Protection Against stray and off leash dogs?

[Lolly002]

Hi all

About a month ago my beagle girl was attacked by a stray staffy when bushwalking There were actually 2 staffy's but one bolted away and the other did not even sniff my girl just ran over and latched on! Was pure terror and i did not even have time to pick her up, Luckily i had someone with me and after about 2 minutes of trying to get the dog off (i jumped on it) i was able to seperate them (my girl was squeeling) i then had to put the dog in a choke hold while my mum (who was with me) ran back to the car with my girl. Now this dog was totally out for the kill and was trying to escape my grip for about 20 minutes until local rescue secured the dog. I was very angry that the dog was indeed chipped and the owners were allowed to just simply bail the dog out of the pound the same day! My girl got away with brusing and swelling a few puncture wounds and tissue damage. 

Now as you can imagine i am terrified when out walking now and the amount of off leash dogs i come across is absolutely ridiculous. My girl is now always on "high alert"  and is constantly paranoid that a dog is going to come out and grab her. 

What can i use for protection??  i brought a can of "spray shield" citronella based spray, but what else can i carry for protection?

I'm absolutely beyond shitted off that responsible people have to carry deterants to defend ourselves with because of irresponsible owners! It's not fair.

 

 

Edited October 19, 2020 by Lolly002

[Kazm]

Hi, I really feel for you. My little girl Molly was attacked earlier this year. An 8 kg mini schnauzer in the jaws of a 30 - 40 kg ridgeback. It had escaped its yard and it was solely intent on having Molly. 2 other woman came to our aid thankfully. It was the most terrifying moment of my life.  Molly was in a bad way and nearly didn’t make it. By some miracle and with the excellent help of our vets she is here with us and totally back to her old self. We don’t walk in any parks or side streets now. We just stick to the main road. Molly is perfectly fine but I admit I’m very nervous when I see others walking towards us. I’m no help to you in what you can use as a deterrent. I just wanted to say I totally understand how you feel. Too many irresponsible dog owners out there. Take care and stay safe.  

[Lolly002]

1 hour ago, Kazm said:

Hi, I really feel for you. My little girl Molly was attacked earlier this year. An 8 kg mini schnauzer in the jaws of a 30 - 40 kg ridgeback. It had escaped its yard and it was solely intent on having Molly. 2 other woman came to our aid thankfully. It was the most terrifying moment of my life.  Molly was in a bad way and nearly didn’t make it. By some miracle and with the excellent help of our vets she is here with us and totally back to her old self. We don’t walk in any parks or side streets now. We just stick to the main road. Molly is perfectly fine but I admit I’m very nervous when I see others walking towards us. I’m no help to you in what you can use as a deterrent. I just wanted to say I totally understand how you feel. Too many irresponsible dog owners out there. Take care and stay safe.  

I’m so sorry you’re girl Molly was attacked. People also don’t realise that the effects of the attack are long lasting and permanent in some cases. Our walks will never be the same again. I just wish the owners of these dogs understood how incredibly selfish and irresponsible they are. 

[Cosmolo]

An umbrella is a good deterrent and temporary barrier. Sorry for what happened to your dog- such a distressing experience for everyone. 

[Papillon Kisses]

I’m so sorry to hear of the attack and the psychological damage it has done to your dog.

 

I also have a fearful dog, and for me the first port of call is avoidance and trained behaviours. We walk at times and places where we’re less likely to see other dogs - industrial areas outside business hours can be good for this, and have a bunch of trained behaviours up our sleeves. Things like emergency u-turns to increase distance, find it (treat scatters), go behind me, and he’ll play Look At That when we have more distance. An appropriate fitted and conditioned basket muzzle can also act as a good people-with-dogs-deterrent.

 

Increasing your environmental awareness is also integral. Consider your walk locations not just from a will-I-see-dogs point of view but also if I see them, can I cross the road or go up driveways or hide behind things, and are there blind corners or congested pathways that I need to avoid. If you can pick up your beagle, are there things you can put her onto or into if an attacking or rowdy dog approaches e.g. cars, garbage bins, or those electricity box things.

 

I highly recommend working with a positive trainer, plus a veterinary behaviourist if your dog is more than a little worried. I think registrations might have closed but there’s a Management for Reactive Dogs course on Fenzi at the moment and a webinar of the same name comes up every so often.

 

When off leash dogs approach us my first reaction second to asking the owner to call their dog is to throw high value treats (which you should always have on you anyway) at the other dog. It won’t stop a determined attacker, but it honestly stops most dogs in their tracks and buys you some time to high tail it. The great thing about it is that you’re not adding fuel to the fire with aversives, and the other dog sniffing can be a cue for your dog that they mean no threat. 
 

If you choose to use an umbrella as a shield make sure you use positive reinforcement methods to condition your dog to its use. The last thing you want is to add to your dog’s fear by scaring them with the umbrella when another dog approaches them.

 

 

Edited October 19, 2020 by Papillon Kisses

[Boronia]

A can of personal insect repellent (like the stinkin' Aldi one that looks like Aerogard) is better than citronella, it will choke anything if it's sprayed in the attacking dogs direction. If you remove the spray nozzle and fit the nozzle from a WD40 spray can ( cut the straw to about 1/3 of its length and insert it in the little hole) it will give a more directional spray.

 

edited to add that a spray up the attacker's nose will stop it in it's tracks

Edited October 19, 2020 by Boronia

[tdierikx]

I have personally witnessed my own 2 dogs ignore 2.5 full cans of Police capsicum spray in their faces while having a serious fight. Unfortunately a dog fully in the zone and determined to cause harm can block out many sensations and painful things. Having Police draw their guns on your beloved pets because nothing else was going to stop them is a massive wake-up call... thankfully the dogs actually ran out of steam and stopped of their own accord before the Police pulled any triggers. My heart starts racing even now some years later when I recall that particular incident.

 

Your best protection is avoidance and vigilance IMHO...

 

T.

[Lolly002]

Thank you all for the suggestions! 
I’m trying to find better spots to walk even though we LOVED going for 2 bushwalks a day, but sadly those bushwalks are not the same for us anymore   

I even went to a place that was patrolled regularly by rangers (massive area parklands 25 min drive away) where leash rules were strict, but sadly off leash dogs were there also! When I asked to please leash you’re dogs then I coped a mouthful of abuse. Do these people think it’s a cool thing to do? Or are they just stupidly selfish and think rules don’t apply to them? I can’t even walk 2 houses down from where I live because they have dangerous dogs who have attacked another dog walking past before (called the council nothing was done) 

the issue now is my girl has become reactive and will bark at any dog she sees (not aggressive) but I’m terrified that even a off leash friendly dog might take her barking as a reason to fight.. if you know what I mean? 
I’m considering a vinegar spray as well as a umbrella and insect spray but there’s only so much I can carry while controlling a dog who pulls like a steam train LOL 

I always carry treats so that’s also a idea to occupy a approaching dog. 

 

[Lolly002]

3 hours ago, Boronia said:

A can of personal insect repellent (like the stinkin' Aldi one that looks like Aerogard) is better than citronella, it will choke anything if it's sprayed in the attacking dogs direction. If you remove the spray nozzle and fit the nozzle from a WD40 spray can ( cut the straw to about 1/3 of its length and insert it in the little hole) it will give a more directional spray.

 

edited to add that a spray up the attacker's nose will stop it in it's tracks

Never thought of that! Thank you 

[Diva]

Twice my dogs have been saved by strangers stopping their cars and getting out to help get the attacking dog off. I no longer walk down the power line easement that was my common route as when two dogs running loose attacked us there no one was around. Instead I stick to busier urban roads where passing traffic can be relied on. 
I carry treats to toss in front of a charging dog, but when I have tried that it has made not a single bit of difference. But I try anyway so I can say I tried everything. And I carry an umbrella with a strong metal point on it. My dogs are large but not fighters. I am torn between walking two together so they have the best chance of defending themselves or just one so I have the best chance of controlling the situation and making a fast exit. 
Mostly I just drive out to our farm to exercise there. 

[sheena]

These are really good.  They emit an ultrsonic sound that is almost inaudible to humans but to dogs it makes them stop in their tracks.  It wont hurt them, just makes them stop & hopefully back off.  Unfortunately when you use it in the vicinity of your own dog, she will get an ear full too, but if it stops the other dog then it would be worth it.  There are cheaper versions but the Dazer is the best https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/K-II-Dazer-II-Ultrasonic-Dog-Deterrent-Repeller-for-Anti-Bark-Stop-Barking-Dogs/174340925180?hash=item28978766fc:g:nuIAAOSw1K5fZFMb&frcectupt=true

[Lolly002]

37 minutes ago, Snook said:

You need to be mindful that a misdirected spray or a bit of wind could see your own dog copping a face full of insect spray, if you choose to use it. Unfortunately most people who have their dogs off leash either can't or won't recall their dogs and leash them and yes you're likely to cop a mouthful of abuse from some of them. 

 

If your dog is both reactive and pulls like crazy on leash, I'd be seeking out the help of a trainer who specialises in behavioural issues. It's important to have your dog as calm and under control as possible if rushed by an off leash dog and every opportunity that your dog gets to practice reactivity, the more that behaviour will be reinforced. It's also not much fun for your dog to be so stressed every time they see another dog. 

I am training her with a method i was taught by a trainer i saw a while ago.. which helps her stay calm. However it is absolutley impossible to train her when there is off leash dogs running up into her face. 

I can get her calm by walking a little away from another dog and telling her to sit and i use the keyword "who's that" and she looks for a treat and does not bark. Now when i have dogs that are not leashed it's a serious challange and not only makes training impossible but also makes her reactivity worse. 

This training method works when she is exposed to leashed dogs from a distance then i can gradually decrease the distance. 

Medication is another route i might consider.. i have tried prozac for her in the past and it made her 10000 times more fearful so it's not something i'm super keen to try again.

i'm at a loss on what to do   i have always wondered why i see so many people walking their dogs with huge sticks or metal poles... now i know why.

 

Edited October 20, 2020 by Lolly002

[asal]

well I have bought two and intend to find out if they work as stated. will report back if it worked. well if the opportunity comes up. will certainly be carrying one any time I go out in future. There are just too many people who do not keep their dogs from roaming.

[asal]

3 hours ago, tdierikx said:

I have personally witnessed my own 2 dogs ignore 2.5 full cans of Police capsicum spray in their faces while having a serious fight. Unfortunately a dog fully in the zone and determined to cause harm can block out many sensations and painful things. Having Police draw their guns on your beloved pets because nothing else was going to stop them is a massive wake-up call... thankfully the dogs actually ran out of steam and stopped of their own accord before the Police pulled any triggers. My heart starts racing even now some years later when I recall that particular incident.

 

Your best protection is avoidance and vigilance IMHO...

 

T.

 

Had two male cattledogs lock onto each other once and found the one thing that MAKES them let go. lucky there was a hose and tap nearby. turned hose full on and with water going up the nose of the one I had by the tail he sure let go fast. instant shoved into the nose of the other and he too let go in seconds and had them apart before the first boy could snort the water out . it took him quite a few seconds to be able to breathe without gurgling which was time enough needed to have the other let go and busy trying to clear all his face full of water too. Remarkable how fast a snoutfull of water cools the heat of the fight

 

but its not as if you can carry a garden hose with you. be nice if there was an alternative as effective though.

[Papillon Kisses]

1 minute ago, Lolly002 said:

Medication is another route i might consider.. i have tried prozac for her in the past and it made her 10000 times more fearful so it's not something i'm super keen to try again.

 

My dog has had negative responses to some medications or doses thereof, but if we had not persevered his mental health wouldn’t be where it is today. If you were only working with a general practitioner that may have been part of the problem, as they get very little training in behaviour medicine. Look here for a veterinarian with further qualification in behaviour: https://www.anzcvs.org.au/chapters/veterinary+behaviour+chapter many do remote consults if there is no one near you. 

[Lolly002]

17 minutes ago, asal said:

but its not as if you can carry a garden hose with you. be nice if there was an alternative as effective though.

100% something like that but portable LOL 

[Kazm]

3 hours ago, Lolly002 said:

 Do these people think it’s a cool thing to do? Or are they just stupidly selfish and think rules don’t apply to them?  

 

IMHO I feel most people out walking their dogs, whether on leash or not, seem to think their dogs won’t hurt a fly. 
I now look at every dog, small or big, as having the potential to cause arguments. After all they are just animals with animal instincts. 

[Lolly002]

40 minutes ago, Kazm said:

IMHO I feel most people out walking their dogs, whether on leash or not, seem to think their dogs won’t hurt a fly. 
I now look at every dog, small or big, as having the potential to cause arguments. After all they are just animals with animal instincts. 

The other thing is, even if their dog is freindly but becasue they are off leash one day they might invade the space of a not so freindly on leash dog. I guess these owners either have not thought of this or they just don't care.

Last year my dog dot jumped on by 2 large over the top labs, the labs were not agressive but they not only knocked me off my feet they rolled my girl over and she fell on her back and she was screaming.. the owner could not call the dogs off.. they had zero re call and were just not listening. once his dogs were off my girl then he simply walked away laughing. they could be the freindliest dogs in the world.. but i do not want them invading my or my dogs personal space. 

i'm definitley in the same mind set as you.. i see every dog as a dog that could start a fight, no dog can be 100% trusted.

[stellnme]

Just to add - I'd be putting in a complaint to Council for not following up a dog attack and simply handing the dog back to the owner with no penalty.  Next time, it mightn't end so well for someone else.

[Little Gifts]

Instead of an umbrella consider an actual walking or hiking pole as it is easier to wield than an umbrella and easier to walk with in general. I got mine from Anaconda.

 

Around the corner from my old house there was a stafford who was always loose and who always rushed us. So I simply had to stop going around that part of our street. The couple of times it did start coming for us I would yell and get crazy at it as soon as I saw it come out and that usually made it change its mind. It remains a fear of mine to experience a random dog attack so I am always on the lookout and will immediately detour/cross roads if I see anything potentially concerning (don't even like dogs rushing at fences in case they manage to get out). I suspect my 2 strong dogs would defend both themselves and me if they felt that threatened so breaking up a fight with at least 3 dogs makes me anxious to even ponder.