Uncontrollable Urge To Pee. Stops On Vomit

[Loraine]

Erny I keep coming back to this thread on Kal. I am keeping fingers and toes crossed for Kal. If Addisons happens to be the outcome, then dogs in the US have a monthly injection of Percorten, plus some cortisol meds to take daily. They live normal lives and are happy creatures

[pampa]

Hi buddy

Are there any side-effects to be expected from the pre-op drugs you are about to receive for Kal, are are they relatively "soft" on the system ?... It would be great if they have no negative effects on her at all... What exactly are they supposed to do ???

So, it looks like she could be ready for surgery around the 18th-20th May ???

I might not have a computer up and running around those dates, so could you please PM me your private phone number so I can give you a call...

Its going to be an anxious couple of weeks for you sweetie... Try not to let Kal know you are fretting

She'll be fine, and as Rusky says, she'll be in the best possible hands

[Erny]

Hey there Pampa! I've been thinking about you and yours too. Hope the packing and, moreover, your girl's treatment is doing the trick.

I did ask about side affects to the meds. Fainting is one side affect (the meds will work to reduce clotting - to avoid the clots causing probs during and after surgery). Low blood pressure is another possible side affect. However, Guy tells me doseage is very low and often even if healthy specimens (ie dogs with normal blood pressure) are given this medication, there are no such symptoms appearing as a result.

Guy seems fairly pleased with Kal's clinical signs (and is happy that she is putting on weight, to boot) so he doubts I'll see adverse reaction.

The meds will be sent to me by registered mail. This is often slower than normal mail, so I presume I will get them tomorrow or maybe Friday (????). Surgery will then be approx 2 weeks after that. He said I can work surgery in to suit my diary. It doesn't matter if she ends up on the meds for, say, 3 weeks .... it's just recommended that it is a minimum of 10-14 days.

Apart from the surgery and post-op recovery, my other concern is Kal's eating regime. I've explained this to Guy (ie that she has nerve damage to oesophegus and has been diagnosed IBS) so he's clear that her food must be soupified and that I shall supply the food portions. They will have to soak the rolled oats each night beforehand and feed her half the next morning and the other half the next night. I will explain this again (and how much water to include to be satisfactorily 'soupy' so it doesn't get stuck) when I'm at the hospital.

I was following Kal down the hallway last night. She's a bit slow on her legs, but with the weight gain at least now doesn't look like she'll blow away in the slightest breeze. I actually was jokingly taunting her calling her "fatty, fatty" ........... . Doesn't seem that long ago when I used to be concerned she was putting on too much weight. Now I'm delighted.

ETA: PMing you now, Pamps!

Edited May 3, 2006 by Erny

[Muttaburra]

Thanks for the update Erny, sounds like Kal is doing well.

[dogbesotted]

Sounds like it is all coming together! Kal is constantly in my thoughts, along with Ollie and Pampas girl ( what is her name???????- remember I am over 50 LOL). Re the soupified food..why dont you take an example in for them to see..

Hugs to all

Helen

[Muttaburra]

You might be able to make up some batches of soup in advance and freeze them. Then they can just defrost each pack in the microwave.

[Erny]

Re the soupified food..why dont you take an example in for them to see..

This I will be doing.

Thank you for your thoughts, DBS. Appreciated.

Abs:

You might be able to make up some batches of soup in advance and freeze them. Then they can just defrost each pack in the microwave.

Hhhhmmmm ..... I guess that's possible. I've always steadfastly stuck to the "soak RO overnight and then feed" rule. Never thought about doing it, mixing it, adding water and freezing. doh! So simple! :D Thanks.

Received notice from post office there's a parcel for me to pick up. Although the notice doesn't say "registered" which is what I was expecting, I presume it will be Kal's meds. Unless, of course, someone's sent me a biiiiiiigggg present/surprise.

Got home too late to collect. Will do that tomorrow.

Edited May 4, 2006 by Erny

[Muttaburra]

Perhaps you could do a trial run with the food, freeze and microwave and see if it turns out.

[Erny]

Perhaps you could do a trial run with the food, freeze and microwave and see if it turns out.

Another good idea ..... they might even be able to simply defrost overnight? ... not worry about microwave?

[Erny]

Kal's meds arrived today. Just to clarify something that I got confused about somewhere along these recent times.

The meds block the affect of adrenal chemicals at the receptor. The purpose is to try to regulate the release of those adrenal chemicals so that the body won't be 'shocked' at their sudden withdrawal at surgery. A lowering of blood pressure can occur and this is where fainting or dizziness might occur (although Guy believes this to be unlikely).

I had cause to speak to Guy tonight on a query about the med doseage. In our conversation I reported that Kal was off her food this morning. This occurs every now and again.

(Was it as the result of her raiding my rubbish bin - something she's NEVER done before .... I'm keeping an open mind to blockage, either from the front end or the back end. She is now eating, so I've ruled out front end blockage. I'll be relieved when she's done a poop.)

Mid-morning she 'asked' to go outside for toileting. Habitually, she goes out the front door and round to the backyard, negotiating 2 wide (but not overly steep) steps along the way. I heard a 'clatter' and walked around the corner to find her trying to pull herself up off the ground. It was obvious that her back legs had given way whilst trying the steps and that she'd fallen backwards back to the ground.

As I had reported these occurrences to Russell Mitten, I hadn't made a big point of them to Guy. But tonight, bringing this to his specific attention, lead to further discussion. In short, he's suggesting that it would be unusual for these symptoms (legs failing ...... this has happened in her front legs as well, but not as often) to be the result of the adrenal tumour and that perhaps there is a neurological disorder in play.

I told Guy that I realise no-one can know for certain either way, but I'd hate to think that I put Kal through surgery for the adrenal tumour only then finding that quality of life was insufficient for it to be kind to keep her going due to some other (eg. neurological disorder). If that was the case, then she'd be better off (IMO) living her life as best and as happily as could be possible until it wasn't possible anymore - at which time I would, of course, give her the gift of eternal freedom and peace.

Guy sounded concerned over my descriptions of these events and we have decided on this plan:

1. To start the meds.
   
2. For me to report any further stumbling/falling incidents as they occur (by email to him)
   
3. If Guy wants me in sooner as a result of my reports, he'll call me for the purpose of a neurological examination.
   
4. If I don't hear from him, we will proceed as if to surgery in a couple of weeks (approx) for the removal of the tumour, but he will do a neurological exam before surgery takes place.
   
5. The outcome (surgery for adrenal tumour removal or not) will depend on the findings.
   

So that's where we are at the moment. I know you all wish us well and Kal and I thank you for that. I'll keep you informed of updates.

I'm not religious, but I admit to silent prayers. They include the little burns victim girl who was today hit by a car; Kal (of course); Pampa & her girl; Jodie and her 'Ollie' and Rusky and her 'old Goldie' .... and, of course, all the other doggies who need wishes for good health and a loving forever home.

The airways must be buzzing with activity.

Edited May 5, 2006 by Erny

[dogbesotted]

oh Erny..it keeps on and on doesnt it?

Kal is on the receiving end of many prayers and many positive vibes.

Hugs

Helen

[pampa]

And just when we thought we were making head-way, or that we at least had a direction to our meandering

I'm so sorry that things appear "more complicated" than expected.

Has she had her first medication yet and if so, how did it effect her (I imagine if it is a "blocking" agent, a bit like the medication I was giving Talia), it has an almost immediate effect...

Thoughts as always

[Erny]

Hi Pampa. First medication tonight. But thought I'd wait until I return from a party I'm invited to. I want to be around 'just in case' of any side affect.

How is your girl, Pampa?

Edited May 6, 2006 by Erny

[Muttaburra]

I know you've gone over it before, and also with the vet, but I thought one of the symptoms of Cushings was a weakness of the limbs. I understand that Cushings in this instance is still in doubt. The only other thought to mind is that her condition (fluctations in cortisol) may be intermittent, somtimes getting enough other times low or high, but I guess the blood tests would show that. Has the kindney function tests indicated anything? Anyway, I hope your vet can eliminate neurological causes if that is what he suspects.

More prayers and positive vibes for you and Kal during this challenging time.

[Erny]

Hi Abs.

I just don't know. I did point out to the Vets that whilst the bloods and urine tests don't show Cushing's, there's so many other clinical signs that to me, suggest Cushing's. Somehow, neither of them think the clinical signs do. This part I don't quite understand. But I don't know what else I can do other than to follow their direction and trust in their expertise. "Trust" in this regard comes difficult for me, as I've had such a bum steer and rotten run with so many other Vets in the process of insisting something was wrong with Kal.

I've thought about going to someone else. Eg. Holistic Vet etc. etc. But then that means more poking and probing and I really don't want to keep putting Kal through that time after time after time. And there's no getting away from the fact that she has an adrenal gland tumour anyway. And then, of course, I'm spending more money. Money has never been a primary consideration by me when it has come to Kal's health, but given the chance that surgery can't or shouldn't be avoided, my funds to spend in the meantime have become limited. I wouldn't hesitate if I could know the outcome of elsewhere investigation would conclude in a definitive answer. I can only hope I'm doing the right thing, one way or another.

Kal is sore - probably from the fall she had down the steps. She gave a small yelp when I extended her rear left leg, something she is normally ok with. She was in obvious discomfort last night. When I called her from her bed for the last toilet stop of the night, I noticed the skin on her back dramatically pulled to one side (to the left). This is obvious when you have a Ridgy, because the ridge shows up how off centre it is. I've seen this before, when Kal was suffering discomfort over the 'bone incident'. I'm going to take her to the chiro on Wednesday to sort that out.

ETA: We went for a short walk this evening when I returned from training. She was quite jaunty and happy to be out. Also happy to return, because she knows she gets fed on return. Actually, come to think of it, Kal gets fed almost constantly these days. (Her chicken fillet is cooking as we speak.)

Edited May 7, 2006 by Erny

[Muttaburra]

Overall Kal's not have such a bad time of it, or at least the best it can be under the circumstances. I agree, when it comes down to the issue of the adrenal tumor and the necessity of surgical intervention in this instance, some of the finer points may be less significant. A growing adrenal tumor needs the attention, and is causing disturbances of some kind, that much is certain.

It's funny how they'll pick up their step when they know something yummy is waiting for them at home. You can see the cogs ticking over.

[petmezz]

lots of thoughts with you and Kal, i hope things work out. if you need any help of any kind just let me know and i'll do my best.

[Erny]

lots of thoughts with you and Kal, i hope things work out. if you need any help of any kind just let me know and i'll do my best.

Thank you - that's very kind. :rolleyes:

[dogbesotted]

How is Kal doing on her meds?

Cheers

helen

[Erny]

Hi DBS. Can't say I've noticed a huge, if any, difference to anything. She's been fairly calm, although I've been working to avoid even the most minimal of stress for her, so I'm not sure if that's a 'side effect' of the meds or not.

I did notice the other day that Kal was up and barking quite strongly at an unfamiliar dog who chose to nose around on my nature strip. This was a good sign IMO, as Kal's pack intrusion warnings have weakened over the time of her illness, to the point that she doesn't bother to get off her outdoor bed and only barks once or twice (weakly).

There is another problem, though, but unrelated to the meds and possibly unrelated to anything else. Over the last couple of months I've noticed this, but the signs were so obscure and short lasting that I whilst I 'noted' them, I tended to be able to find some outside reason for it. It relates to her breathing and it is in the last two nights that I am beginning to become alarmed. As far as I am able to tell, it seems to occur only/mainly at night time, although in this I could be wrong. It is trouble with breathing through her nose. She sounds like a person might sound when they are blocked up with a bad cold but insist on trying to suck air in through the nasal passages. I notice now that the difficulty in this breathing is beginning to distress her to a degree. She will move her head position around as if trying to seek a position to make breathing easier. She will swallow as if also trying to clear something. I have listened to her lungs during this but I don't hear any wheezing there. The noise all seems to come from her nose. For the sake of description, the noise reminds me of someone with asthma or perhaps emphasema - I'm not suggesting this is the problem. As I said, lungs sound clear (and she's had regular checks there with all the recent visits to the vet). Last night I tried placing her body in different positions to see if it would help, but it didn't. For just a short moment, there was even a 'gurgling' sound, like as if her nose was blocked with moist mucous (as in a cold). It did ease when I propped her head up with a bunch of her blanket and the rest of her night she seemed to sleep peacefully.

I am concerned, although not panicking. And I am ready in these moments to rush her to emergency if need be.

I am taking Kal to the chiro this afternoon to fix what damage she did when she fell down the two steps a number of days ago.

I will be in contact with the Vet today (assuming he's there) regarding forthcoming op and to report this breathing problem.