Cost for a re-homed dog

[Woolly Bugger]

We are considering the purchase of a mature dog. The dog has been given up by the owner and it is back with the breeder.

 

When this occurs, is it normal for breeders to 'refund' part or all of the original purchase cost of the dog to the owner? If not, is it then normal for the breeder to resell the dog at a price that I suspect is close to full cost of a puppy?

[persephone]

wow... a curly question .
how old is 'mature? 
is the breed one which would have had a lot of effort  done with regards to health testing/temp. testing of the line? 
is the breeder well known and a breeder of good quality dogs? 

is the breed a common one, or one of the not-often seen  ones? 

is dog desexed? 
what register is it on ? 
doesa it have all its papers ? 

In the end , it boils down to what the breeder wants to charge, really - there is , AFAIK, no 'set' charge . 

[_PL_]

Yes that's kind of 'how long is a piece of string?'. No real answer. 

 

The breeder is now the owner again and they can charge what they like, there's no rules in place.

I think it's great they took one of their mature dogs back though, that's good backup to have.  

[Woolly Bugger]

15 minutes ago, persephone said:

wow... a curly question .
how old is 'mature? 12 Months
is the breed one which would have had a lot of effort  done with regards to health testing/temp. testing of the line? Not sure how relevant this is given the circumstances of a potential sale of a re-homed dog. Surely these costs would have been covered in the original sale price
is the breeder well known and a breeder of good quality dogs? to my limited research - yes.

is the breed a common one, or one of the not-often seen  ones? No, quite uncommon, but again, not totally sure why this is a consideration given the circumstances.

is dog desexed? No
what register is it on ? Rather not say at this stage
doesa it have all its papers ? Unsure, but possible as the dog is currently not desexed.

Thanks for your response and the detailed questions which I have attempted to answer above, but did not really answer my question. The breeder sold the dog as a puppy and has now taken back the dog due to owners changed circumstances. Is it normal for a breeder to refund cost (or part thereof) to the original purchaser? If it is not normal to refund, is it normal to charge 'puppy price' for a mature dog when on-selling, effectively selling the dog twice.

 

Not suggesting there is anything wrong with this, just trying to understand what is normal (if there is any such thing) in this circumstance.

[Woolly Bugger]

9 minutes ago, Powerlegs said:

Yes that's kind of 'how long is a piece of string?'. No real answer. 

 

The breeder is now the owner again and they can charge what they like, there's no rules in place.

I think it's great they took one of their mature dogs back though, that's good backup to have.  

Yes, kind of what I was thinking but interested in others comments.

[mackiemad]

Just because the dog was sold as a puppy, if it is a breed with a lot of health tests it doesn't mean that the breeder's costs were covered.

 

If the dog is still entire then it could be sold on as a breeding dog (if health tested and of sufficient quality), show dog or then desexed and sold on as a pet - it's not a simple thing. Care, food,  vetwork, tests, behavioural modification etc all takes time and money. 

 

Also, just because they have a price on an adult dog it doesn't mean that it is hard and fast - it is common to put a price on a dog to avoid tyre kickers and time wasters, where the price is actually not as important as the weeding out unsuitable people process (which really takes a lot more time and energy than you'd think)

[Rebanne]

Yes a lot of breeders will refund the puppy buyer. Yes it's common to charge puppy price for a 12 month old dog.

[Diva]

I wouldn’t expect a 12 month old to be cheaper than a puppy,  they have the advantage of much of the hard work of puppy raising being done and you can really see what you are getting in both conformation and temperament. Many people prefer them at that stage. If it were older, more like 7 yrs or over, I might expect a lower or no price, but not that young. 

As for refunding the original owner that is very individual, it depends on the terms of original contract, and even in the absence of a contract some breeders will refund if the reasons for return are valid and they think the dog will be able to be resold easily, others not. Sometimes they have costs getting the dog back, too. 

[Dogsfevr]

Is what happened on this pups return that important to you ?

If your expecting a cheaper dog as it’s older then it’s most likely the wrong relationship for you .

12 months is not old .

As to what each breeder does on a pup/older dog return is up to them and what is discussed between the two parties and the contract .

 

Are you worried if you return the dog you won’t get your money back as honestly this is a strange post 

[juice]

Personally the stand out action for me was the breeder took the dog back, that is the mark of a good breeder backing up its dogs, alot don't, so that alone is a good starting point.

Alot of breeders ask a price for an older dog ( but older than 12 months, ex show or breeding dogs), but actually just want a good home and don't follow through with a fee.

i suppose it depends if you want a pup or a slightly older dog, pros and cons to both, i'd go the 12 month old one anyday as assume its already trained to a certain degree and you can see its personalty and wether it fits your lifestyle.

 

[Rascalmyshadow]

Not sure if it's any help but we have purchased four dogs all different breeds, from breeders, between the ages of six and twelve months, three were the cost of desexing (plus flights for two) and the fourth was half the price of a young puppy (plus flight).

[Woolly Bugger]

26 minutes ago, Dogsfevr said:

Is what happened on this pups return that important to you ?

If your expecting a cheaper dog as it’s older then it’s most likely the wrong relationship for you .

12 months is not old .

As to what each breeder does on a pup/older dog return is up to them and what is discussed between the two parties and the contract .

 

Are you worried if you return the dog you won’t get your money back as honestly this is a strange post 

With all due respect, you are barking up the wrong tree (excuse the cliche and pun) on all accounts. Nothing to do with me getting a cheaper dog because it is older/mature, nor 'worried if you return the dog you won’t get your money back'.

 

The question(s) posed are perfectly legitimate to me as a potential purchaser. I have no issue paying asking price for dogs and have done so several times in the past (puppies). Most of the responses to my query have been informative and pretty much what I thought would be the case.

[RuralPug]

Part of the reason for the price put on a returned dog is to ensure the dedication of purchasers. Same principle as never offer a pet Free to Good Home - it attracts the wrong kind of people. 

I personally know many breeders who will rehome an older dog for simply the price of desexing to someone they know and trust but would charge a higher fee to a stranger.

[asal]

Yes, free tends to not be valued, well remember my uncle used to give away his retired show winners, well that is until my mum pointed out how nadly neglected their coats were (long coat breed, next person who asked my cheeky mum told them the price, higher than if they have bought a baby, 12 moths later guess who had the best groomed coat, loved to bits and looking fabulous. after that uncle took the hint and never rehomed without putting a good price. 

[Maddy]

4 hours ago, asal said:

Yes, free tends to not be valued, well remember my uncle used to give away his retired show winners, well that is until my mum pointed out how nadly neglected their coats were (long coat breed, next person who asked my cheeky mum told them the price, higher than if they have bought a baby, 12 moths later guess who had the best groomed coat, loved to bits and looking fabulous. after that uncle took the hint and never rehomed without putting a good price. 

My last greyhound was free and he was absolutely treasured. He lived the sort of life many other pet dogs would never get to enjoy and despite being a difficult dog at times, I'd do anything to have those four years over again. 

In his final days, we emptied our bank accounts of thousands of dollars to try to save him. His purchase cost (or lack of) was no reflection on us as pet owners or how we cared for him and I know of plenty of other people who have done similar. 

On the other hand, I also know of plenty of pricey dogs who languish in back yards with their coats matted and their nails horribly overgrown. Being willing to fork over a lot of money does not make someone a good pet owner. It just makes them willing to spend money. 

If someone can't afford to pay a modest adoption fee/purchase price, it would of course raise the question of how they will cope with vet bills, but that's not really what you were arguing, were you? You slapped down a revolting judgement and frankly, if I wasn't trying very hard recently to not snap at garbage people on the internet, I'd probably have a few other things to add to this.

 

Edited to add..

The memorial for our free, clearly unvalued dog. It sits in the room that we built onto our house, just for his use if we were going out for more than a few hours in case he needed to be able to get outside to the toilet. 

The memorial sits right next to one of his wardrobes, full of his pajamas and his sun vests and his bath robes and raincoats and t-shirts and skivvies and anything else I could buy that might make him a little more comfy in his wonky body. I spent more money keeping my dog warm, than many people would even consider spending on the purchase price of a dog. Free just means the dog didn't cost anything, unvalued can be any dog unlucky enough to be bought by someone who isn't 100% committed to their animal.

 

Have you ever considered that maybe your uncle just didn't bother to properly vet potential owners? Do you know what that suggests to me? That maybe he didn't care where they wenr and that he just wanted them gone. See, judgements work both ways, how fun!

 

 

Edited March 20, 2018 by Maddy

[sandgrubber]

No one can say what is normal.  It's not the sort of thing anyone keeps track of on a big enough scale to define a norm.  I think the majority here think what you describe it ethical...provided there are no undisclosed problems.

[juice]

I agree Maddy about the vetting , my last 2 bullies were free , desexing was all I paid , I’m a single Mum and just can’t afford the 2k price tag of a pup . However Zelda cost me 5k in specialist fees last year , I borrowed the money because it had to be done . 

[Maddy]

59 minutes ago, juice said:

I agree Maddy about the vetting , my last 2 bullies were free , desexing was all I paid , I’m a single Mum and just can’t afford the 2k price tag of a pup . However Zelda cost me 5k in specialist fees last year , I borrowed the money because it had to be done . 

Yep. I've rehomed greys to people who have happily paid (and turned out to be massive dickbags) and I've rehomed a couple  or greys for free, who were very loved by their sensible, responsible owners.

Careful vetting isn't easy- a lot of people will lie or tell you what they think you want to hear- so I think it pays to ask questions that give you an indication of their attitudes towards their pets, rather than just the usual stuff.

For example.. while doing a home check, asking if dogs are allowed inside, on furniture, in people beds, etc. If they say that dogs belong outside for whatever reason (they're "dirty", the owners can't be bothered to toilet train, someone in the house is massively allergic to dogs, whatever), you've got your first red flag there and can do further digging. It's incredible how many people want to get a dog but.. don't actually seem to want a dog