MonElite Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Back on pray drive. As some of you know I have this bunny in my house and I have been somewhat uncucessfully attempting to use the bunny as a training tool. (Bunny is not but under stress) This morning I had the bunny on the floor and my dog lying in front of a heater not bothered. Bunny moved, dog got up - obviously initialising pray drive. Bunny stoped. Dog moved towards the bunny like a cat, slowly, tip toeing, starying at it etc. BTW most amazing to watch. He was attempting to make the bunny move (I think) but poor bugger got nothing. But what a great way for him to attempt to initialise something to move so that he could chase it. Buny didnt move. Dog got to it, poked it with his nose, licked his ears and returned to in front of the heater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 (edited) I have a question. How are you using the bunny? To initiate prey drive? what is the intended reaction you want and how do you plan to 'redirect' this so it doesn't go too far and put the bunny in danger? Sorry if this has been covered elsewhere. How does this sit too with regulations regarding 'live baiting' such as those laid down for greyhounds? Edited June 2, 2005 by espinay2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 I managed to get her into drive with 'Ready!' in the yard just then - but that time I think it was prey drive because after doing her little bounce which shows she is ready, she went and found a ball. Would getting satisfaction from the obstacles themselves (and rewarding the dog with obstacles) be using play drive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 E: I have a question. How are you using the bunny? To initiate prey drive? K9: I feel Myska is using the bunny to raise the threshold to prey drive with rabbits, E: what is the intended reaction you want and how do you plan to 'redirect' this so it doesn't go too far and put the bunny in danger? K9: redirection is required when drive peaks, this is not going to happen in the controlled environment she has. E: How does this sit too with regulations regarding 'live baiting' such as those laid down for greyhounds? K9: your right, it shouldnt be done. So, neither should any excercise of getting your dog used to other dogs, cats, or any animal for that matter. I feel that your interests lay elsewhere than in the drive discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 K9: again Kavik, it depends on the dog, but I have a separate command for turning on & off each drive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tess32 Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Hmmm, I hope you are quick enough to stop your dog from doing anything harmful to the bunny. Is he in a position to lunge if the rabbit bolts? Do you know signs of stress in a rabbit? I'm sorry but I am finding this situation uncomfortable! Nat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Maybe I'll just have to book in a private lesson and see what you say! (We could work on her dog aggression issues too that way - bonus! Obviously I am leaving her at home and bringing Diesel to the seminar. He is also much easier to figure out than Zoe!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 K9: bring the one you cant figure out to the seminar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 I have a question. How are you using the bunny? To initiate prey drive? what is the intended reaction you want and how do you plan to 'redirect' this so it doesn't go too far and put the bunny in danger? Sorry if this has been covered elsewhere.How does this sit too with regulations regarding 'live baiting' such as those laid down for greyhounds? For some reason, unknown to me, but maybe K9 will know my dog gets into pray drive when I pick the bunny up and carry it in my hands. So I get the bunny, walk around with it resting on my arm and enjoying itself (it likes it) while my dog is in the initialisation stage of pray drive where we get maximum learning capability. I give a comand, dog complies I let the dog snif the bunny, from under my arm. No rocket science and no harm or stress to the bunny. I have put this photo before in another subject, but I dont think that that will come anywhere near the "live baiting" you could clacify this as a down stay under distraction... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 K9: your right, it shouldnt be done.So, neither should any excercise of getting your dog used to other dogs, cats, or any animal for that matter. But the difference is in the first example you are trying to increase drive. In the other examples you are trying to minimise drive. I feel that your interests lay elsewhere than in the drive discussion. No, I am definitely interested in drive and this thread. I am just as interested however, in how you would work in the absence of drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 For some reason, unknown to me, but maybe K9 will know my dog gets into pray drive when I pick the bunny up and carry it in my hands. LOL! Lovely photo. Can you hold the interest as well for, say, a bunny skin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 E: But the difference is in the first example you are trying to increase drive. In the other examples you are trying to minimise drive. K9: training in drive is as I said, controlling which drives are turned on & which are turned off. A dog going into prey drive at the wrong time is as useless as one that wont go into prey drive when you need it to.. E: No, I am definitely interested in drive and this thread. I am just as interested however, in how you would work in the absence of drive. K9: all training in drive techniques require the dog to have the drive you want to work & the nerves to support it. A great way to get all your questions answered is come to a workshop or seminar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Hmmm, I hope you are quick enough to stop your dog from doing anything harmful to the bunny. Is he in a position to lunge if the rabbit bolts?Do you know signs of stress in a rabbit? Tess - yes its a controlled environment, he is not in the position to lunge. No, I dont know the signs of stress in a rabbit, the only two main differeces I can see it the ears back close to the body, not moving (not comfortable about the situation). The other is a happy rabbit moving around, looking around, ears up, stand on hind legs to check out the environment. In fact it goes to the dog by itself. Should there be something else specific that I should be looking for? The only danger that this rabbit is that I will fall in love with it and refuse to give it back to its owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 (edited) Not sure I want to bring Zoe because of her dog aggression. Too much stress for me (and her!). I also think her nerves are not great - certainly when she is in prey drive (or excited generally) her dog aggression needs very little to surface! And if she gets scared, she does not recover well and takes a long time to act normally. EFS Edited June 2, 2005 by Kavik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 K9: its your choice, Im happy to give you ideas on her behaviour & show you how I control unwanted drive initialisation. What ever you prefer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 K9: all training in drive techniques require the dog to have the drive you want to work & the nerves to support it. Which means that many dogs will not be suitable for training in drive techniques? A great way to get all your questions answered is come to a workshop or seminar. Would certainly be interested to see what you make of some of the dogs I have here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tess32 Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 A bunny foster failure? Sometimes it depends on the rabbit - like dogs, some will "shut down" when under stress and appear ultra calm. However some signs are ears held very tightly back, vigorous nose wriggling (less nose thingy - calmer rabbit), bunching up in a ball (a relaxed rabbit almost always sleeps on their side, like a dog - the "common" rabbit position you see is the easiest position for them to break into a run), wide eyes. Ears bent forward is curiosity. The easiest way to tell is how the rabbit sleeps and the most obvious sign of all is that it "binkies" - that's one relaxed rabbit. Nat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Can you hold the interest as well for, say, a bunny skin? Never tried, but its a good idea. And to preampt - if I do it will not be THIS bunnies skin. What I might try for now is to place a fluffy toy with the rabbit for a day or so so it smells like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 I'll have a think about it. I still have lots more questions about Diesel too, I think he has the potential to be a great dog and does not have the hang ups Zoe has, can't bring em both though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Tess - so yes, I have read the body language of the rabbit corectly, he will bunch up in a ball with ears back sort of shut down when I take it out of the enclosure he is in and place it somewhere. After couple of minutes he starts walking around exploring, walking on me while Im sitting, might eat somethig if given etc. hops around on the lounge from one side to another, crossing whoevers laps in order to get to the other side. I dont know how it sleeps, it is in a separate room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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