Raw diet for one small dog without heaps of freezer space?

[mowgliandme]

My dog is 9.6kg, 1.5 year old and I’d like to transition her to a “mostly” raw diet now that she’s past the main growing phase - would someone be able to check through my calculations?

 

Currently she eats a good quality dry food (taste of the wild, ivory coat or meals for mutts), supplemented with raw meaty bones (mostly lamb necks or chicken drumsticks), raw vegetables, cooked eggs and some treats (salmon fudge, ivory coat, blackdog, or cooked meat). Her ratio of fresh to dry is probably somewhere between 15%: 85%. 

 

I would like her to have the ratio 80% fresh, 20% dry. I’d still like to maintain some dry food as I can’t always take raw food when going away camping and she loves treat/puzzle toys. She has always been pretty squarely in the middle of feeding charts so I’m guessing that she will need 2.5% of her body weight but I will adjust it if need be~

 

So according to my calculations: for a 9.6kg dog, at 2.5% x 7 a week and 80% of diet = 1.34kg of raw food a week.

 

As it is, in addition to her dry food she currently eats about 2 eggs a week, 2-3 carrots a week, an apple and either 400grams lamb neck or 200g of chicken drumstick (alternating most weeks).

 

First, do I include the fruits/vegetables and eggs in this 1.34kg? 

Two eggs ~100grams

Are the fruits/vegetables just considered extra? (id say she eats 200grams of carrots, an apple (80grams) and small bits of other fruits/vegetables over a week - should I reduce them? Currently giving them to her because she seems to need extra fibre (otherwise she gets anal gland issues) and she likes them.

 

Secondly: bones - so for 10% bone, she would need ~130grams of bone a week

According to a calculator lamb necks and chicken drumsticks are around 30-35% bone. So 400-460grams of raw meaty bones a week should cover it?

 

Third, liver and other organ meats: 130 grams a week…so 65grams of liver and 65grams of whatever else kidneys? Two questions: 

1) Can you buy this in such small amounts? (Sorry for the annoying questions I’m vego so never bought these things before ) 

2) Can I give this over just a couple of meals at the beginning of the week? Or does it need to be spread evenly throughout? 

 

So theoretically if i include the eggs (and no vegetables) per week - i would need:

400-450grams raw meaty bones

100grams eggs

65grams liver

65grams kidney?

660-700grams of additional meat

 

Does this sound approximately right to people who feed raw? Any help would be greatly appreciated

Edited December 13, 2017 by mowgliandme

[Scottsmum]

This is a great resource 

 

https://www.balanced-canine.com/nutrition

[mowgliandme]

Thanks @Scottsmum - Seems to fit in with the calculator on the site - just the quantities are so small!

[RuralPug]

Yes, the quantities per day may be small but remember that you will want to freeze different types of meat/organs etc. and will not be able to purchase the minimum quantities for a week but will need to purchase a couple of months supply in some cases (e.g. you may want two or three minimum different types of organs, which you would be very lucky to find in less than 250gm packages!) 

Really, even for one small dog or one cat,  you are best to have a freezer in addition to the usual freezer space in a family fridge. You will probably find it helpful to repackage fresh raw into 2-3 days worth quantity-wise before freezing.

Better still, having a dedicated freezer just for pet meat means also that you don't need to forego the occasional irresistible bulk bargain! 

[mowgliandme]

hmmm i was hoping to get the overall calculations right, buy once a week and then add it to her bowl as I go along, mixing it up week to week? (This is basically how I feed myself too)

 

I’m just not one of those organised people who will prep and pack meals like parents do for kids… (i may do it once or twice and then forget about it)  

[Scrappi&Monty]

We have a 12kg and 21kg Dog.

We buy bulk now, but used to buy  from woolies. We’d get 

- a bag of Chicken drumsticks

- a 500g pack of chicken livers 

- and/or a pack of lamb kidney

And then the amount of muscle meet to balance that out...

- A tray of lamb offcuts

- 500g pack of chook giblets

- 500g pack of chook hearts

- lamb heart

or any other cheap meat  

[Diva]

If I was you I would buy the offal in slightly larger quantities, just because the amounts you need are so small,  and freeze in portions. You don’t need to feed it every day, getting the weekly amount over a couple of days in the week is fine. Or feed the liver one week and the other offal the next. The other meat you will be able to buy in weekly, it probably means you will get variety between but not within weeks. I wouldn’t buy a separate freezer for one small dog. 

.

[Scrappi&Monty]

Yes, balancing over a few weeks is ok too.  

Offal will have to be prepped. Smallest pack I can find is 500g which lasts us ages, would probably last you ages too.

Im not an organised person, but doing a biggish lot of meal prep is better imo. Because getting elbow deep in meat and Offal every weekend is no fun, better to spend a few hours every few weeks. 

[Tassie]

Or if you're a bit lazy and don't have much freezer space, or room for an extra one .. you can buy something like frozen Big Dog Barf patties.  Useful for travelling too.  But not the same as doing your own, I guess.

[persephone]

1 hour ago, Tassie said:

Or if you're a bit lazy and don't have much freezer space, or room for an extra one .. you can buy something like frozen Big Dog Barf patties.  Useful for travelling too.  But not the same as doing your own, I guess.

..and maybe , for a vegan , a bit less confronting

[mowgliandme]

yikes 'elbow deep in meat and offal' is really not selling it to me right now!  I am a bit of a sook and will probably faint if i was dissecting organs /cutting stuff up myself - so was hoping that i'd just buy 65grams of liver and pop it in the bowl and not think about it! 

as always... a little bit too optimistic!  

 

 

[mowgliandme]

So i think Big Dog Barf it may be for now - if i toughen up then maybe i'll do raw on my own down the track!  

 

One question about these: they have ground up bone in them already, so can you still give raw meaty bones (for dental health) as well as patties or would it mess up the ratio of calcium/phosphorus etc?

[Scrappi&Monty]

2 hours ago, Tassie said:

Or if you're a bit lazy and don't have much freezer space, or room for an extra one .. you can buy something like frozen Big Dog Barf patties.  Useful for travelling too.  But not the same as doing your own, I guess.

I second that! 

We get them sometimes, they are a bit more expensive so not an everyday thing, but they are super handy.

Plus it’s a good way to feed “weird” meats since they have Roo, Rabbit, Fish etc. 

 

When we went away we left dogs with family, who we thought it was a bit hard/messy to feed raw to my specific rules so I just bought 2 cases of Big Dog to feed instead. Dogs loved it.  

Could’ve just fed all kibble for the holiday but they like a bit of variation. 

[persephone]

I'd still feed meaty bones ... Mowgli isn't a puppy anymore  

[Scrappi&Monty]

1 hour ago, mowgliandme said:

yikes 'elbow deep in meat and offal' is really not selling it to me right now!  I am a bit of a sook and will probably faint if i was dissecting organs /cutting stuff up myself - so was hoping that i'd just buy 65grams of liver and pop it in the bowl and not think about it! 

as always... a little bit too optimistic!  

 

 

Sorry Mowgli hahaha. That was quite the exaggeration. 

I mean it’s just a bit of a pain in the ass to cut up such a small amount each week, bit easier to do 500g (which is a small tub from woolies) and cut into teaspoon size chunks & freeze. You can freeze them in a week sized tub, defrosting once a week and add to meal daily, or use an ice tube tray with a lid and make Offal IceCubes which is convenient.  

They don’t sell Offal type stuff at the deli etc so you can’t really say “can I please have 65g of kidney” because that’s probably like 1/2 - 1 lamb kidney...  

 

If you’re squeamish, maybe see if someone else can do it for you? Perhaps a close by raw feeder can do meal prep for you with theirs? 

I buy food safe gloves, so that really does make it easy and clean. Just slice it up, pop it in tubs and freeze. Or perhaps you could blitz it in a blender and freeze in ice cubes, that way it’s maybe less (or more) gross for you since there’s less touching?? But you’d probably have to feed that frozen. 

Worth a shot, and if it’s too icky for you, you can just remember that for next time.  

[mowgliandme]

Thank you everyone - at the moment i think i'll go with the Big Dog patties and my usual additions of bones/veggies/yogurt etc  

 

good ideas @Scrappi&Monty If i was doing it myself from the supermarket id blend and freeze it or would go to a regular butcher that cuts/minces it for me~

 

May i know how much you pay on average for raw meat per kilo?

The big dog patties ($7.56/kg) are actually cheaper than the butcher near me! where even chicken starts at about $10/kg... 

[persephone]

20 minutes ago, mowgliandme said:

at the moment i think i'll go with the Big Dog patties and my usual additions of bones/veggies/yogurt etc

 You won't need to add any veges . there will be enough in the patties - they are made as a complete meal, after all ..and dogs are predominantely meat eaters  ;) 

I am reeling from that butcher pricing!!

The other day I bought 2 bags ( plastic shopping bags ) absolutely full of lamb offcuts ..mainly 1/2 necks, and lots of lovely flap squares ..plus quite a few pelvis/hip bones ! In each bag were about 7 meals  for a koolie type dog . 2 bags = $10.00  :D 

Edited December 14, 2017 by persephone

[mowgliandme]

1 minute ago, persephone said:

 You won't need to add any veges . there will be enough in the patties - they are made as a complete meal, after all ..and dogs are predominantely meat eaters  ;) 

good point!

[mowgliandme]

oh wow that is quite cheap... the one near me has cheap(ish) bones? about $2 for a bag but theyre not very meaty ones or $4 for two meaty bones (two lamb necks or marrow bones or spine)

i'm not sure about the price of offcuts as they arent displayed -  the $10 a kilo stuff is referring to thighs drumsticks and mince type meats

[Scrappi&Monty]

3 hours ago, mowgliandme said:

May i know how much you pay on average for raw meat per kilo?

The big dog patties ($7.56/kg) are actually cheaper than the butcher near me! where even chicken starts at about $10/kg... 

Holy shit! Have a look somewhere else! 

We get ours from a dog food bloke for $50 for

- 10kg chicken frames ($1/kg)

- 5kg Chicken mince

- 5kg beef mince

- 5kg lamb meat 

 

Or even from woolies it’s cheaper;

- chicken drumsticks in a 2kg bag for $5

- Chicken giblets, hearts, necks or livers $4kg

- lamb offcuts about $5kg

- lamb hearts about $6kg 

 

I try to keep the majority of our dog food meat under $8kg... 

Edited December 14, 2017 by Scrappi&Monty