Trisven13 Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 Hi everyone - I have just seen K9 force's topic on training in drive and I am desperate to read it all BUT I don't understand what training in drive means. Where can I read up a bit about it so that what everyone is talking about makes sense???? What little I have understood is making me very very very excited and I really feel that this could be one of THOSE moments in my dog owning life..... Any suggestions on what to search that will bring up the right threads or something similar??? Thanks so much. Trish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelpie-i Posted January 12, 2006 Share Posted January 12, 2006 Hi Trisven13 Unfortunately you won't find a great deal of drive training methodology on the web -it's not actually a "formal" form of training and not one used by many people. Another term for drive training is "motivational" training. Lablover once put up a link about drive training, not sure which thread it was on...and whilst it didn't go into technique it gave you a run down on when, what etc. The write up was a little technical and unless you are familiar with terms such as thresholds, modes etc, it would right over your head. Find a school that trains in drive (not many of them) or that uses motivational based training. Another good source is to go to a schutzund club and watch them train. They usually train in drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trisven13 Posted January 12, 2006 Author Share Posted January 12, 2006 Oh okay - probably not many of them in Albury :rolleyes: . Will talk to my training friend here in Albury then and see what she can tell me. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarka Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 (edited) What little I have understood is making me very very very excited and I really feel that this could be one of THOSE moments in my dog owning life..... Any suggestions on what to search that will bring up the right threads or something similar??? If you need something for visual reference I believe the Leerburg videos do a lot of work in drive, but I haven't seen them personally. Edited January 13, 2006 by Tarka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latisha Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 I just ordered the "training in drive" dvd last week along with some others from Leerburg. The website and supporting websites (looking on ninemsn / google) seem reliable. I will let you know what I think. They are not the cheapest dvd's but if they give extra info to what is on here, it will be worth it. Most sites just describe what the drives are and describe working dogs etc need to have a high prey drive. Please post the site address (if you are allowed) if you find some really good ones!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarka Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 Also, I gather "Schutzhund Obedience: Training In Drive" by Gottfreid Dildei & Sheila Booth is considered one of the definitive works on this. (Anyone read this?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pippi Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 Haven't read it yet, but it is on my list of books I want. A review would be great..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelpie-i Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 I have a set of videos by Joanne Plumb which shows drive and inducement training. It also shows how to teach dogs to "enjoy" corrections through drive training. Fascinating stuff! It's schutzhund based training too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogibear Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 Ive read it ages ago good book well set out yb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvinshep Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 Hi Latisha had a look at Leerburg's web site....It is a very interesting web site....I would like to obtain a dvd & other articles....the price of the dvds etc are american prices....how do we know what to send as I will be sending a cheque..they will be more expensive....how do you work it out. could you let me know.... Jan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarka Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 (edited) Hi Latisha :D had a look at Leerburg's web site....It is a very interesting web site....I would like to obtain a dvd & other articles....the price of the dvds etc are american prices....how do we know what to send as I will be sending a cheque..they will be more expensive....how do you work it out. could you let me know....Jan With these things it usually easiest to just use a credit-card and let the CC company sort it out. If you can't do that you should be able to use an international money order; Auspost do them through Western Union. Of course, he may not want to take your money, you may be one of those genetically inferior French people... (See the page about "foreign orders".) Edited January 15, 2006 by Tarka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latisha Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 The foreign order page left me stunned when I first saw it. People are entitled to their opinions though. I just used my credit card so I cannot comment on payment via cheque. There a many websites that convert the amount to AU dollards but this would still only be an estimate (due to rate exchange changes etc). You may want to contact them via email to ask about other payment methods. I brought a couple of their ball things too. The ones I have brought in pet shops are too hard and my dogs aren't interested in them. They love the cat type ones though and softer balls so I am hoping the inbetween type will be good. If you do order some, let us know what you think. I will do the same when I receive them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarka Posted January 15, 2006 Share Posted January 15, 2006 If you do order some, let us know what you think. I will do the same when I receive them. I'd be interested to see if the DVDs play in your player. Do you have a multi-region one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latisha Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 Yep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 K: It also shows how to teach dogs to "enjoy" corrections through drive training. K9: I have spent a good many years working with people that hadthat philosophy, but when I watched the dogs what they did is give multiple corrections with the dog in drive to "elevate the drive" they said. I feel all that occurs when done in this method is turn on the nerves of the dog which is easily mistaken for elevation of drive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelpie-i Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 K9, that's an interesting thought on this technique. I've only ever watched it on the DVD and they did mentioned that it was elevating the drive response...and in turn the dog learned to cope better with the corrections. Interesting..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latisha Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 I may be way off here but isn't the point of corrections to reduce the particular action? If you are doing it with the aim of elevating the drive, what happens when you really have to use a correction? Wouldn't it have to be ten times higher in force? I would imaging training in drive should limit the amount of corrections ever needed to be used but I am a bit confused. If you are trying to get a dog to like corrections (and in turn use them a lot), wouldn't it be raising its threshold for pain rather than elevating drive? In a human perspective, if someone kept giving me a correction (even just saying no), I would probably freeze and give up because in my mind I wouldn't be doing anything right so whats the point of trying. I don't think I could be conditioned to enjoy corrections. On the other hand, if someone showed me something I liked and when I did something right I got it (in my case, chocolate would work!!), I would be much more willing to work harder for it in future to get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 (edited) In a human perspective, if someone kept giving me a correction (even just saying no), I would probably freeze and give up because in my mind I wouldn't be doing anything right so whats the point of trying. I don't think I could be conditioned to enjoy corrections. On the other hand, if someone showed me something I liked and when I did something right I got it (in my case, chocolate would work!!), I would be much more willing to work harder for it in future to get it. Discussional level only, Latisha, 'cause I don't know much about the theory of correction elevating drive either, but, using a slightly different version of your human analogy: Put your hand in an empty box and receive a mild elastic band flick. Not pleasant, so you quickly (and probably by reflex) withdraw. I expect you wouldn't want to go put your hand back in the empty box. But put your hand in a box that contains $1000.00 that you can have if you reach it (this being the equivalent of the dog's drive goal), and I'd expect you'd cope better with receiving the elastic band flick. Whilst I don't know much about the theory of correction elevating drive, I'd guess that the correction would not be so harsh as to act as an aversive to the dog? Would it be considered more a stimulation that excites/frustrates the dog? Given that the dog's energies are being channelled into drive, this is where that excitement energy is aimed, therefore heightening drive? Do I make any sense at all? Edited January 16, 2006 by Erny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latisha Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 On a discussional level your example makes sense too. I guess in these examples it depends on the kind of person you are, if you are motivated etc. For the trainers that use this method, what is the point of elevating drive through corrections (besides obviously elevating drive) ? Is there a reason why they use corrections to do so rather than other methods? Is it just personal preference? I know what I am trying to ask but can't put it into words so this doesn't really make sense. it was elevating the drive response...and in turn the dog learned to cope better with the corrections Is this the point of why they do it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 But put your hand in a box that contains $1000.00 that you can have if you reach it (this being the equivalent of the dog's drive goal), and I'd expect you'd cope better with receiving the elastic band flick. On a discussion level only as well isnt the $1000 that elevates your drive? not the flick of the band..... Yes youd put up with the flick for a $1000 but Id imagine it would be better if there was no flick all together there, yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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