~Anne~ Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 I have had several people (including my dear MIL) who have told me they have 'talked' their cat or dog out of a seizure. Being the cynic I am I have always just smiled and thought to myself "Sure, like of course" with a sarcastic tone naturally :D Some have even claimed that they did not put their dog on any medication but instead, watched for the warning signals and calmly but firmly talked the animal out of a seizure episode. On Saturday, I was laying down for a nap when I 'sensed' Monte having a seizure. Sure enough I came down stairs and Monte was on his side coming out of one. These days Monte has cluster seizures and will have around 5, with each one immediately following the next. As it was only 30 minutes of his medication time I gave him his dose of meds and watched him. I also spoke to him and told him he would get dinner shortly when he had finished his seizure episode. If there is one word that Monte recognises over any other it is the word 'dinner'. Within 5 minutes he was looking like he was about to have another seizure. I spoke to him and kept calling his name while he stared off into his zombie land. I repeated that he woud have dinner soon. He slowly sunk to the ground and started to stiffen but I kept repeating his name and the fact that he would have dinner soon. Before the seizure developed fully he came to again. Looked at me, ran to the area in the kitchen where I prepare his dinner and looked back at me. He didn't have any other seizures. I waited 15 minutes or so and then gave him his dinner as promised. My question is - did he become focussed on me calling him and promising him dinner to the point where it stopped the brain activity that causes his seizures or was it coincidence???? Has anyone else experienced seizures in a pet that can be overcome with words or diversion tactics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meg_Ed Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 I really believe that Eddie was a where of his surrounding when he had sz.Coz when i was patting him while he was having one he would duck his head when i would go to pat it.He use to like to be held.His back legs would stretch out behind him and i would wrap my arms around him while he was on his side.He'd relax abit but if i moved he'd tence back up.I use to just say to him "your ok" over and over again softly.When he came back he'd usually lick my face as if to say thanks mum.Then i would usually encourage him to get up and do something, like get a drink or go to the loo.He was a bit wobbly on it but within about 5 mins tops he was back to his ADHD self. Cheers Megs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffy-Lover Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 (edited) many people believe that you can call their name and break the seizure... i have tried this and not sure if it worked, but in minutes he had another one... i still call his name "like playing ball" just in case could have been the PB dose that helped?? Edited February 7, 2006 by Staffy-Lover Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted February 7, 2006 Author Share Posted February 7, 2006 could have been the PB dose that helped?? Yes, it could have been this but at other times when he is clustering I have even administered valium and it has never worked that quickly or effectively. He still manages to squeeze in at least 3 more full seizures normally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffy-Lover Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 hmmmm - well maxi is very food orientated and one day after a seizure he was really excessively tired and had a sleep, he was so zonked that when i was calling his name and shaking him and he wouldn't wake up... i started to panic and called my OH who was making a sandwich, he ran in with CHEESE in his hand - MAX woke up in a second :rolleyes: so maybe next time i will try cheese? geez i will try anything - but do u think waking them early can be harmful? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted February 7, 2006 Author Share Posted February 7, 2006 so maybe next time i will try cheese? geez i will try anything - but do u think waking them early can be harmful? I can't imagine it would be. I have also posted the same question on the epi list and will let you know the results. So far I have had about 4 replies and they have all said it is possible to talk them out of a seizure :rolleyes: so who knows? The main theme of the responses has been that you need to catch the seizure at the very beginning, when the dog is showing the usual symptoms leading up to the seizure, otherwise it doesn't work. Like you, I am also willing to try anything to stop them before they kill my little man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffy-Lover Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 yeh.. well i next time it happens (although i am being rather optimistic and hoping this might be years from now :rolleyes: ) i will try it and let you know of the outcome. also.. i thought i might let u know of a bowl that you can buy on ebay that you leave in the freezer and add water to make very cold. i bought one for a few dollars and leave it in the freezer for if/when maxi has a seizure and i put his water in it. cools him down rather quick........ might be of interest to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted February 7, 2006 Author Share Posted February 7, 2006 Thanks for the tip. I currently switch the air-con on to freezing and up high and have several soft freezer packs that I use - the ones that you use for sprain injuries. I just wrap them around him and it keeps his temp down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debbi Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Hi Puggles, Dont be so "cynical", its not as crazy as it sounds, "focus" works with people as well, people who are fortunate enough to have "partial" and also grand mal seizures. The issue is to attempt to get a "focus" point and attempt to focus the person calmly through the situation, some people are able to be focussed through to avoid the worst point of onset seizure. If you are "attuned" to your animal, you will be able to see warning signs, and the more that you can gain the attention of your pet, the more that you can focus your pet through, the less (in some cases) the seizure activity will be. Once the brain loses focus activity, then full seizure control takes over, and at that point, then you will be unable to bring the animal, back out of the seizure. The key is to gain focus PRIOR to loss of full brain control. Hope this makes some sense. Eyes are always a good indicator. Debbi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 Hope this makes some sense. Eyes are always a good indicator.Debbi It certianly does Debbi! Thanks! :rolleyes: I have actually received quite a bit of advice on this with most of them saying exactly what you said (but maybe not quite as clearly as you have just said it). My only problem is that he normally starts a seizure set at about 4am......... I have become attuned to listening for them while I am asleep as I always manage to wake up but this is usally after he has had at least one full tonic/clonic. If I could stop that first one I would be much happier but I intend on trying the focus technique next time, regardless of how many he has already had before I get to him. As he only manages 5 minutes or so in between each one I watch his every movement (usually I am holding him anyway) and so I will make sure to catch when he first starts to zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffy-Lover Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 puggles early AM is the time maxi usually has them aswell. only twice has he had one in the day and this was on a particularly hot day... not sure if that affects it. I am definately going to try this and i will report back with the outcome. thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debbi Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Hi Puggles, I have not absorbed all your posts, if he is having multiple seizures, I am not sure if they are every day, but as mentioned "eyes" are great indicator, even to the night before. "distant" eyes, are an indicator of impending problems sometimes as early as 24 hours prior seizure activity, (if one is used to, or astute enough) to pick up and assess the indicators. There are many predisposing 'set off" factors to seizures, one of them is "flashing lights". Many of these can be very subtle. "fluro tubes" that are not constant, (ie subtly flashing. Flashing lights in some instances are a set off for seizure activity. There are many predisposing factors or precipitators to seizure activity. Its a matter of knowing some of them and reducing the exposure. Stress, over tiredness, there are a number of other key factors, but to many to list and not all are "trigger factors" in all cases. the key is to as best know "your own circumstances" and learn to read "your pet" as best possible. It wont cure the problem, and it wont avoid all the seizures, and it by no means replaces medication, but it helps to understand, and assist in some areas. Deb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owned by Shelties Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Hi personally I think you can talk them out of "s"... I know when my Angel Annie was having them i used to Yell out her name and tell her we going to Grannies and she came out so quickly. So i really would be talking to you kiddies or even try Yelling out there name,you must be persistant keep yelling tell they came out of it. My heart goes out to you all fingers crossed we can beat this f@#$ing thing.... It cant be good for them to keep having "S" for as long as they do?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Myschafis~ Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 When I was little I had a keplie x bc (i think) and as he got a little older 5ish onwards he had seizures not daily but often enough but we always used to talk him out of it, I would just call his name and pat him and he would be fine! If I caught him once he was just beginning to have a seizure I could stop it completely by talking to him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 Hi Puggles,I have not absorbed all your posts, if he is having multiple seizures, I am not sure if they are every day, but as mentioned "eyes" are great indicator, even to the night before. "distant" eyes, are an indicator of impending problems sometimes as early as 24 hours prior seizure activity, (if one is used to, or astute enough) to pick up and assess the indicators. I am quite close to my Monte Bear and I have never seen anything to indicate he was about to have a cluster or single seizure until about 5 - 10 minutes before he starts. And when I say close, I mean from the minute I walk in the door, Monte is glued to my leg - literally. I stop, he stops. I go to the toilet, he sits on my feet and waits. I have dinner..... he drools all over me I habitually watch him because he twitches, I worry about him and because he is sooooo darn cute! Monte clusters, usually around 5 each time, and currently has only been seizure free for a maximum of 24 days at a time in the last 4 months. But being idiopathic epilepsy this could alter at any time. His last seizures were on Sat just gone. To date, we have never narrowed down a trigger to his seizures. He is currently on the highest dose of meds he has ever been on and he is still experiencing clusters. We have an appointment to see Neurologist to see what more can be done. He was first diagnosed more than 2 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffy-Lover Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 puggles i know what you mean i think i must sleep with one eye open and one foot on the ground. i sleep with the hall light on so i can get up in a hurry and run for the "supplies"... i make maxi sit next to me all the time when he is sleeping so that i can keep my hand on him and notice any twitches.. i dont' know how many times i have sat BOLT upright in bed at the sound of a falling leaf... thinking it might just be ...... but maxi has his seizures in the middle of the night so i am not awake usually to get a heads up that anything is going to happen,,,, but as he is a clusterer i can always tell when the second, third etc is about to happen and i try to get him up and walking as much as possible even if he is sooo tired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debbi Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Hi Puggles, with respect, the greater majority of seizures in dogs, (epilepsy) is Idiopathic, Idiopathic simply means that it is of "no known origin". If there was a "known origin" then the cause would be identifiable and treatment options would be available, (ie brain tumours, specific neurological disorders etc). That is in fact the reality of seizures (multiple) in our canine and feline friends. The fact is that in the majority of cases they are Idiopathic epileptics, simply because the cause is not known. One seizure, does not deem epilepsy, two seizures does not deem epilepsy, it is not until there is a known situation of a history of seizures that "epilepsy" is diagnosed, and it is known as Idiopathic in the majority of cases in our pets because there is no known cause, although much research is still being done. Therefore, we must live with the information and research that has been done in relation to epilespy (in general) and much of it that has been done in relation to people also passes on to our pets, (such as flashing lights, stress, tiredness). There are other things that can cause seizures, but these things SHOULD have been ruled out in your boy's case. The fact that you state that your boy "twitches" is a "pre indicator" in many instances. You should (I am not telling you what to do ) but it often helps, to record for example, those times where twitching is more noticeable, where eyes appear a little more "listless or dull" and then notice the next day, what the situation is. Diaries of all behaviour, and you will soon find that you may find that you will become astute enough to see the "pre warning" signs often many hours prior to the actual seizure activity. Just some food for thought for you. Deb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 Hi Puggles,with respect, the greater majority of seizures in dogs, (epilepsy) is Idiopathic, Idiopathic simply means that it is of "no known origin". *nodding head* Sorry - but you are not telling me anything I do not already know .... perhaps I have given indication that I don't understand the disease???? Also - when I say that Monte twitches it is actually seizure activity (a partial seizure)- just not a tonic/clonic seizure. He does this most days. It isn't an indicator of an impending full seizure. We do record his seizures and other symptoms purely to see if we can locate a trigger :p As I said, he was diagnosed some time a go and as a former veterinary nurse I have some understanding of medical problems and terminology and I have researched his condition till the cows came home. I was merely confirming, with this thread, something that I had stupidly not believed before and that is that you can 'talk' them out of a seizure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 i dont' know how many times i have sat BOLT upright in bed at the sound of a falling leaf... thinking it might just be ...... That is EXACTLY what I do! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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