NikkiandKane Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Hi Everyone, I am hoping to get some insight into some struggles we are having with our 14 week old Amstaff, Kane. I will try and give all the detail but it may make this post long, so sorry. We bought Kane home at 8 weeks old, on the way home he had some very watery diarrhea, which continued for the whole first week, despite switching him to chicken and rice. He was otherwise playful and well eating and drinking and being a happy little guy. after 6 days of sometimes watery diarrhea and some more pudding like I took him to the vet who put him on antibiotics and gave me Scourban to give him. another week and no real improvement, I called the vet who said to continue with the scourban. He started to have solid stools on and off so I decided to start to slowly introduce him to some actual dog food. I didnt think he could keep growing like this on a diet of chicken and rice. I got some Blackmores dog probiotic powder and gave it to him once a day. Everytime I increased his dog food the diarrhea came back. Somewhere in amongst all this he developed a fine red rash on his belly and was itchy. I am not sure if the rash was there before the dog food started but I tend to think it was. By this time Kane was due for his second puppy vax so we made a vet appointment. Due to coronavirus I had to pass Kane to a vet nurse and explain all of my concerns and wait outside the vet. The vet called me and said she didnt want to vaccinate because he had an allergy rash with a secondary infection and we needed to sort that first. she gave him a shot of steroids and sent us home with antibiotics again, another bottle of scourban, some science diet digestive care tins to get some goodness into him and some Pyohex conditioner to go with the clorhexidine wash we already had. She wanted to see him in 2 weeks which is this friday. Initially after that appointment his skin looked almost perfect, we have kept him off the grass except to go to the bathroom. He spends a lot of time with our 6 year old Amstaff who he loves and when they are outside we have them fenced off in an area which is fully paved. He sleeps inside in a crate and his skin appears calmer and settled each morning. It seems to always redden and flare up after being around Scout and outside. Yesterday we went to help our eldest daughter move and left the dogs at home in the paved area for around 4 hours. When we came home Kanes skin was angry and red with new rash, up until this his skin had just looked reddened and dry but settled when inside. I coated him in the pyohex as he was scratching so much and he settled to sleep. This morning his skin looks worse than most mornings but he seems calm and not bothered by it. He has always been a smelly little guy, really strong dog smell. He is still eating chicken and rice with a small amount of nutro puppy sprinkled on it because it is all his stomach will tolerate. He has firm stools but is still completing his course of antibiotics and due to see the vet again on friday. I have noticed an enlarged lymph node at the base of his jaw on the left side which is painless to him. I just am hoping someone can tell me they have gone through something similar and what on earth it was? I want to be armed with knowledge on Friday when we see the vet. hes a wonderful natured pup who we really love already and we want to do whats best for him. Thanks for reading this absolute novel!! I have attached a photo of my two doggies cuddling last night. Poor Scout getting squished off her own bed. Nikki and Kane 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jemappelle Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Poor little fellow has a bit going on there! Has the vet done a fecal scraping and looked at it under the microscope? Or even sent it off to the lab as there are things like coccidia that need stronger drugs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted May 4, 2020 Share Posted May 4, 2020 Baycox (for cattle and pigs) can be used off-label to prophylactically treat coccidia - it's a single dose of oral liquid medication and is dosed at 0.2-0.4ml/kg. Suburban vets don't always carry Baycox though... and it's a bit pricey... between $140-180 for 250ml... errr! There are other drugs administered in tablet form, but must be given 2-3 times a day for 7-10 days... Panacur can be given for Giardia... your vet should know the dose rate for which version they have in stock. T. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 4, 2020 Author Share Posted May 4, 2020 46 minutes ago, jemappelle said: Poor little fellow has a bit going on there! Has the vet done a fecal scraping and looked at it under the microscope? Or even sent it off to the lab as there are things like coccidia that need stronger drugs. No she hasnt, but he does have solid normal stools again except if he gets too much change to diet. I am much more concerned about the itchy rash which seems to be getting worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 4, 2020 Author Share Posted May 4, 2020 17 minutes ago, tdierikx said: Baycox (for cattle and pigs) can be used off-label to prophylactically treat coccidia - it's a single dose of oral liquid medication and is dosed at 0.2-0.4ml/kg. Suburban vets don't always carry Baycox though... and it's a bit pricey... between $140-180 for 250ml... errr! There are other drugs administered in tablet form, but must be given 2-3 times a day for 7-10 days... Panacur can be given for Giardia... your vet should know the dose rate for which version they have in stock. T. Thanks for the advice, I dont think he has coccidia or giardia. His stools have returned to normal, it is more his skin I am concerned about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 1 hour ago, NikkiandKane said: Thanks for the advice, I dont think he has coccidia or giardia. His stools have returned to normal, it is more his skin I am concerned about I had a foster pup who had a similar presentation with regard to stools... we tested for coccidia and giardia via a faecal float... he had coccidia. Treated it, and he was fine from then on with regards to eating pretty much anything. If you suspect your dog has allergies, then your next step is most likely going to be allergy tests to find out exactly what he is allergic to, and then hopefully being able to manage his interactions with said allergens. T. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandgrubber Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 Could it be a contract allergy? Tradescancia (aka wandering Jew) or some sort of lawn grass? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 5, 2020 Author Share Posted May 5, 2020 9 minutes ago, sandgrubber said: Could it be a contract allergy? Tradescancia (aka wandering Jew) or some sort of lawn grass? We do have Rhoeo a form of wandering Jew in our garden, a lot of it in fact, but he doesnt have access to it. Im wondering if it is possible our other dog who gets in it (but doesnt have a reaction) could be somehow transferring the allergen to him? that might be a stretch? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 5, 2020 Author Share Posted May 5, 2020 1 hour ago, tdierikx said: I had a foster pup who had a similar presentation with regard to stools... we tested for coccidia and giardia via a faecal float... he had coccidia. Treated it, and he was fine from then on with regards to eating pretty much anything. If you suspect your dog has allergies, then your next step is most likely going to be allergy tests to find out exactly what he is allergic to, and then hopefully being able to manage his interactions with said allergens. T. Yes, I'm thinking that might end up being the path. He is just so young though and the vet indicated that it was highly unusual to have such a bad atopic reaction at his age and she seemed very concerned. I think she expected it to clear up because she said that if he has another reaction by 6 months of age she would recommend a dermatologist....well this outbreak just keeps going 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_PL_ Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 A skin scrape for the chance of demodex would be a good idea too although your vet will probably do that to rule it out. Demodectic mange (not contagious) flares up and down from pink to bright red, can weep at times. The smell is usually secondary yeast and/or bacteria. There's usually a visible rash of little pink dots. As it progresses you get the hair loss, skin thickening and crustiness. But then again, allergies can look exactly like that too! I hope your very cute little pup gets some answers soon. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheena Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 7 hours ago, NikkiandKane said: We do have Rhoeo a form of wandering Jew in our garden, a lot of it in fact, but he doesnt have access to it. Im wondering if it is possible our other dog who gets in it (but doesnt have a reaction) could be somehow transferring the allergen to him? that might be a stretch? I am pretty sure Rhoeo is very poisonous to dogs. It will certainly give the dog a bad itch if they rub on it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosmum Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 (edited) I've seen similar sort of allergy to Kikuyu too. Only took a strand walked on and no other allergies showed later.. Edited May 5, 2020 by moosmum 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 5, 2020 Author Share Posted May 5, 2020 11 hours ago, Powerlegs said: A skin scrape for the chance of demodex would be a good idea too although your vet will probably do that to rule it out. Demodectic mange (not contagious) flares up and down from pink to bright red, can weep at times. The smell is usually secondary yeast and/or bacteria. There's usually a visible rash of little pink dots. As it progresses you get the hair loss, skin thickening and crustiness. But then again, allergies can look exactly like that too! I hope your very cute little pup gets some answers soon. I had a pup many years ago with severe demodex, back then there werent such things as nexgard spectra and we had to give her ivermectin for a long time, her mange was quite debilitating and nothing we did could help her, so I hope to God that this is not what we have here. He has had Nexgard Spectra twice now, which is supposed to be effective against Demodex, fingers crossed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 5, 2020 Author Share Posted May 5, 2020 The other thought I have had last night is that this is an allergy to Amoxicillin.... He was first given amoxicillan at 9 weeks old for the diarrhea issues, it was around that time that the rash first appeared. Then he was prescribed amox. for his rash secondary infection and its been almost 2 weeks with the skin just getting worse and worse. I looked up adverse reactions to amox and skin reaction like this are the most common........ Also, I just saw on the news that there is a bit of an outbreak of Parvo on the Gold Coast so I really hope he can get his Vax on Friday......Sigh. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_PL_ Posted May 5, 2020 Share Posted May 5, 2020 1 minute ago, NikkiandKane said: I had a pup many years ago with severe demodex, back then there werent such things as nexgard spectra and we had to give her ivermectin for a long time, her mange was quite debilitating and nothing we did could help her, so I hope to God that this is not what we have here. He has had Nexgard Spectra twice now, which is supposed to be effective against Demodex, fingers crossed. Yes thank goodness for Nexgard Spectra, no more frightening courses of ivermectin. Having taken it twice now, I'm sure you'd have seen some kind of improvement if it was demodex. Fingers crossed for an answer soon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheena Posted May 6, 2020 Share Posted May 6, 2020 (edited) Also like to add that Rhoeo is not a form of wandering jew. If your other dog is in contact with Rhoeo or wandering jew & then cuddles up to the pup, then that could be your problem. You did say in your original post that his rash is worse after being with your other dog. this is where I would be looking Edited May 6, 2020 by sheena 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 6, 2020 Author Share Posted May 6, 2020 4 hours ago, Powerlegs said: Yes thank goodness for Nexgard Spectra, no more frightening courses of ivermectin. Having taken it twice now, I'm sure you'd have seen some kind of improvement if it was demodex. Fingers crossed for an answer soon Or maybe the Nexgard is what he is allergic to? the options are endless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 6, 2020 Author Share Posted May 6, 2020 1 hour ago, sheena said: Also like to add that Rhoeo is not a form of wandering jew. If your other dog is in contact with Rhoeo or wandering jew & then cuddles up to the pup, then that could be your problem. You did say in your original post that his rash is worse after being with your other dog. this is where I would be looking Oh, I believe it is from the same family as wandering jew? In any case I may have been wrong about it worsening after contact with Scout. Today and yesterday I have kept them apart, Kane has been by my side in the crate or inside generally. His rash looked improved this morning and then worsened so far through the course of the day, without having any contact with Scout. The most he has been outdoors is to go to the bathroom and he has been promptly hauled back inside. We are back to the vet on Friday, I have maybe eliminated a few possible causes but I am none the wiser 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted May 6, 2020 Share Posted May 6, 2020 Has the vet mentioned/done skin scrapings for Malassezia ? This is a yeasty, itchy smelly skin infection. there is the possibility Puppy might be allergic to any one of a million things LIKE A meat protein beef, lamb or chicken A grain ..corn, or wheat , an artificial colouring a carpet deodoriser/cleaner laundry detergent seeding grasses the list is almost endless:( 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikkiandKane Posted May 6, 2020 Author Share Posted May 6, 2020 16 minutes ago, persephone said: Has the vet mentioned/done skin scrapings for Malassezia ? This is a yeasty, itchy smelly skin infection. there is the possibility Puppy might be allergic to any one of a million things LIKE A meat protein beef, lamb or chicken A grain ..corn, or wheat , an artificial colouring a carpet deodoriser/cleaner laundry detergent seeding grasses the list is almost endless:( No skin scrapings yet, certainly something to ask about on Friday. Im ready to put socks on him to take him to the toilet....I am going mad!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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