Kibble+raw

[Ricky2]

Hello,so i'm back with another topic-I'm so sorry if i seem annoying as it is basically all about food.

So my lab mix is a b*tch and she has phases where she will either globe down her food, wont eat it at all or just barely..

Can someone tell me what foods i can gave give raw or cooked from meat to veggies in order to improve her kibble diet please? 

What are your thoughts on bone broth,raw taking different times diggesting from kibble etc?

Is it fine if i give them chicken that aren't organic but home grown and so without any growth hormones-they are fed both corn and grass,kale, some left overs etc..?

Also-good quality wet food,  and grain free tinned green tripe as i cant get it raw nor frozen? Bad for teeth or good?

She wasn't too fancy on boiled pumpkin and raw carrots the time i fed them to her.

 

PS-Should i get batches of frozen raw food already prepped from time to time, and give it to her as a separate meal in order for her to clean and improve her teeth etc...For example  2/3 x a month give 1/2 amount of kibble in the morning and half batch of frozen/raw food in the arvo? would that be bad for her digestive system because of not being able to keep up with the changes?

Also,should i freeze meat,organs etc.. before feeding it raw to her in order to kill the bacteria? And do the organs need to be from fully grass fed animals?

Thank you.

Edited March 10, 2019 by Ricky2

[sandgrubber]

Don't worry so much.  Dogs in general, and particularly Labradors, thrive on a wide variety of diets.  I'd be more concerned about the amount of fat in raw foods than whether they are organic / grass fed or what mix is fed when.  Some of the stuff sold as raw food is disgustingly fatty. Any veggies or fruit she will eat is fine.  If you don't want to get precise and scientific about stuff like trace nutrients and calcium to phosphorus to potassium ratios (difficult to do) I'd stick to a core diet of good quality dry kibble and throw in stuff alongside.  The most common malnutrition in dogs, as in people, is over nutrition. 

Little puppies can be sickened by bacteria (Salmonella in particular) in their food but older pups and dogs regularly chew old grotty bones that have been buried for a while without ill effects. 

Dogs evolved as scavengers, and it takes a lot to make them sick.  Freezing is a way to kill parasites, eg, if feeding home kill or catch from hunting.  People around here (rural NZ) say at least three weeks. 

There may be a few dogs who react badly to grains, but by in large the grain free movement is a marketing gimmick.  

Edited March 10, 2019 by sandgrubber
Removed link: wrong article

[persephone]

Feeding dogs ...there as many ways as there are owners. truly!!  LOL 
As sandgrubber said ..  don't worry too much
Dogs can do well on most diets ...  my prefererred feed is mostly raw , with some dry . We do  not buy an expensive dry .Our dogs get a lot of meaty bones ..and yes, they bury and dig up their treasures ! 
pups currently get lots of raw ... bony treats such as  chicken feet frozen are a favourite , as are sections of lamb backbone ....they  will knock me down for raw kangaroo !!
raw whole apples and carrots are playthings/chewy toys  for pups .. but , understandably, older dogs can't see the sense in  them  most times ..and they don't NEED to eat them 

have a read here ...keep asking questions , and perhaps use the following as a guide . Someone wise once said that , over a week ,if your dog gets all the neccessary vitamins, a variety of meats, bones ..with a few veg ..then your job's done . A diet doesn't have to be measured and weighed every day to work - really - 

[Animal House]

I feed both raw and kibble...just not at the same time.  He gets a good quality dry food for breakfast (I do weigh out the amount, because some of that goes into treats for training.

For dinner he gets raw (usually one/two of these - oily fish/sardines, plain Greek yoghurt, turkey neck, cooked egg, raw meaty bone a few times a week) 

I also make up 2 kongs filled with carrot pieces (he loves carrots) a bit of Yoghurt, a few pieces of apple, some of his dry food portion, and plug up the end with peanut butter and freeze them.  
So he usually gets one of those around lunchtime, and they are really handy to give them to spend time in the crate/playpen, that usually takes him 45 minutes to finish off.  (my pup is 15 weeks old though, hence the two main meals and a smaller lunch)

 

 

 

Sorry Perse, Just wanted to remind people  never to feed whole apples to dogs, the seeds contain cyanide and the core can be a choking hazard.

1 hour ago, persephone said:

raw whole apples

 

Quote

 

Taken from Pet MD website....."It’s also important that you remove all seeds from an apple before giving it to your dog. Apple seeds contain cyanide, and although a few apple seeds likely won’t harm your dog, eating them over time can lead to the accumulation of cyanide in your dog’s system, which is quite hazardous. As such, you’ll need to discard the core of the apple—which also poses a choking hazard—and cut the remaining fruit into slices to serve as a treat for your dog"

 

 

[PANDI-GIRL]

@Ricky2   Your doing a good job of feeding so many nutritious foods,  your dog is lucky you care so much

 

Hey everyone where did  Labrador owner  Charbearsmum  go  she would love talking with Ricky about their dogs

[Tassie]

3 hours ago, Animal House said:

 

Sorry Perse, Just wanted to remind people  never to feed whole apples to dogs, the seeds contain cyanide and the core can be a choking hazard.

 

Taken from Pet MD website....."It’s also important that you remove all seeds from an apple before giving it to your dog. Apple seeds contain cyanide, and although a few apple seeds likely won’t harm your dog, eating them over time can lead to the accumulation of cyanide in your dog’s system, which is quite hazardous. As such, you’ll need to discard the core of the apple—which also poses a choking hazard—and cut the remaining fruit into slices to serve as a treat for your dog"

 

 

I had to have a chuckle at this .. remembering the time our lovely holistic vet was wandering through his (empty) waiting room, munching on an apple as we finished our hydro session.  My fruit loving BC was gazing at him hopefully, so he offered her the core to eat .. saying he normally ate them himself but he would give it up for her this time.   His view .. technically that might be true, but a dog would have to eat an awful lot of apple seeds or cores to have a problem.   Mine (10 and 2)  have been eating the windfalls and half bird eaten every day for months .. as they did last season .. and the 10 year old agility boy for all his life.    I do try to limit them to a couple a day.    

 

[persephone]

3 hours ago, Animal House said:

the core can be a choking hazard.

so can a chicken neck , piece of kibble, or a tennis ball .  I have yet to see a dog gasping around an apple core  as I have done with the other things I've listed ...thankfully , and our dogs have been eating apples for decades .

Whole fresh chicken necks, certain kibble, and tennis balls are not used here ... whole apples and carrots  seem safer , so far .

 

[sandgrubber]

4 hours ago, Animal House said:

 

Sorry Perse, Just wanted to remind people  never to feed whole apples to dogs, the seeds contain cyanide

 

 

 

The seeds go right through, at least with Labbies.  At this time of year mine are eating windfall apples... I'd guess they go through 3/day each.  No problems other than weight gain if I don't watch out . 

[Animal House]

5 hours ago, persephone said:

so can a chicken neck , piece of kibble, or a tennis ball .  I have yet to see a dog gasping around an apple core  as I have done with the other things I've listed ...thankfully , and our dogs have been eating apples for decades .

Whole fresh chicken necks, certain kibble, and tennis balls are not used here ... whole apples and carrots  seem safer , so far .

 

Yes, good point, there's so many things for dogs to choke on, tennis balls can be a hazard, so can a stick, or a stolen sock, the list is endless really.

 ( I'll still not feed the seeds/core to mine though, as advised by my vet years ago, but each to their own)

[Boronia]

15 hours ago, sandgrubber said:

The seeds go right through, at least with Labbies.  At this time of year mine are eating windfall apples... I'd guess they go through 3/day each.  No problems other than weight gain if I don't watch out . 

Zara had a big piece of apple that we forgot to core, I later found the seed capsule/carapace on the floor with no apple-flesh attached...a tiny ball with seeds to be seen through the openings, she must have spent ages nibbling the apple flesh without getting one  taste of the inner 

it looked a bit like these

 

[Maddy]

19 hours ago, PANDI-GIRL said:

@Ricky2   Your doing a good job of feeding so many nutritious foods,  your dog is lucky you care so much

 

Hey everyone where did  Labrador owner  Charbearsmum  go  she would love talking with Ricky about their dogs

If Troy didn't ban him/her for their inappropriate and very aggressive posts, then I'd have to assume they've left of their own accord.

Having said that, I did notice they changed their username. Maybe hoping people wouldn't associate the new name with the absolutely disgusting things they had to say  

[PANDI-GIRL]

I didn't notice any of it ,  what happened,  what is their new username,   I thought all they did was talk endlessly  about the Lab pups weight    

[PANDI-GIRL]

@Maddy are you talking about the fellow with the pointer pup & then his adult dog was killed on the train line & he wanted a new pup same day it happened!

I saw he got quite nasty

[Maddy]

8 minutes ago, PANDI-GIRL said:

@Maddy are you talking about the fellow with the pointer pup & then his adult dog was killed on the train line & he wanted a new pup same day it happened!

I saw he got quite nasty

Nope. Troy has heavily pruned some of the threads that that person was involved in, or deleted them entirely. The one about vets and mental health/suicide got nuked completely because of the revolting things Charbearsma was saying. It started out as merely inappropriate- Charsbearsma saying that s/he didn't think vets had a particularly hard job- and when people called her/him out for being so dismissive of legitimate mental health concerns, the person decided to just lash out with personal attacks, accusing other people of being crazy, etc.

[PANDI-GIRL]

Do they still post,  & have a new username?

[Rebanne]

I feed my dogs twice a day. Raw one meal, dry food the other. Don't stress too much about food. Most of it is a beat up. I give raw bones or whole carrots for teeth.

[Ricky2]

Raw feeders- what do you supplement/do you supplement with? From what i read,depending on what your dog needs it,you usually have to use supplements with raw in order for them to get everything they need.

[persephone]

1 minute ago, Ricky2 said:

you usually have to use supplements with raw

If you feed a variety of foods .. no supplements needed . Exactly the same as with humans . 
Feed muscle meat /bone/organ meats ..plus a little fish/egg/yoghurt/fruit/veg ... and there should be no need for supplements . 
Feed a mix of raw and processed  if you're not confident . 

if you are concerned , there are prepared raw meals you can buy - patties  which are a  complete meal . T

[Ricky2]

@persephone Thank you,yes i will mix it up as im not fully confident to feed raw,it can get pricey andI havent got the time to prep meals for her unfortunately. As with everything there are so many pros and cons-some say x others say x-holistic vets say  raw is the best others just point out negatives etc..its really hard and confusing, i will follow the tips you guys give and just keep doing my best and not overthink it.

 

Do you give your dogs raw goat milk? I've heard both good and bad things about it

Edited March 12, 2019 by Ricky2

[leac1801]

Raw and kibble don't digest at different rates, and freezing will not kill bacteria, only parasites, which is usually only an issue in wild game. If you're feeding a good variety, supplements shouldn't be needed. Organs contain essential vitamins and minerals, so having a good rotation will cover bases. Only secreting organs (liver, kidney, spleen, brain testicles etc) are fed as organ; heart, gizzards, tongue, lung, tripe etc are fed as muscle meat, because they are made of muscle. 

 

You could add anything really, a friend adds fish, eggs, chicken wings, chunky minces to her kibble. Any vegetation is better off being blitzed as it is hard to digest cellulose, and will go straight through. You could add things like spirulina, greens powder, mushroom powder; I mix with flaxseed oil and freeze in molds, and pop one out at meal times. I also make bone broth and kefir and freeze as well. 

 

Whilst grass fed is better, it's fine to feed whatever you can get. I would double my budget if I used grass fed, so I stick to my current supplier. I also don't balance every day, but over a fortnight. The only time I would bother balancing every day is with puppies, and even then I was a bit lax. I find it tedious and have even been doing prep daily instead of making them all on one day and defrosting during the week.

Edited March 24, 2019 by leac1801