moirat Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 Ruby and I are just back from the vet and I don't know about her but I am shell shocked. I had convinced myself last night the lump on her foot was probably only a grass seed or similar and we headed off quite happily. UNFORTUNATELY it doesn't appear to be quite so easy. The lump appears to be a "mastcell?"( will have to look up the name again). It is a tumor, poor old girl has swollen lymph nodes in her leg and her spleen is palpably swollen. Not too good he thinks. Surgery booked for Thursday and will know more after that. OH will go off as he believes once she starts the surgery circuit it will be the end of her. I don't know whether to discuss it with him or just go ahead. Decision decisions. If she needs to have this removed there is no other option, hopefully it is early stages and will be contained by removal of the tumor. Fingers crossed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rozzie Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 Bugger all right... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne_Fury Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 Oh no I'm so sorry to hear about your girl. Here's hoping that it is not as bad as the vet fears and that the surgery will be a quick proceedure and clear up the problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffyluv Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 (edited) So sorry... I know that gutted feeling so well... My lad has grade 2 mast cell cancer without clean margins on the second tumour site. It has also spread to his lymph system. We had the surgery, then a second to try and get clean margins on the large tumour site. They still could not guarantee it. Ollie is currently having chemo and being treated holistically. Both have been of benefit to Ollie. Ollie takes 500mg of Vitamin C twice a day as well as some other holistic meds and he takes macrolone which is not a nice drug but has really slowed the growth of the tumours down. Wishing you all the best with your pooch... If you would like to chat, PM or email me. Dogsbesotted is a wealth of information about mast cell as her girl Lucinda has been fighting this horrible disease for about 4 years now. Jodie ETA: We have only done 2 surgeries. One to remove a small wart like tumour on his toe (no clear margins) and to remove the big tumour on his rump (both done in the same surgery). Then we went back to try and get clear margins on the rump - but it was not meant to be. As it is in his lymph system and moving around his body, there is no need for further surgery - it is pointless... That is not to say that all surgery will lead to more and more. If they do it and get clear margins, then all you need do is monitor for more lumps. Your vet may suggest that there is no point in the surgery if it has already spread - but don't lose heart with this, remember that dogsbesotted's girl has lived for 4 years (and is still going) using holistic therapy... Edited July 10, 2006 by Staffyluv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 OH will go off as he believes once she starts the surgery circuit it will be the end of her. I don't know whether to discuss it with him or just go ahead. Decision decisions. If she needs to have this removed there is no other option, hopefully it is early stages and will be contained by removal of the tumor. Fingers crossed Definitely agree with your OH here. Have you looked at escharotic salves? There is an australian one called Cansema which has produced some amazing results with people and animals alike. Many horse people I know always have some Cansema Black Salve in their first aid kit for all sorts of problems. Cancer salves - this page of testimonials has a dog whose mast cell tumour has been totally removed without surgery or drugs, leaving the immune system intact. It works very quickly, usually the cancer is gone in less than a month, then the hole it leaves behind just has to heal - which can be helped with calendula ointment etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moirat Posted July 10, 2006 Author Share Posted July 10, 2006 OH will go off as he believes once she starts the surgery circuit it will be the end of her. I don't know whether to discuss it with him or just go ahead. Decision decisions. If she needs to have this removed there is no other option, hopefully it is early stages and will be contained by removal of the tumor. Fingers crossed Definitely agree with your OH here. Have you looked at escharotic salves? There is an australian one called Cansema which has produced some amazing results with people and animals alike. Many horse people I know always have some Cansema Black Salve in their first aid kit for all sorts of problems. Cancer salves - this page of testimonials has a dog whose mast cell tumour has been totally removed without surgery or drugs, leaving the immune system intact. It works very quickly, usually the cancer is gone in less than a month, then the hole it leaves behind just has to heal - which can be helped with calendula ointment etc. Thanks for that morgan, My father in law was given some cansema salve but said it burnt and wouldn't use it. I will find out if he still has it or if not where he got it. I am happy to try a non invasive treatment if possible. Testimonials seem pretty encouraging and definetly worth a shot. I think I will call my vet and discuss delaying surgery and the benefits of this type of treatment. He is pretty open minded. Thank you again I was preparing to face her surgery and a battle of wills with OH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 (edited) Thanks for that morgan, My father in law was given some cansema salve but said it burnt and wouldn't use it. I will find out if he still has it or if not where he got it. I am happy to try a non invasive treatment if possible. Testimonials seem pretty encouraging and definetly worth a shot. I think I will call my vet and discuss delaying surgery and the benefits of this type of treatment. He is pretty open minded. Thank you again I was preparing to face her surgery and a battle of wills with OH. Have done a lot of research into these salves, and there is always mention of pain management being essential. In some of the animal testimonials I have read, the vets have prescribed the salve, and have shaved a bit on the leg for a pain relief patch to be put on before the salve is applied. In human cases where it is used for oral cancers, dentists have administered the pain relief required. This treatment is not for the faint-hearted! But surgery and chemo IMO are much worse, because the pain can go on for much longer. My last 2 surgeries (not cancer) required days of being on a morphine drip afterwards. Some other testimonials have said the pain was mild, and with some of the animal cases there didn't seem to be too much discomfort - could be just luck! :p At least these salves work very quickly - most cancers seem to be removed within 10 days, and the remaining hole never gets infected, which would also reduce the pain levels. Good luck, and if you try it, take photos each day to document the progress. Every time I have healed up some animal with alternative methods, people ask for photographic proof, which I never had, because I was always so busy treating it that I forgot! ed for typo Edited July 10, 2006 by morgan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 Oops - here is the Australian supplier of cansema . Just click on "cansema" on the upper left hand of the home page, then when the cansema page comes up, you will see the order link. This stuff comes with a money back guarantee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gapvic Posted July 11, 2006 Share Posted July 11, 2006 I lost my beloved greyhound Max to mast cell cancer about two years ago now. His tumour was on his hind leg - amputation was not an option as it had already spread to his chest. We opted for chemo which did knock him around a bit, but I doubt that we would have got the extra twelve months with him without it. RIP Max. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogbesotted Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 Oh bugger! A couple of comments: As it is a Mast cell Tumour..make sure that the vet put your dog on antihistamines BEFORE surgery. I would also recommend consulting with a reputable holistic vet as support for your dogs own immune system is helpful. Lucinda has been totally holistically treated since the end of 2002. did you get my email? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moirat Posted July 13, 2006 Author Share Posted July 13, 2006 Oh bugger! A couple of comments: As it is a Mast cell Tumour..make sure that the vet put your dog on antihistamines BEFORE surgery. I would also recommend consulting with a reputable holistic vet as support for your dogs own immune system is helpful. Lucinda has been totally holistically treated since the end of 2002. did you get my email? Many thanks, yes I did receive your email. I have discussed alternative treatment to surgery with my vet. He was a little reluctant but thought we should prehaps give the cansema slave a go, before having to resort to surgery. His suggestion or should I say insistance was that I measure the lump well and record the measure ( 3cm x 3.5cmx2cm high) if no improvement in a two week period, or heaven forbid an increase in size he would really recommend removing the lump. He agreed to look on the website morgan had kindly recommended and do a little research himself. He is a little doubtful - man of science I suppose,- as he feels as her spleen is swollen and her lymph glands in her rear leg are also up that we may be a little late for any of these measures. Cannot hurt to try though so two weeks with the salve and lets see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shekhina Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 I've just been looking at that link morgan, and here is a link off that link. Clickity Click Shows the treatment with a donkey...what can I say but WOW. Donkey pretty much given a death sentence with such a rapid cancer...6 weeks later cancer free Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffyluv Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Wishing you all the best for a great outcome with the salve... Jodie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffy-Lover Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 StaffyLuv i noticed you give ollie vitamin c. Can you tell me what that does? Just wondering as i have been researching vitamins to give my epi dog to boost his system. Best wishes to all the sick puppies ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Moirat - I am extremely impressed that your vet will actually consider this! Him giving a deadline is entirely reasonable in the circumstances too. If the lymph glands look dodgy, could you manage to give her the capsules as well? There were a lot of testimonials that said the oral use of the capsules helped with internal issues while the salve was being used topically. Shekhina - that donkey was amazing wasn't it! Bit gory, but it would have died very quickly without the salve - looking at those pics you can see why pain management needs to be addressed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shekhina Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Shekhina - that donkey was amazing wasn't it! Bit gory, but it would have died very quickly without the salve - looking at those pics you can see why pain management needs to be addressed! It certainly was amazing, would give hope to any who had their pets diagnosed as well, just incredible. Looked to be very, very painful...but what's a bit of pain (with pain relief) when the animal gets to live out the rest of it's life happy and healthy?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jed Posted July 13, 2006 Share Posted July 13, 2006 Those sites look quite impressive. Morgan, have you tried any of the products with success? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgan Posted July 15, 2006 Share Posted July 15, 2006 Haven't tried them myself, as I've only ever had 3 cases of cancer in all my dogs, cats and horses over the last 30 years - 2 were mild mammary tumours in older girls who were then desexed and had "lumpectomies" and completely recovered to live normal lives, the other was bone cancer, which was so quick, the dog was pts within 3 weeks. As this was prior to the internet, it was very difficult to obtain much information. As I have had a lot of friends and family die from orthodox cancer treatment, I have done a huge amount of research into alternative cancer treatments, and came across this site whilst seeking possible treatments for a friend's melanoma. Much of the research points to chemo being helpful in about 2% of cases with humans - and that figure comes from an Australian medical research team! Many medical studies say that common cancers like breast and prostate cannot be helped with chemo, yet oncologists everywhere still use it. Untreated cancer victims normally live four times as long as those that are treated by oncologists and have much greater quality of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tentie Lover Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Many thanks, yes I did receive your email. I have discussed alternative treatment to surgery with my vet. He was a little reluctant but thought we should prehaps give the cansema slave a go, before having to resort to surgery. His suggestion or should I say insistance was that I measure the lump well and record the measure ( 3cm x 3.5cmx2cm high) if no improvement in a two week period, or heaven forbid an increase in size he would really recommend removing the lump. He agreed to look on the website morgan had kindly recommended and do a little research himself. He is a little doubtful - man of science I suppose,- as he feels as her spleen is swollen and her lymph glands in her rear leg are also up that we may be a little late for any of these measures. Cannot hurt to try though so two weeks with the salve and lets see. Does anyone know how this treatment went? As I'm about to try cansema salve before the surgery option. I would love to know the details of the treatment. Regards J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aniangel Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 moirat, i'm sorry to hear about your ruby. i am a veterinary oncology nurse and if i can be of any assistance i am happy to help & please feel free to PM me. you can also check out www.vetoncologyconsults.com this is the website of 2 of the 5 specialist oncologists in australia. the site is very helpful and has sound advice. i don't know enough about your dog or the location of the tumor, but if there is lymph node and splenic involvement, that can only be determined by biopsy and ultrasound. its also best to get the tumor out and get histopath results so exactly what you are dealing with - unfortunately that may mean amputation from what i have understood from your post, but maybe not. there are different grades of mast cell tumors and they all have different prognostic factors and treatment modalities, but firstly DON'T PANIC. mast cell tumors are the most common skin cancers we see in dogs. surgery + chemo may be an option, so could radiation treatment, but all is determined by the grade of the tumor and that can only be determined by biopsy. please check out the above website, it is full of good information and they will happily consult with your veterinarian if need be. best of luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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