The Best Premium Kibble For Fussy Eaters?

[feher]

Can anyone recommend a really good premium kibble to go with Dr Bruce Symes Meal For Pets (Premium Choice)

A little about the Meal For Pets (Premium Choice):

Premium Choice contains a combination of premium grade fresh raw kangaroo meat, with a ration of liver, kidney and heart. It is combined with sprouted mixed cereal grains, vegetables, barley grass, garlic, parsley, calcium, yeast, kelp, lecithin and vitamin C.

The meat is minced kangaroo, with additional kangaroo heart, liver, and kidney. All meat has been inspected and approved for consumption. Kangaroo is a lean, free range, nutritionally superior meat to either farmed beef, chicken, or lamb.

The cereals used are raw whole grains (oats, barley, soybean, flax seed), either whole, rolled or crushed. They are not milled into flour, or bleached, or processed in any way. They are simply mixed, and then left to soak in water at room temperature for 24 hours (to allow them to sprout and release their nutrients) before combining with the meat. The combination of crushing, soaking, and mixing with the parsley and other vegetables, creates a mix similar to that found inside the gut of a prey animal. The combination of raw meat, organs, and the cereal and vegetable blend, is designed to mimic the natural food state, and ingredients, that ancestral dogs and cats ate in the wild.

To provide the broader array of the natural nutritional elements found in a dog or cats wild diet, other natural supplements and ingredients are added;

Garlic is used for several reasons. It adds flavour and aroma to encourage eating. It has elements that discourage parasites, mainly intestinal worms and fleas. It is a carminative herb, which means it stimulates digestion and intestinal motility.

Garlic also contains a compound called Allicin, which has powerful antibacterial properties which are quite unique in that they destroy harmful bacteria without damaging the bodies normal intestinal flora..this allows it to breakdown putrefactive bacteria in the bowel and decrease flatulence.

Parsley and barley grass are potent “green foods”, with very high levels of natural vitamins, minerals, trace elements and anti oxidants. These two ingredients replicate the nutritional content of green matter found in the stomach and gut content of herbivore prey animals.

Calcium carbonate powder is added to correctly balance the diet with regard to the correct amounts of "available calcium". Calcium and phosphorous in the diet actually compete with each other for absorption, and this can dramatically reduce available calcium. Because raw meat is high in phosphorous and lower in calcium, additional calcium is added.

There are also reasonable levels of calcium in cereal grains. The ideal ratio for calcium to phosphorous is 1.2 : 1 which is the exact level achieved in Premium Choice.

Yeast is one of the richest sources of B complex vitamins, especially B1 or thiamin. It also is high in iron and phosphorous. Two other important elements in yeast are chromium and selenium. Chromium is involved in regulating blood glucose levels, and deficiency can result in diabetes. Selenium is one of the bodies’ most powerful weapons against ill health and disease..it acts as an anti-oxidant (along with vitamins A, C, and E), which helps maintain a strong immune system, slows down the ageing process and maintains elasticity in the tissues. It helps prevent arthritis and other degenerative diseases including cataracts.

Kelp is a rich source of iodine which is vital for the normal function of the thyroid gland. The thyroid gland controls the metabolic rate of an animal, and hence its energy levels, stamina, bodyfat, and reproductive ability.... Kelp is also rich in B vitamins, and vitamins D, E, and K, along with calcium and magnesium.

Lecithin is a naturally occurring constituent of every cell in the body, and is also found in egg yolk, liver, nuts, wheat, soybean... It functions to give power and vigor to the brain, cleanses the kidneys and liver, breaks down cholesterol and fats, increases immunity against viral infection, and prevents gallstones. It also forms myelin, the fatty sheath that surrounds nerves, and is therefore important to prevent and aid the healing of nerve damage.

Vitamin C is added for several reasons. Although dogs and cats can manufacture their own vitamin C (unlike us humans), recent studies in the U.S. have revealed that they have a poor ability to increase production compared with other species.Vitamin C is another powerful anti-oxidant, and when the body is under stress or attack from bacteria or viruses, production of vitamin C is accelerated dramatically (or in the case of humans we start taking vitamin C supplements...the basis behind the cold remedy). Goats can increase their vitamin C levels by 10 times in as little as 6 hours when placed under stress, whereas dogs and cats will take at least 3 days to achieve this, which may be too late under acute attack from say parvovirus etc. By maintaining a consistent level of Vitamin c in the diet, dogs and cats are more able to withstand stress, viral and bacterial infection, shock and trauma. Vitamin C strengthens the immune system, and is also an integral component of collagen, the matrix of tissue that forms skin, tendons and ligaments, bone, arteries and veins...even the cornea of the eye..and as such is vital to healing from any injury. Most vets and animal nutritionists dismiss vitamin C as unnecessary in a dog or cats diet, but there is plenty of evidence to suggest that they are much healthier and stronger with an additional amount in the daily diet, especially when under stress, infection, or healing from shock, trauma or surgery.

Ok, well, not a little ALOT. But I still need a kibble to accompany this, so any suggesitons would be greatly appreciated

[Ianto]

Eagle Pack

http://www.eaglepack.com.au/

[Hazz]

Is it reccommended by the producer of this product to use kibble in conjuction with the product or are your dogs not eating it ?

[feher]

The lady at Pet Cafe recommended to have premium kibble with it... (Nope, Pet Cafe DO NOT sell live animals, I LOVE IT!)

This is quite expensive considering its $5.95/kg, and I have 3 dogs and 3 cats to feed... I need more than 1kg a day to feed them the recommended amount (not even considering kibble)...

Will post a new topic of the BARF Diet (I am still trying to get my hands on some!)

Edited August 8, 2006 by feher

[Miranda]

This food seems pretty expensive for what it is, I can't see the point of feeding it if you have to feed a premium kibble as well. I feed my dogs human grade beef mince with Eagle Pack kibble and I can buy the mince for $3.99kg. Also why is kangaroo said to be more nutritious than beef, chicken or lamb, I know it's low in fat, but dogs require much more fat in their diet than humans and kangaroo can be way too rich for many dogs. The food also contains soy and I won't feed my dogs soy in any form, it isn't a grain it's a legume and is virtually indigestable for dogs sprouted or otherwise. BTW who is Dr. Bruce Symes?

[feher]

A vet according to the site

Thought I would give my fussies a go on it any way.. Thanks for the heads up Miranda

I REALLY wanna try the BARF Diet... But if I can't I may go with the Eagle Pack and Mince... How do your babies do on that?

[Hazz]

Get your hands on some of the BARF books (BARF diet, Give your dog a bone) they are a world of knowledge and great info when starting out.

I feed Roo but it is very lean and dogs do need a certain amount of fat in their diet hence I also feed chicken and beef and an assortment of different bones (roo/chicken/ox/pork etc) - variety is the spice of life

[ShesaLikeableBiBear]

Its Dr Bruce's vetsallnatural.

Yep why are you wanting to feed this as well as a premium dry kibble, quite honestly looking at their product on the website the look of minced kangaroo would make me want to . Sorry!!!

[Miranda]

But if I can't I may go with the Eagle Pack and Mince... How do your babies do on that?

I feed my dogs an assortment of chicken wings, necks and lamb flaps in the morning, if I feed a chicken frame that's all they get as they're usually large. In the evening I feed 1 cup of Eagle Pack Holistic for Large Dogs + a handful of beef mince and they usually also get one of the following, cooked liver, mackerel, sardines, salmon and occasionally yoghurt. They also get any meat/vegetable scraps that are left over and brisket bones twice a week. My OH usually feeds them a little piece of toast every morning too They seem to do very well on it and clean their plates at every meal.

[ShesaLikeableBiBear]

Meant to say that I feed Nutro Natural Choice, (both the dogs and my birman) unlike a lot of other products including the big name brands, it doesnt contain animal by-products or corn.

That is the base of their diet and then I also feed sardines once or twice a week and chicken wings.

For treats they get beef liver which I dry in a de-hydrater.

[witheverythingiam]

The lady at Pet Cafe recommended to have premium kibble with it... (Nope, Pet Cafe DO NOT sell live animals, I LOVE IT!)

This is quite expensive considering its $5.95/kg, and I have 3 dogs and 3 cats to feed... I need more than 1kg a day to feed them the recommended amount (not even considering kibble)...

Will post a new topic of the BARF Diet (I am still trying to get my hands on some!)

Hi I already posted in the Barf diet thread in General Topic - go to bigdogpetfoods.com website & e-mail them to ask about having BARF diet delivered. Although Billinghurst's RAW BARF patties are more expensive than $5.95. Maybe you should try bigdogpetfoods.com Greyhound Racing foods, which is BARF diet, but you will only be paying $2.50/KG if you buy in 20KG lots?

And I'd add Eagle Pack holistic dry food if you want to add another natural kibble to diet along with BARF.

-WithEverythingIAm

[feher]

Love it. thanks for the top advice guys... My Sibe bitch, and Maltse are quite picky, and have basically told me where to stick the roo meat I think its just a bit too strong for them. Am going to give BARF a go... I emailed bigdogs and they advised that Aussie Pet Stores will be receiveing their first shipment of BARF this week... Lets hope that its the Greyhound mix I would need to buy it in 20kg lots anyway as I have 3 dogs (Maltese, Sibe, and GSD) and 3 cats (+ 4 kittens at this time)....

[feher]

Oh oh, and none of the pet shops. suppliers or produce specialist even know wht BARF is up here... How sad is that?! When I called Aussies Pet Stores the other day, they had no clue as to what I was talking about, and tried to sell me sausage... Hopefully when it arrives to them this week, they will get filled in on it

[KitKat]

Feher - are you after a food all your dogs can eat? or adult and pup type food?

Just i can recommend the Royal Canin German Shepherd and GSD Junior kibbles And depending on how active your other dogs are the RC 4300 or 4800 would probably work nicely as well

[NaturallyWild]

When i last spoke to Dr Bruce Syme he did not suggest to add kibble to his mixtures - doing so is likely to unbalance the calium/phosphorus levels. Instead just adding raw meaty bones with the odd bit of organ meat was suggested. I would suggest you try and contact Bruce via email on his website (vetsallnatural) to get direct confirmation of what he suggests.

I personally believe raw meaty bones (meaty being the main part) with about 10-20% organ meat (or total meal once a week) is the main basis of what they should eat. On top of that any left over amounts of vegies (pulsed), fruits and grains (broken & soaked) can be added. It is also possible to add various additives to improve general health (eg vit c, garlic etc) and to potentially help with disease/worm prevention. A top quality supply of the base foods should suffice anyway unless ill health develops.

Try and make friends with the local butcher, chicken shop, so you can get cheap supply of meaty bones - saves a lot of money. Try and get a second hand freezer to stick out back/shed so you can get lots.

a good website to try is raw meaty bones and you can download a copy of Dr Lonsdales latest book (link is for actual book).

I would rarely give dry dog food, but there are a couple of higher quality ones around that could be used on the odd occasion - sometimes better to let the dog go without and clense its system.

Best luck

Tim

Edited August 8, 2006 by NaturallyWild

[~Myschafis~]

Mine get eagle pack and I have definatly noticed the differance in their coat and energy