Desexing

[Alibear]

Is there different ways of getting your puppy desexed. My dad said to me that I should really be able to just get it done like a male human does and just get the "snip". I just thought that was what happened - obviously I very unclear on the procedure.

Can anyone tell me what actually happens? Do they actually take his penis and testicles away so he will look like a girl?

[KitKat]

Male dogs can get the 'snip' and more or less just have their bits tied...or they can have the testes fully removed.

For a full desexing all they remove is the testes out of the sac and the sac shrinks away to almost nothing.

If you go the other way and i can't for the life of me remember the exact name of the op is when they go in and tie off the tubes from the testes...this leaves the dog with his balls but they acn't do much with them...eg help create puppies. Not all vets will do this op whereas all will do a full desexing.

I'd go a full desexing as the the old comment describes "sticks out like dogs balls" adn since i'm not breeding my dogs..they had to go as it's not a pretty sight

[Mana]

... And it gets rid of the risk of testicular cancer if you whip em out.

Also, if they are subsequently removed entirely when the dog is adult, they leave a pretty funny looking sac! Our foster lab has just had the chop at 5 and a half years old, and he's got this wrinkly thing like a squashed tennis ball between his thighs! (The stitches don't really help on the aesthetics front though!).

And no - they don't take away his penis! he needs that for his piddling-work even if there's no pup-making-work for him to do!

ETA - I also saw an add for a contraceptive implant in the latest issue of Dog's Life. Does this work in males as well as females? Not that I'd ever want to used this instead, but would it have the same behavioural effects as desexing?

Edited June 24, 2005 by Mana

[MolassesLass]

Can anyone tell me what actually happens? Do they actually take his penis and testicles away so he will look like a girl?

They don't remove the penis but the testicles are removed and as KitKat says the scrotum will eventually tuck up and dissappear.

Here's some good information.

WHAT EXACTLY IS DONE SURGICALLY?

An incision is made generally just forward from the scrotum. The testicles are removed through this incision. The stalks are tied off  and cut. Castration is achieved.  If the testicles are not removed, the desirable benefits listed above cannot be achieved. The skin incision may or may not have stitches.

[Vehs]

Vasectomy - snip the vas defrens (?) so that the semen cannot enter the penis. The dog will still have his testes, but like Kitkat said can't reproduce, but will still be affected by testosterone.

The desexing D had was where they fully removed the testes, they slice open the scrotum and pull them out (poor little fella is looking at me with this scared look in his eye, but I think he is just begging for yoghurt drops) he still has his penis and a little bit of skin (covered with fur now) that was the little sack they were in... but it is shrunken

[Alibear]

Ahhh... Interesting!

Is one more expensive then the other? Do they recover better from either one?

The vet I saw the other day (that I didn't like) said that Bear may need to be sedated for a few days to keep him still after the procedure - is this correct?

[KitKat]

I had a few days off after Bronx was desexed and kept him crated with pee breaks etc after a handful of days he was going nuts so i stuck an elisabethian collar on him and put him outside he was fine. I wouldn't bother about sedating Bear for a few days...it could prove of a hassle then it's worth. Just make sure you grab an elisabethian collar on the way out

Vehs- thanks! that's the word i was looking for!!!

Alibear...it's just as likely that it will cost more for a vasectomy then a normal desexing asyou'll have to find a vet willing to do it. There would be stitches at the sac after both op's so recovery would be much the same. If you go the vasectomy you don't get the benefits of normal desexing...like less smelly pee, let marking everything, less dominant behavour, less hunting down bitches in season, less wandering to look for bitches in general (lol), etc etc

[Alibear]

Thanks a lot.

I had always just thought I would get the "standard" desexing, but was interested when my dad mentioned it the other day. I just didn't realise they actually took the testicles away. I guess I wasn't really thinking about it all that much though!

Another question yet again - what is a elisabethian collar? I bet you knew I would ask that anyway.

[Vehs]

elisabethan collar is those cones around the dogs head, it prevents them from either scratching their ears or turning around and chewing stitches

Generally it seems that boys recover from desexing better than girls, the procedure is less invasive. Dieter was fine the night of his desexing, but slept inside so I could keep an eye on him - he didn't have an elisabethan collar and wasn't too concerned about his stitches either. Common sense, don't let him run and stretch about to much for a few days - week after.

[KitKat]

My boy needed his collar due to read dew claws being removed as well...and it seemed like a good thing...mind you with his long GSD snout he discovered if he stuck his back legs out just right he could reach the stiches on his feet but they have healed up nciely and he doesn't have any scarring so it's all good.

[Alibear]

Ahhh...that is funny to me as when I was growing up we always just called the elisabethan collar a "Bucket" I didn't know there was a real name for it! What is wrong with me

One last question (well at least until you say something else I don't understand any way), what are the read dew claws? At my puppy school I remember the trainer checking Bear and said something about still having the Dew Claws but I didn't know what he said or meant so I didn't think much of it again.

Is this something I should know about and get removed?

[KitKat]

Basically it's like a 'thumb' they have them on their front paws and sometimes dogs will have them on their back paws. It's away from the actuall paw pads and up the foot a touch...if that makes sense... If they are nice and close at the front it's usually ok for them to stay but i would recommend that they be removed off the back paws for GSD's.

[Alibear]

I will have to have a look tonight. So you say not every dog has them? But they are ok on the front right? Why are they are bad thing? Do they cause trouble?

[KitKat]

I think all dogs have them on the front paws but not all have them on the back paws. If they are nice and close 'fitting' on the front then they shouldn't prove a problem. But when they are on the back they often stick out a bit or are all floppy (not all are joined by bone) and can catch on the other leg when running, playing etc.

Some breeds even have double sets i believe

[MolassesLass]

Front Dew Claw

[Divine Angel]

Thankyou everyone- this has been interesting reading!

[Alibear]

OH OK!

Thanks everyone. I will check this out when I get home!

Very informative!

[Troy]

There was a comment here about implants. This is a letter I received from the company concerned to be added to the forum. (I know it is probably advertising but I believe it may interest some on the forum)

Veterinarians strongly recommend castration for several excellent health and contraceptive reasons. However, in breeder, work and show dog communities this permanent solution of surgical castration is often not an option. The increasing knowledge of canine reproductive cycles has allowed the development of pharmacological agents to help these communities get around this problem.

A new implant developed by an Australian company Peptech Animal Health can be used to temporarily prevent testosterone production and therefore render a male infertile. Over a period of six months the implant, containing a gonadotrophin releasing hormone (GnRH) analogue, stops the pituitary gland from producing and releasing the two gonadotrophins that stimulate testosterone production.  When the implant is exhausted, testosterone production recommences and fertility is restored. Veterinarians place the implant under the skin between the shoulder blades via a procedure which is similar to microchipping. The biocompatible implant does not need to be removed.

Breeder, work and show dog owners can now effectively desex their male dogs temporarily without losing the dog’s ability to reproduce in the long term. This is a major advantage as owners can develop more accurate breeding programs by suppressing individual dogs over a particular breeding season. Furthermore, testosterone related diseases can be treated without worrying about future breeding losses.

One of the major testosterone related disease is benign prostatic hyperplasia (BPH). This is a non-cancerous prostate enlargement seen in older dogs that have not been castrated. The condition can cause varying degrees of problems ranging from blood in the urine, constipation, to blockage of the urethra; all of which can cause severe discomfort. Without testosterone, the enlarging of the prostate and side-effects associated with BPH are prevented. The new implant is an important development in treating BPH, because older dogs are often not good candidates for the general anaesthetic that would be required for surgical castration.

Testosterone related behavioural problems such as roaming, aggression, mounting and urine marking can be a problem in dogs from breeder and show communities as the majority of the dogs are intact. These behaviours can be reduced or eliminated with castration but future breeding and showing potential is lost. It is not always guaranteed that the problem will be fixed with surgery. Therefore, the new implant can be used to ‘road-test’ the results of surgery while still maintaining the capability of breeding in the future. If behaviour is modified following implantation, permanent testosterone suppression through surgical castration can be considered as the best long-term option for a particular animal, or the implant induced castration can be maintained by repeated dosing of the implant every 6 months.

Studies have shown that the slow release biocompatible implant, consisting of the GnRH analogue, provides an opportunity for an effective contraceptive for male dogs that has no undesirable side effects.  Currently the treatment is also being tested in wildlife parks and zoos as a way of controlling the population and behaviour of other species including lions, cheetahs, monkeys, dolphins and seals. The American Zoological and Aquarium Society now recommends this implant as the contraceptive method of choice for a number of species. The implant has also been successfully tested in a variety of different female species for both fertility control and urinary incontinence with exciting results. A version that will be effective for a minimum of 12-months is also being developed and should be commercially available in Australia and New Zealand later next  year.

CONTACT YOUR VETERINARIAN FOR MORE INFORMATION

www.peptech.com

[Mana]

Ah -

Thankyou Troy!

Interesting. Not at all feasible for rescue orgs, but I can imagine it would be very useful for breeders if it had no long term side effects.

M.