Tips For A Possibly Dominant Puppy

[pipppy]

Hi Everyone, new here and i have spent hours reading all the usefull info, its great.

We (family of 5 including 3 teenagesrs) have a 12 week old germ shep x cattle. we have had him 3 weeks, we got him from RSPCA.

He is a great little thing, and as we have not had a puppy in our lives for some years we are learning as we are going.

From what I have been reading around the place and from talking to others it seems he may have a dominant personallity.

We have started basic training using food rewards, he sits drops, comes( most of the time), shakes hands & waits very paitinetly for food (not through choice but we have taught him this in the last few days).

His puppy nipping we have mostly got under control, with the help of a water spray bottle and lots of yelping, it only took a few squirts and he seems to have learned quite easily not to do it, but I can tell he still wants to and still gets a few unexpected ones in there. LOL>

He is not always obedient and can sometimes bark back at me if i discipline him, never hitting him or anything, just if i talk sternly and look him in the eye, he will either wander off or lay flat with his head on his paws looking back at me like he is ready to pounce or sometimes barks at me. What should we do when he barks back at us?

He also tries to put it over the teenagers with a varying degree of success.

He only likes his belly rubbed when he chooses, he only likes a cuddle mostly when he chooses, usually because he just cant/wont sit still, and when he is in the house he wont sit still for 1 minute unless we give him some tasty morsel to chew on, he spent an hour at my feet last night hooking into a lovely pigs ear....but as soon as he loses interst he goes silly and i cant calm him and end up putting him in time out.

During the day he is mostly outside, but, on average I would say we spend about 3 - 4 hours out there with him (between the 5 of us he gets lots of attention!). Today, Saturday the only time we wernt out there basically was when he was sleeping and we kept away to let him have his rest.

At night he sleeps in the laundry and we dont hear a peep out of him for about 8 hours.

He has been going to puppy preschool and has it all over all the other pups, he goes straight up to them and demands to be boss, and they all seem to give into him.

Are we expecting way to much of him, is he just being a normal puppy or should we be doing more to let him know who is the boss.

If he is going to be dominant, is that such a bad thing, and what should we do now to keep that in check for the future.

Thanks for taking the time to read, we really love this little guy and want him to part of our familly and get things of to a good start.

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

[Kavik]

In regards to the other pups at preschool, what exactly is he doing? How is he acting, how are the other dogs acting? Are you sure it isn't just rough play?

With my most recent two dogs, instead of going to puppy preschool I have taken them to a club that I know where the older dogs are relaxed, and will help to teach mine proper doggy greetings. So that instead of jumping right into wrestling with other dogs when they meet, they greet by sniffing nose and bums and go from there.

[pipppy]

Well, on the 1st day yes there were a few tussles, and he growls when playing alot (the insutrctor wasnt at all worried she said he is just vocal when playing, but the main thing was he was trying to, and succseeding in the end, mounting them.

Then the other night there were some other, older pupps there and one of them, about twice his size, straight away went for Billy, we eased them into playing together and good I thought he needs to be put in his place, they had a few tussles, i wasnt too worried but by the end of the night the bigger dog was letting my pup mount her also. I know this isnt sexual behaviour, hes only 12 weeks and was fixed before we got him. One other much bigger dog was there and Billy tried also to mount him, but this pup was 5 months old and twice the size and was having none of it, kept swatting him away, and Billy (my dog) was whimpering like a baby when he couldnt get his way.

Also if he is engrossed in play with one pup and another comes along, he barks and tries to shoo the other dog wanting to join the fun away. When he wants to join in on others playing he jumps on one of thier backs and, well, its embarrassing, but its like he says here i come, everyone do what I say. He also always manages to get in the position where the other dog is on its back and he is standing over them while playing.

I must say though that I have no Idea of what is NORMAL puppy play, rough or otherwise, maybe that is my problem, you know it takes a bit of getting use to all this bum sniffing and stuff. LOL. The instructor wasnt too concerned but she did say he was the dominant pup in the class, she didnt say that in a negative way, just sort of matter of fact.

The older dog idea would probably be a good place to start, I have a friend whos dogs would be perfect for that. They are very well trained, bigger, older and very social.

Edited September 30, 2006 by billiam

[shekhina]

Some tips for dealing with dominant dogs, or any dog really when you're showing them their position in the pack...which should be LAST.

Never let the dog rush through doors in front of you, always go first.

Make sure the dog sees you eat before he gets anything of his own.

Always make him do something for what he wants...sit for food, for his toy etc. etc.

German Shepherd Dogs and Australian Cattle Dogs are working breeds, this is going to be a high energy dog! Is the puppy de-sexed? I'm guessing yes because you got him from the RSPCA, but if not please make sure he is done at 6 months otherwise those hormones will make things so much more difficult.

Well done on teaching him what you have so far, stick around here you will learn so much

[pipppy]

shekina, thankyou for the tips.

We are already following most of those, I even eat my breakfast most mornings sitting outside with him and give him none of my food. However he has usually had is breakfast about an our before, so, does this still count???

The one we are having huge problems with is rushing through the door ahead of us, or if he is to stay out we have a foot wrestle trying to get him to back off.

We had some limited success (it didnt last and he worked out he would rather try and get in than have the reward) using reward for him to stay back, and some succes using the spray bottle so he didnt try to get in, and as for stay, well when it comes to going in the door he just wont stay at all and generally as soon as the door is open he is there on the spot, under our feet, the teenagers struggle to keep him out at all sometimes.

SO, if you, or some other kind person could give me a quick lesson for dummies on which is the best method and how to exactly get him to wait for us to go through first that would be very helpfull. I realise whatever we do we will need to reinforce over and over again but so far anything we have tried has lost its effect after a day or two, even with reinforcement.

Thanks in advance!

Edited September 30, 2006 by billiam

[flycow]

triangle of temptation? LOL!

With my dominant pup, in the begining I blocked the door with my body facing her, hand on her collar, made her sit still and enter first, always. Then I release her with my release word and she'll enter. Now she do it herself most of the time, she's slowly being put in her place. I remembered breaking the consistancy a couple of times and I screwed up big time, now it is 100% consistant. And I always eat before her. At times when I have to feed her before myself (haven't cook), I pretend to eat from her bowl for a minute, then give it to her. My dog always eat 'leftovers'. hehehe.

Edited September 30, 2006 by flycow

[shekhina]

OK, what I meant when I said make sure he sees you eat before he does, I meant before you feed him his meals. So you eat something before he gets his, even if it's just a little something. In the wild higher pack members eat before the lower ones.

I taught both my dogs not to rush through doors by shutting in their faces before they got through...I had to be quick to avoid getting their noses! They would try a couple of times and each time the door would get shut in their face...then they'd get all confused and back off. When puppy backs off, open the door again, if he gets up to go through shut it again. Keep going until he stops.

My guys learnt that pretty fast and they will now sit and wait for the door to open and for me to go through first.

I'm sorry if I've read things wrong, but did you say that you're making him wait for his meals? By that I mean does he sit and wait until you give a release command to eat?

My guys have to sit for their dinner and wait until I say "OK", they have now learnt to look at me and keep their eyes on me until I give that command.

Your puppy is just a little tacker, so he's not going to get it straight away...start by holding his collar while you say wait and when he sits their quietly give a release command and let him go.

Hope this helps

[flycow]

Billiam, shekhina gave great advice! Great stuff. Hey you can trapped his head at the door too (safely for several seconds) if you have sliding doors somewhere, gotta ambush him though.

Edited September 30, 2006 by flycow

[Kavik]

I use a body block like flycow to prevent them coming in before they are allowed, then make them sit and when they do I give their release command and let them come in. You have to be quick though

For sitting before meals, you can use the Triangle of Temptation, I think it is pinned at the top of the training forum? (I always just use show new posts instead of going in individual forums LOL) The ToT teaches the dog to look at you and give you attention before he eats.

I am now doing something similar to ToT with the door, I don't physically make them sit, just block the entrance and wait. They want to come in and know that sitting makes that happen.

[Muttaburra]

Nothing much to add to the great advice here and what you are getting at training. Consider having him on the lead (or a halti) when taking him through doorways or any difficult situations. Also, until he is trained up to an acceptable level, you could ask other members of the household to ignore him as much as possible and not to pat him, that way all the positive reinforcement comes from the trainer and he will start to look to you as leader.

Ignore his requests for a tummy rub or pat. Only pat him when you initiate it, same with toys and play. You also might consider starting agility training or similar early with this dog, weaving through poles etc should be easy to set up in the backyard. Also get him a kong or a treat ball, that's a great way to keep his very active braing occupied.

All the hard work you put in now will pay off in the long run.

[PAX]

I noticed you said he comes most of the times. I would nip this in the bud now, you want to encourage behaviours that you want for the dog's whole life.

You can play a little game where you say his name and then reward with a 'yes' (a verbal reward marker) and pair it with a treat when he looks at you. This is not coming when called but name recognition.

Have a word that means come to you, I use 'come' and only use it when you know 100% he is going to come (dinner time is good and anytime he is running to you) and always reward for coming. If he is doing something and you think he is likely not to come don't use your special 'come' word just whistle or say here fido or what ever.

You need to invest lots of time (fun and games) in coming when called as this is the most important command for dog's to learn. You don't want to be practising ignorance.

Playing tug is a great game to wear out pups as long as you have strict rules. Pick a tug item and you own the toy, you start the tug and you end it. I like to have a word to start the game like 'get it'. Make sure he has a good 'out' (releasing the toy) ask for a sit or drop and start the game again. All of these sort of games help the puppy to learn a bit of self control. If he is reluctant to release the toy put a treat near his nose and swap him. If he growls and barks while tugging that is fine as long as he remembers the rules.

I agree with the other posters about the 'triangle of temptation'. You can then use this also for waiting at doors, in and out of the car and a thousand other things.

What ever you decide to do with the waiting at doors, you will need all family members to do the same thing to be fair on the dog.

Good luck and happy training.

[pipppy]

Geez guys thanks sooo much for all of your usefull comments. I have read them over a few times and i am feeling a bit more confident we can get on top of the door rushing behaviour.

Continuity is a bit of a problem here with 5 eager puppy lovers, so i see we must all continue to try and be consistant.

That TOT, I read that the other day and thought it very interesting, I have printed it out and will deffinately give it some thought, I never really thought about the dog looking at you in that way.

I am so out of the dog loop with these things but it is lots of fun learning. We have not had a dog in about 7 years, and even the dogs we had as kids were never trained to do anything much, just showered with love and bad behaviour tollerated, I am sure this is going to be a much better way to go for us and for him.

We intend to do some further training classes with him when puppy school is over and setting up a little course for him in the back yard sounds like a fantastic idea!!!!! (now I am off to read all I can on further training).

Well he is having a bath as we speak, I am trying to stay away as the kids (teenagers) are having a ball with him, they decided he was smelly, but i think they just wanted an excuse to pamper him, he's not barking, and all I can hear is "you are so good, you are so cute, you are so wet, good boy, good boy. Its a shame i will have to clean up the mess in the laundry afterwards. LOL.

Thanks again, and I am sure I will have more questions to come at some stage.