Steve K9Pro Posted November 4, 2005 Author Share Posted November 4, 2005 LL: That being said, they are not robots, as in retrieving trials they are expected to hunt out of sight without direction from the handler. K9: I have had the "robot dogs" comment thrown at me many times, it still aggravates me a little but it also tells me how accurate people see their training.. lol.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted November 4, 2005 Author Share Posted November 4, 2005 WP: Because you are his pack leader and he trusts you to protect him therefore unlikly to react unless you give him the green light to K9: thats cheating, you seen it done with your dog lol.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winterpaws Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Ahhh but i forgot and paid the price :rolleyes: At least something is starting to sink in now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted November 4, 2005 Author Share Posted November 4, 2005 K9: no one learns this stuff overnite, in fact it took me more than ten years to feel confident enough to talk about drives & nerves without thinking it through. I would be envious of anyone who knew it all in no time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 I am such a selfish person, I want to move to the use of praise/encouragement now!!!!!!!! I have found many people who are trying to encourage prey drive, do not praise their dogs enough and they technique is poor (mind you I have only three videos of the subject, LOL). I have seen a few police dog "prospects" being tested nevertheless. But overall my education is limited. Regarding custom dogs, again, my eyes nearly fell out of my head with the praise/ encouragement/rewards, the handlers were giving their dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted November 4, 2005 Author Share Posted November 4, 2005 K9: one thing I love about training in prey, When the dog is conditioned, this means that subconsciously, he WANTS to complete the excercise. He obeys commands to make this happen, this also means, his mind holds him back, when he lets go, he goes into high drive & completes the task, which is your task... Its not you trying to make him do something he doesnt want... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogibear Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 LL i find that with people who use clicker they stop praising and expect the clicker to take over. I love using prey drive because i love the reaction i get from the dog and from people watching the dog work they are always amazed at how up the dog is. now im off to tease the dog with his toy again yb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 K9: one thing I love about training in prey,When the dog is conditioned, this means that subconsciously, he WANTS to complete the excercise. He obeys commands to make this happen, this also means, his mind holds him back, when he lets go, he goes into high drive & completes the task, which is your task... Its not you trying to make him do something he doesnt want... I am confused, as per normal, AGAIN, what you mean K9 force? My fault entirely, not yours. How does a dog subsciously know what he/she/us want? Yogibear, I do not know much about the clicker (or obviously how to quote multiple posts, LOL) but from what I have studied it is used as a marker, Pavlov? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogibear Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Yup thast right Ll trouble is a lot of people become clinical and think it is a replacemnet for praise and interaction yb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Yup thast right Ll trouble is a lot of people become clinical and think it is a replacemnet for praise and interactionyb Um, er, sure.................but I have also seen many a time, praise given when totally unwarranted, in my humble opinion, which may/can/does confuse the dog. Many a time, I have praised my dogs, and I think, in reality, it makes me feel better, not the dog. But then again, I have Stamp, who I did not praise/to release tension/drive enough. K9 force? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Just an add on, if I may Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogibear Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Yup i agree that is true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purple Julie Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 K9, it is annoying that your threads increase by four pages a day, and I don't have the time to read through all of this thread as it is nearly bedtime! :rolleyes: So, having not read much of this thread, I am asking my questions. Sorry if they have been covered already. K9, do your dogs bark and carry on like Jyra does when it cannot get to a prey item that they desparately want? I think the answer is "of course not, they're trained in drive". Probably a silly question! Ok, so as I mentioned in the other post, Jyra will bark and carry on when she is in what I have just now called, 'prey drive frustration'. That is, when she sees Lablovers dogs doing retreives (as you saw), when she is waiting for her turn to do lure coursing, etc. Also when I did as you suggested and had her tied out and I played with the ball. She does all this nonsense. My question is, how do I control that without reducing her drive? Like if you tell her to sit in this situation and say she does, she won't hold it long, because of her excitement and desire to chase, but then if you correct her for breaking the sit, that decreases the drive. So it'd be really nice to know how to queue up for lure coursing without having a mad dog on my hands. Any suggestions? Other than queuing up without her! Another question, when the dog is holding the prey item, carrying it, is it still in drive? (I think so) And if so, what level/degree of drive is the dog in? (ie initialisation, peak, etc) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purple Julie Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Ah, I see that Haven already asked the same thing as me on page one! (Yes, now I am being naughty and staying up late reading the posts!) About a dog being/not being in two drives at once or switching quickly between drives: When I took Jyra to the herding workshop, and she was on her back legs looking over the fence at the sheep (cheeky girl!), sometimes she'd be fine with a dog next to her, then other times, she'd notice it and react to it. I think that Jyra was in prey drive as she was looking at the sheep and that is why she didn't react to the dogs, but then how come at other times, she did? K9: & here is a twist, this is why I allow other say fear aggressive dogs to play with my GSD. I want Jyra to meet your GSD. K9: It's the secret little reason all these people keep telling me how much their dogs love me... You've just got the magic touch! Anyway, a big thank you to Steve for giving all this free information to the world. I'm sure it does help you to get new clients, Steve, but there are also a lot who are just getting this info for free and you are getting no profit from it (except for intrinstic satisfaction maybe). So yes, a big thank you to Steve. Really enjoy reading your posts and really appreciate your advice. :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogibear Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Ok question 3minutes 3times a day seven day s aweek with dog tethered do you frustrate the dog and let him capture the prey oty now and again, never a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatevah Posted November 5, 2005 Share Posted November 5, 2005 Switching Between Drives. I take my dogs to the local park and play ball with them, they love this. I have done a lot of premack with my dogs as well. At the park there is this noisy non stop barking dog. In the past I have taught Moses that if he barks he gets nothing. When he was a young pup, if he barked while i was preparing his food, I stopped preparing it and started again when he stopped barking. Okay this non stop barking dog is barking in my dogs ear hole, very annoying, so I don't throw the ball until it stops barking. My dog who is focussed on me gets sick of this barking in his ear hole, then suddenly turns around and barks in this other dogs face and chases him for a couple of paces away, then straight away runs back to me and focuses on my toy waiting for it to be thrown. Is this an example of switching drives? Does Moses think that the dog has to be quiet before I will throw the ball and is telling the dog to shoosh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickie Posted November 5, 2005 Share Posted November 5, 2005 (edited) Um, er, sure.................but I have also seen many a time, praise given when totally unwarranted, in my humble opinion, which may/can/does confuse the dog. Many a time, I have praised my dogs, and I think, in reality, it makes me feel better, not the dog. LL, here you go again...tempting me to hijack a bit. I've been thinking about this a lot lately. I got told at a herding seminar recently..."Quit praising that dog! She doesn't need it & you're just irritating her!" I think what he was trying to say is that for her the work itself is the reward & every time I stopped to praise her, I was really interrupting her work unnecessarily and for her it was almost a negative thing rather than a positive one. I see it sometimes in agility too...I'll stop & reward for something tricky done successfully. Sometimes I think she's indulging me by letting me reward her, she knows the sequence will continue & would much rather be doing that. It's kind of... :rolleyes: OK I'll tug if I must, but c'mon, hurry it up...we got a course to complete! Edited November 5, 2005 by Vickie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelpie-i Posted November 5, 2005 Share Posted November 5, 2005 Toilet Duck, here are the drive swtiches: Looking at the ball awaiting your throw: prey (play) Chasing the other dog away: defence Coming back to you: pack Looking at the ball again: prey(play) I would say there would be a small section of intermingled drives between his initial inention on the ball and deciding to chase the barking dog away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haven Posted November 5, 2005 Share Posted November 5, 2005 Anyway, a big thank you to Steve for giving all this free information to the world. I'm sure it does help you to get new clients, Steve, but there are also a lot who are just getting this info for free and you are getting no profit from it (except for intrinstic satisfaction maybe). So yes, a big thank you to Steve. Really enjoy reading your posts and really appreciate your advice. :rolleyes: Second that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted November 5, 2005 Share Posted November 5, 2005 Um, er, sure.................but I have also seen many a time, praise given when totally unwarranted, in my humble opinion, which may/can/does confuse the dog. Many a time, I have praised my dogs, and I think, in reality, it makes me feel better, not the dog. LL, here you go again...tempting me to hijack a bit. I've been thinking about this a lot lately. I got told at a herding seminar recently..."Quit praising that dog! She doesn't need it & you're just irritating her!" I think what he was trying to say is that for her the work itself is the reward & every time I stopped to praise her, I was really interrupting her work unnecessarily and for her it was almost a negative thing rather than a positive one. I see it sometimes in agility too...I'll stop & reward for something tricky done successfully. Sometimes I think she's indulging me by letting me reward her, she knows the sequence will continue & would much rather be doing that. It's kind of... OK I'll tug if I must, but c'mon, hurry it up...we got a course to complete! Hey, Vickie, I am glad you are not a good quoter either. I wish I knew how to multiple quote. One day I will remember to ask a visitor. I think handlers praise too, thinking their dogs attitudes may lift - particulary when the requirements are multilevel, instead of simplifying the task (even a little) and breaking down the handlers requirements. As this thread is on prey drive control and focus, I think it is wonderful that we are all interested, but when it comes down to it, in my humble opinion, not many dogs particularly those not considered "working" breeds, training using prey drive may not be the drive to train with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now