Marianne Posted November 18, 2005 Share Posted November 18, 2005 They gave two as Norocarp doesn't come in tablet form, only injectable. Rimadyl does the same thing but comes in a tablet form for the owner to continue the meds at home. So injection at the clinic and tablets to go home. In response to the vet that said 'he must have picked up a virus from the RSPCA'. There is no way to prove he picked anything up from there. Thats a bit harsh, the dog could have picked anything up from anywhere, just like you and I do. The vet has given antibiotics as a precaution but without blood tests you cannot be sure if it is a virus. A blood test would show an increase in white cells. The first vet was ok to give both injections (vacc & heartworm). The reaction rate is extremely low but you have to be aware that any drug can cause a reaction just like drugs with you and I. The first vet would not have been too concerned as reactions generally present themselves within 20 minutes of the injections. It is not unusual for a pet to be 'off colour' for 24-48 following a vaccination due to the immune system being compromised (better to compromise it for 48 hrs however than get Parvo where they will be vomiting blood and die a terrible death!). The first vet let you down with their follow up service and clear lack of patient care. As it was more than 3 days & your dog is still not well the vet should have looked at the dog, not the nurse. Being a nurse myself I would have expected the vet look at the animal in this case. The drugs you got from your second vet are routine to cover all bases. Pain Relief and Antibiotics. Personally I'm not too keen on Welfare agencies with veterinary clinics, I've seen some hideous malpractice cases come from them. Just my opinion anyway but a private practice is always better in my eyes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marianne Posted November 18, 2005 Share Posted November 18, 2005 Did the original vet listen to the dogs chest? How old is the dog? Heart disease is not uncommon especially in small dogs. Did they do an Xray or ultrasound. How did they diagnose degenerative heart disease? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
girl05 Posted November 18, 2005 Author Share Posted November 18, 2005 So what you are saying is that you believe that the Vet who vaccinated your dog caused your dog to rupture a muscle in its heart??That is a very serious accusation. I would like to know how your new Vet knows that this is what has happned. Yes thats what I believe. I know its a serious accusation and unfortunately I can't prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
girl05 Posted November 18, 2005 Author Share Posted November 18, 2005 (edited) They gave two as Norocarp doesn't come in tablet form, only injectable. Rimadyl does the same thing but comes in a tablet form for the owner to continue the meds at home. So injection at the clinic and tablets to go home.In response to the vet that said 'he must have picked up a virus from the RSPCA'. There is no way to prove he picked anything up from there. Thats a bit harsh, the dog could have picked anything up from anywhere, just like you and I do. The vet has given antibiotics as a precaution but without blood tests you cannot be sure if it is a virus. A blood test would show an increase in white cells. The first vet was ok to give both injections (vacc & heartworm). The reaction rate is extremely low but you have to be aware that any drug can cause a reaction just like drugs with you and I. The first vet would not have been too concerned as reactions generally present themselves within 20 minutes of the injections. It is not unusual for a pet to be 'off colour' for 24-48 following a vaccination due to the immune system being compromised (better to compromise it for 48 hrs however than get Parvo where they will be vomiting blood and die a terrible death!). The first vet let you down with their follow up service and clear lack of patient care. As it was more than 3 days & your dog is still not well the vet should have looked at the dog, not the nurse. Being a nurse myself I would have expected the vet look at the animal in this case. The drugs you got from your second vet are routine to cover all bases. Pain Relief and Antibiotics. Personally I'm not too keen on Welfare agencies with veterinary clinics, I've seen some hideous malpractice cases come from them. Just my opinion anyway but a private practice is always better in my eyes! Thanks for your response. Yes I am aware that any drugs can cause a reaction,though as you said it was more than 3 days and my dog still wasn't well and I was brushed off and told "he will be fine" I knew he wouldn't be thats why we went to seek a second opinion.The new vet was good except thinking back now he didn't listen to my dogs heart. I have no idea why he didn't. Finally at the animal hospital(the third place where we took him) they found out what was wrong with several tests. So much for the RSPCA telling me he will be"fine" he could have passed away if we didn't take him to the animal hospital! Edited November 18, 2005 by girl05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
girl05 Posted November 18, 2005 Author Share Posted November 18, 2005 Did the original vet listen to the dogs chest? How old is the dog? Heart disease is not uncommon especially in small dogs. Did they do an Xray or ultrasound. How did they diagnose degenerative heart disease? The orginal vet listened to my dogs chest.Nothing was wrong with him before we took him there, if something was wrong with his heart how come she couldn't hear anything wrong? My dog is 11 and half yrs old, as said before he was fine before the original vet visit.He was healthy and happy. He had chest xrays, blood tests, heart ultrasound. He had lots of fluid on his lungs and they gave him an injection to help clear the fluid which helped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rappie Posted November 18, 2005 Share Posted November 18, 2005 if something was wrong with his heart how come she couldn't hear anything wrong? Unfortunately, there isn't always a whole lot to hear. I recently saw a dog in acute congestive failure of the left and right side of the heart - the recent history suggested that it had only been going on for a week. The only change the owners perceived that they had seen was a swollen abdomen - however after taking a very deep and thorough history it became evident that it had probably been brewing slowly for a couple of months. There was a questionable heart murmur - I thought I heard it in the consult but wasn't sure, I borrowed the dog and took it to the treatment room where it was much quieter and myself and 2 other vets couldn't agree on whether there actually was a murmur - despite there obviously being a cardiac problem. The problem with heart murmurs and chest auscultation is that you are hearing a sound that is the product of a defect of some kind. The smallest and least significant defects often produce the loudest noises, often something quite sinister doesn't make any significant sound. Even if I heard a low grade murmur in a small breed dog of 11 years old, I wouldn't jump right into diagnostic work unless the dog was showing clinical signs or there was something that concerned me in the history. As for whether the first vet was responsible - that IS a very big accusation and not one that I think you can prove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirra_Bomber_Zeus Posted November 18, 2005 Share Posted November 18, 2005 The first vet was ok to give both injections (vacc & heartworm). The reaction rate is extremely low but you have to be aware that any drug can cause a reaction just like drugs with you and I. The first vet would not have been too concerned as reactions generally present themselves within 20 minutes of the injections. It is not unusual for a pet to be 'off colour' for 24-48 following a vaccination due to the immune system being compromised (better to compromise it for 48 hrs however than get Parvo where they will be vomiting blood and die a terrible death!). Sorry Marianne but I dont agree with the vet giving the 2 injections at all - that is way too much of an assult on a puppies immune system. Also, after the research I've done the reaction rate doesnt seem to be 'extremely low' at all - due to the fact that, like the first vet that girl05 went to see, there are way too many vets that dont want to know / dont believe it when a dog has a reaction - so, lo and behold, a whole heap of reactions go unreported. Some reactions present themselves within a short period of time (like swelling of the face - which is what happened to my dog) but lots of symptoms of reactions actually present over the next few months (such as the near destruction of my dogs immune system and the severe allergies suffered by my dog over the next few months - by the way, made much much worse by my vet telling me the swelling my dog suffered "happens all the time" and loading her up with cortisone) I guess it is a matter of opinion as to whether you are compromising your dogs health for "48 hours" or whether following a reaction their health is actually compromised for much longer - and maybe life. (Sorry, but I know from experience and lots and lots of research!!) Girl05 - yes, your accusation is a serious one - but if it was me - I would be following it up. After what I have been through with my dog - I wish I had of followed up everything I thought was strange that the vet said or did. I find it a little bit too much of a coincidence that the heart failure just happend to come on on the day you vaccinated your dog - and the vet visit or vaccines had nothing to do with it. Doesnt wash with me. Jen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
girl05 Posted November 22, 2005 Author Share Posted November 22, 2005 (edited) Today we took him to the vet and he said my dog could only have weeks -months left. Initially before we went ahead with everything they told us he has a good chance and now this. Today we got told he has a ruptured chordae tendinae which makes things worse. My poor dog,theres nothing else we can do except keep giving him his medicine and hope he will last. we are so upset. Edited November 22, 2005 by girl05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I am sooooo very sorry to hear about what has happened to your beloved dog. I would never consider giving 2 vaccinations at the same time as well as heartworm medication too. Its just overloading the dogs immune system with too many toxins. We always space out any vaccinations and/or medications that our dogs may need just to be on the safe side. We almost lost our daughter to a vaccine reaction years ago after being told it was completely safe. Never believe everything you are told by the so called "experts", always go with your gut feeling and do your own research is what I believe. I hope your dog will have a long and happy life after this awful ordeal. How stressful! Give him a hug from us ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Shepherd mom Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Oh girl05, how awful. Have you done some internet searching to find more information? You must be so upset. Try not to let your feelings out when he's around. You don't want to be upseting him since he won't understand why you guys are unhappy. I'm sending positive thoughts your way. I hope you are able to prolong his life without him suffering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pampa Posted November 26, 2005 Share Posted November 26, 2005 Oh dear, girl 05, I'm so very sad for you ! Just as a comparaison, all of my dogs have always been vaccinated in one hit, once a year... They get : Distemper, Parvo, Infectious Hepatitis, Para Infuenza, and Rabies all at once. They don't get treated for heartworm because it isn't necessary where I live. I also wormed them the same day with a VERY hefty medication I give them twice a year... As you see, this is a hell of a lot of terrible things injected / administrated at any one time and they showed no bad reaction... It is interesting to note however, that a discussion is raging in europe and the US whether or not to vaccinate EVERY TWO YEARS instead of every single year... Just another by-note, I'm planning to come back to Australia soon with my dogs and I had to have a RNAAT test done (rabies anti-body count) whereby the anti-bodies needed to be at least 0.5 IU/ml. I had blood drawn BEFORE they received their yearly booster and guess what, their anti-body count from LAST YEARS booster was 2.62 for two of them, and 3.46 for the third !!! 4-6 times more than necessary... They would still be over the required anti-body count in two years time, three years after the last vaccination ! This example is ONLY for rabies as it is the only test I have had taken out at this stage, but I agree with my vet who believes that we are over-vaccinating our pets... If this is the case, the whole veterinary history on vaccinations needs to be re-written and your vet was only doing his job, what he learned in scholl and is paid to do. I know you need to blame someone, but I don't think it is fair to put that blame on your vet. It may have been simple coincidence, or simply the stress of going to the vet's that triggered this in your boys heart. We send our warm thoughts and have paws and fingers crossed for him though I know all too well that this is little comfort when you are seeing your beloved boy decline. Rachel XOXOXO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
girl05 Posted December 12, 2005 Author Share Posted December 12, 2005 Thank you everyone for your well wishes, though unfortunately we had to put my little boy to sleep a week ago. He was very very ill. It was the hardest most heartbreaking thing that I've ever had to do and go through. I miss him so much. I'm very upset and I'm having a hard time coming to terms with what suddenly happened to my little friend. It hurts so much. He was part of our family and very special to all of us. Rest in peace my precious friend. :D xxoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squeak Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 I'm so sorry for your loss. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pampa Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 Oh I'm so sorry :D Your heart must be bleeding dry. This was so sudden and unexpected, I can't believe he went downhill so fast and that you lost him... I wish I could say something to ease the pain but this is obviously impossible, I can only send my sincere thoughts to you I guess the injustice of never knowing WHY or WHAT really happened must almost be as painful as the loss of your friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Shepherd mom Posted December 16, 2005 Share Posted December 16, 2005 How awful. I am so sorry you lost your little one. Rest in peace little one and keep an eye on your loved ones who cry for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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