C7 Vaccination

[KitKat]

I was chatting to a vet nurse the other day and asked about vaccinations, she said their vet only offered C7 for adult dogs as he didn't think anything less was up to standard. They are also going to do the once every 3 year option with the vacc's as they do in the US once it's approved here in Aus. So that has got me leaning towards them as well, but i'm just curious as to others opinions of the C7 Vacc. It has been available for the last 3 years in Aus apparently...but none of the vets i have been to have even mentioned it, only offering C3's, C4's and C5's with no mention of any others.

[MolassesLass]

C5 - Distemper, Hepatitis, Parvovirus, Kennel Cough, Bordetella.

C6 - C5 + Coronavirus and Leptospirosis

C7 - C6 + Bordetella bronchiseptica

There's quite a lot of evidence that KC/Bordetella components aren't nessecary nor particularly useful.

Leptospirosis can be a problem in Australia, mostly in Qld according to statistics. It's a very big problem up around Mackay according to this vet. But in saying that, I've never heard of a case in all my years.

Coronavirus:

Coronavirus infections are not generally associated with high death rates. Canine Coronavirus is not new to the canine population; it has been known to exist for decades. Most domestic dogs, especially adults, have measurable Coronavirus antibody titers indicating that they were exposed to canine Coronavirus at some time in their life. Its importance as an infectious disease and killer of dogs has probably been overestimated by vaccine manufacturers and some veterinary authorities.

Source

I have been looking into the PetPlan insurance and noted this:

You must arrange for your pet to be kept vaccinated against the following. Dogs: distemper, hepatitis, leptospirosis and parvovirus.

...

If you do not keep your pet vaccinated, we will not pay any claims that result

from any illness it must be vaccinated against.

Most of us would not be vaccinating against this and so wouldn't be covered for it, if on a PetPlan insurance policy.

[SengeChow]

Re: C7 - Personally you couldn't pay me to put all those toxins into the body of one of my dogs.

My "guru-ess" for all things vaccine related is W. Jean Dodds, DVM - the leading veterinary immunologist whose substantial research is responsible for the chage in vaccine protocols. Here's a direct quote from her:

W JEAN DODDS:

After 1 year, annually measure serum antibody titers against specific canine infectious agents such as distemper and parvovirus.

This is especially recommended for animals previously experiencing adverse vaccine reactions or breeds at higher risk for such reactions (e.g., Weimaraner, Akita, American Eskimo, Great Dane).

Another alternative to booster vaccinations is homeopathic nosodes. This option is considered an unconventional treatment that has not been scientifically proven to be efficacious. One controlled parvovirus nosode study did not adequately protect puppies under challenged conditions. However, data from Europe and clinical experience in North America support its use. If veterinarians choose to use homeopathic nosodes, their clients should be provided with an appropriate disclaimer and written informed consent should be obtained.

I use only killed 3 year rabies vaccine for adults and give it separated from other vaccines by 3-4 weeks. In some states, they may be able to give titer test result in lieu of booster.

I do NOT use Bordetella, corona virus, leptospirosis or Lyme vaccines unless these diseases are endemic in the local area or specific kennel. Furthermore, the currently licensed leptospira bacterins do not contain the serovars causing the majority of clinical leptospirosis today.

I do not recommend vaccinating bitches during estrus, pregnancy or lactation.

If you want more information about her research into vaccines & protocols, I would receommend the following website as the first step.

http://www.itsfortheanimals.com/DODDS-CHG-VACC-PROTOCOLS.HTM

[Kirra_Bomber_Zeus]

SengeChow

W Jean Dodds has lots of wonderful information on the harmful qualities of vaccines. I read alot of her stuff a couple of years ago when I first started my research.

I have used homeopathic nosodes. I know they have not been 'scientifically proven' (not that this holds much sway with me anymore) but in all honesty, my vet couldnt guarantee to me that my dog was protected if it was immunised by them either. How can you prove a vaccine is working? Just because your dog doesnt get sick, doesnt mean the vaccine is working. My dogs have never had any of the diseases I am supposed to vaccinate for - yet they are not vaccinated either

Jen

[Beanzy]

I figure if we vaccinate our kids on the say so of medical professionals, shouldn't we do the same for our furry kids?

But then again I'm one of these "If the Doc thinks we should, then we should!" types. A little too blindly trusting at times I suppose...

[Kirra_Bomber_Zeus]

Newby0005 - I wouldnt vaccinate my kids either - sorry! (Not that I have any yet, but its a decision I have already made)

I am one of the 'research into stuff before you do it not just become someone tells you to - especially when they have a financial interest in it' people. By this I mean the 'bonus' that doctors apparantly get at the end of the year for the amount of people they have vaccinated from the companies that make the vaccines.

Way too much info about vaccines and Autism and ADD etc for me and way too much info about how many children still get illnesses they are vaccinated against (such as whooping cough).

the reports that show that 'vaccines' that they say 'cured diseases' such as polio dont show the fact that these diseases had actually declined by 90% before the vaccines were introduced. Now in the USA the only people who get polio are the ones that get it from the vaccine.

I am truly sorry if I offend here and I will stop rabbiting on now - I truly dont mean too upset anyone, and I dont mean to come across as saying other people should do what I do because I say so - I just feel very strongly about this sort of thing because I have researched into it and dont like what I have found.

Jen

[Miranda]

I wouldn't allow a C7 anywhere near my dogs, they get a C3 at 16 months and that's it. I would be finding a new vet.

[JAG]

Molasseslass I asked about the Lepto part of the petplan insurance and this is the response I got.

"After discussion with our Consulting Vet, we find that most Vet's in areas where Lepto is prevalent are giving lepto vacc's with normal 6,12 & 16 week programme.

But we find in area's where it is not prevalent, that is not the case. So were are taking the approach that we will treat a claim for lepto on the basis of what is normal for the location and pay according."

Gwen Ford (Q.P.I.B)

Dip. Fin. Services (Ins Broking)

Director

Petplan & Petplan Equine

Cheers Jag

[dogcop]

V.E.T. = VERY EXPERIMENTAL TREATMENT = VERY EXPENSIVE TREATMENT!!!

Pharmecutical Companies give doctors bonuses aren't VETS DOCTORS?

Keep hammering away people maybe we recognise more of the bad effects we see in our dogs than what we care to think of in our kids ?

I won't appologise for having attitude on this subject. For way too long we have been intimidated into thinking we are being looked after (by that I mean our dogs)

by honest caring highly trained people.

Let me give you an example. Vet location North East Vic graduated W.A Specialty Dolphins. Mountainous area Victoria ???? Terrified of horses Yet gets around with sticker on 4x4 VET ON CALL SILVER BRUMBY !! Diagnosed mare as being pregnant performed tests to confirm with posotive result. Later found to be suffering from aggravated bowell syndrome !! Gave a lab anesthetic to bath it dog was dead when owner came to pick it up ! Little girl got dad to take her gold fish in to see what was wrong with it. Vet asked if it has been URINATING more than usual. Dad replies yes i've been taking out a glass and a half of water evry day. Five minutes late dumbo realises what it has said.

Not suggesting that all vets are like this but it does make me wonder. Too many of them concentrate on being sales people. When will we be able to buy bread and milk from a doctors surgery maybe get our hair done.

Its good to see a few Brits and Americans coming clean hopefully it won't stop there.

[Nadia]

Personally I wouldn't have any of my dogs vaccinated with C7.

I made an informed choice not to over vaccinate my dogs, and I will stick to it.

As for vaccinating pups with C7, bombarding a baby puppies immune system with that amount of vaccine is disgusting.

We wonder why our dogs have so many health issues, immune problems, skin issues, yet continue to pump them full of crap.

Poor dogs that are subjected to multiple vaccines, yearly heartworm, monthly doses of chemicals for every parasite known to man, and owners wonder why they have dogs with stuffed immune systems.

If your Vet is not up to speed on the changes that are happening with vaccine protocol, discuss it with them, go in armed with information and discuss with them your preferred protocol for your animals.

Not all Vets are morons, it takes time to change the way of thinking of some, but it is owners responsibility to be informed as well.

[JackieW]

The C3 that's OK for 3 years should be available pretty soon. Apparently it's the same vaccination, just the packet insert now says it's OK for up to 39 months (so I suppose it's a matter of waiting for vets to get the new stocks).

From what I've read the lepto vaccination is only good for 9 months. Where I live we don't have lepto or coronavirus so I'm not interested in a C7. Too much stuff in one injection anyway IMO. The kennel cough component of the C4 doesn't cover against all strains, in fact only a couple out of 14 or something.

Newby0005, from what I have read there has NEVER been any scientific basis for annual vaccination, it was just decided on by the manufacturers.

[JackieW]

I've just been looking around and this is an interesting website -

http://www.caberfeidh.com/Revax.htm - Coronavirus

This is the classic "vaccine in search of a disease." Except in very young puppies, coronavirus does not seem to cause clinical disease in dogs. They cannot induce disease with it in the laboratory. Many, perhaps most, dogs have coronavirus in their intestine all their lives. (Schultz, "Emerging Issues: Vaccination Strategies for Canine Viral Enteritis," 1995.) According to Texas A&M University's "Vaccine Protocols and Schedule," "(T)here are no studies that show that use of the vaccine reduces morbidity or mortality. (Mansfield 1996.) "The risk has to be said to outweigh the benefit on this one, as there doesn't appear to be any benefit.

and

1. "The incidence of canine distemper, canine parvovirus, canine adenovirus, and feline panleukopenia among vaccinated adults (>1 year of age) is virtually zero. The correlation among vaccination, the development of a "positive" antibody response, and protection from exposure to virulent virus is excellent. Furthermore, protection from exposure derived from immunization is sustained for periods as long as 5 or 6 years or more." (Kirk's Current Veterinary Therapy XIII; 2000; "Vaccines and Vaccinations: Issue for the 21st Century", Richard B. Ford and Ronald D. Schultz.)

2. "A practice that was started many years ago and that lacks scientific validity or verification is annual revaccinations. Almost without exception there is no immunologic requirement for annual revaccination. Immunity to viruses persists for years or for the life of the animal." (Kirk's Current Veterinary Therapy XI, "Canine and Feline Vaccines," Phipps, Schultz.)

[DogsBestFriend]

My dog was extremely ill after the C7 - it caused his immune system to attack itself - as such I wont be doing it again

[InspectorRex]

DosBestFriend- hope you and/or your Vet contacted the Manufactur of the C7 Vaccine and that they paid for any of your Vet bills that arose from this

[Dali-love]

if it is the vet I think it is, he only charge $66 for a C7 wich is $10 less than an average vet charges for a C5. This is a really good vet and I have been coming here for years. He told me that the other vets are not up to date......

[DogsBestFriend]

IR - ythink? No - it was of course a breed related problem - I couldnt prove it was related to the C7 - bunch of bastards - wont be going there again.