epi's (although as she said there is no hard evidence but this is typical of epilepsy isn't it hehehe). She said the fish oil is good for the liver and the coat and the heart and everything anyway.

Edited April 10, 2007 by Staffy-Lover