jacks4nik Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 A friend of mine was telling me about her Akita cross border collie who has been snarling and bitten family members. She is fearful of him as he is bearing his teeth. I explained about pack mentality and she needs to become the leader of the pack.. would love to know your thoughts on this type of aggressive behaviour. I am going to help her as I believe he is showing warning signs and is a dangerous dog. I believe this is an urgent problem that needs addressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myzchev Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 I am sorry, but I would never toletate a dog biting members of my family or anyone else. I would be putting the dog down. I am not a believer in pack leader mentality. i have a background in dog training of over 35 years. Problem is people get dogs and do no training or proper socialising with them until they have a serious problem with tne dog. The poor dog pays in the end. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacks4nik Posted October 10, 2017 Author Share Posted October 10, 2017 1 minute ago, myzchev said: I am sorry, but I would never toletate a dog biting members of my family or anyone else. I would be putting the dog down. I am not a believer in pack leader mentality. i have a background in dog training of over 35 years. Problem is people get dogs and do no training or proper socialising with them until they have a serious problem with tne dog. The poor dog pays in the end. I agree with your thoughts on putting him down. I would never tolerate that kind of behaviour either and she wants to put him down, however she has 3 boys between 20 and 25 and they would never agree to that. I don't know much about the situation as she has only just told me but she is so fearful of him and he's aware of that. I predict this is going to end badly and someone is going to be seriously injured. I know he is 5 years old and needs constant training,however that will never happen. A sad situation indeed. I have owned dogs for 40 years and trained for 20 years. It makes me cross when people bring home a puppy they think is cute when they know nothing about the breed. It's hard to help people that don't want to put in the work and don't want to be helped. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diva Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 (edited) An Akita cross who bites his family warrants a professional behavioural assessment (or sadly pts as above). They are powerful dogs with strong natures, and crossing with a herding breed mixes the very different drives of those two breeds, he might not be very stable. It is not ideal to judge off a second hand report, but personally I would not mess around with well intentioned but unqualified attempts to fix it with family members at stake. Trying to get dominate with him, if that is your intention, could escalate into something serious. I would take him to a qualified vet behaviouralist, a trainer very experienced in aggression and highly recommended, or just accept he needs to be euthanised. Edited October 10, 2017 by Diva 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Gifts Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 (edited) I had a situation with an unpredictable dog. It was actually at the vets after yet another dog fight while I was trying to decide whether it would be pts or stitched up. I made the decision to pts due to the unpredictable behaviour. Two hours later I changed my mind. I just couldn't do it and decided we would try one more time. So I got in yet another behaviouralist who was highly recommended. It has been almost 2 years and we've only very recently had another issue. BUT, my relationship with both dogs is now so much stronger that I was able to stop things before they escalated into any danger. I have reviewed what prompted it and we have gone back to some of the original training again too. I know my dogs so much better now and I believe I am leader of their pack and they pay attention to what I want from them. It keeps us all safe. If you want to own a dog with behavioural issues it takes a lifelong commitment. One with human aggression needs extra special care because unlike dog aggression it still needs to interact with some humans for its food, etc. Steve Courtney at K9 Pro does amazing work with aggressive dogs but if the owners aren't committed to the dog post training then there is no point. I doubt a dog wants to be aggressive from fear or what have you and I doubt they want to be confined because of their behaviour. I've also met rescue dogs that were unpredictably aggressive due to something going on in their brains. How confusing that one minute you were getting pats and the next you were being yelled at but safety has to come first and some dogs are broken. If they love the dog they will get a professional assessment and make an informed decision. If my last behaviourist had said my dog was not manageable we would've returned to the vets straight away, but we put the work in then and continue with it today and we have a lovely, calm household. But we are always watching and we are always on hand. Edited October 10, 2017 by Little Gifts 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flaves Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 Dog would be at the vet immediately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boronia Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 send your friend this article that Thistle posted in In The News topic. I'm not impressed that the three boys are not caring for their mother's peace of mind considering she is frightened of the dog, not good enough! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papillon Kisses Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 On 11/10/2017 at 7:51 AM, jacks4nik said: A friend of mine was telling me about her Akita cross border collie who has been snarling and bitten family members. She is fearful of him as he is bearing his teeth. I explained about pack mentality and she needs to become the leader of the pack.. would love to know your thoughts on this type of aggressive behaviour. I am going to help her as I believe he is showing warning signs and is a dangerous dog. I believe this is an urgent problem that needs addressing. Pack theory has long been disproven. What they need to do is see a vet behaviourist. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogsfevr Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 Needs to be PTS ,if they want professional help then they need to find a reputable person who will access the dog correctly and advise as such . I would not get involved unless you have the qualifications to back up the reasons either way . thyroid issues could be a reason but this dog would get a one way ride 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 Oh my goodness, people. Aggression towards humans is certainly very serious, but this is a dog's life you are deciding OVER THE INTERNET without even laying eyes on it is somehow forfeit purely because he dares to tell his humans he wants none of it. I kind of hoped we are a little more enlightened these days than "dog bites human = dog dead". Just for the record, one of my dogs bit me once. 7 years ago. I did not put him to sleep because he told me something with his teeth. I bloody listened to him. He didn't bite me again. The trigger for that bite occurs frequently and no longer triggers him to bite. These things can be turned around, but you have the best chances of doing so if you get PROFESSIONAL help EARLY. The biggest issue I find with people having dogs that may injure other people or dogs is managing these dogs so that everyone is safe. It is not easy sometimes, but if it can be done, we have a good argument for attempting to change the dog's behaviour long-term. We do that by understanding what the dog is trying to achieve with their aggression. Aggression is functional after all. They aggress because it is working for them in some way. Believe me when I tell you, it is extremely rare for the function of aggression to be asserting dominance. Much more likely that the dog is buying space, trying to prevent something he doesn't like occurring, or trying to control stimuli he is nervous about. It is highly irresponsible to advise someone on how to treat an aggressive dog without qualifications and experience to support that advice. You could genuinely make it worse, and if they felt like suing you as a result, and you have no insurance, you could be in a world of trouble. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 On 11/10/2017 at 7:51 AM, jacks4nik said: A friend of mine was telling me about her Akita cross border collie who has been snarling and bitten family members. She is fearful of him as he is bearing his teeth. I explained about pack mentality and she needs to become the leader of the pack.. would love to know your thoughts on this type of aggressive behaviour. I am going to help her as I believe he is showing warning signs and is a dangerous dog. I believe this is an urgent problem that needs addressing. Of course it needs addressing!! the dog needs an examination by a vet ...it needs to be checked by a behaviourist as well. TRYING to 'help' may cause more damage . if you are simply trying to establish dominance .. and the dog is suffering with a medical problem .. it will be painful for everyone Unless YOU are a qualified trainer/behaviourist ... pls recommend a professional . You are asking for trouble . there are many out there , cheap services, fancy names, flashy websites ... leave'em alone. Pay the extra to see someone vouched for . THIS person is one I've heard of ... if the owners cannot , or will not pay for even one consultation ... then , yes PTS is the best option, before things get messed around with. ... You are kind to offer help - but dominance is NOT always the way to go . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhok Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 Considering Akita's are very prone to Thyroid problems and that aggressive behaviour can stem from it I would be getting a blood panel done, then I would be looking at eyes and ears as again Akita's can have PRA, especially if this is an older dog. As to the whole dominance theory thing, if the dog is more Akita than border collie you are essentially starting a long drawn out battle that you might never win. Akita's can be stubborn and they don't particularly learn well under an dominant handler. After a the vet I then would be looking at consulting a behaviourist. --Lhok 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newfsie Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 if the change has occurred suddenly there is often a reason.... Be it thyroid or pain. Some dogs like a lot of space when in pain and some family members do not know how to read dogs and get bitten. I would ask to see a Vet, behaviourist Vet and or behaviour Dog trainer, of which there are quite a few good ones now. One of our Dogs is a BC cross and she "grins", which with the uneducated people can get her into trouble....They think she is aggressive, she is not. So I taught her to "smile" on cue and that is the first thing we do when we meet and greet. This dog also likes her space. She gives plenty of warnings that I know a lot of people do not see. if she was cornered, she might also react with a snap....... But managed by us and people told how to give her space and wait for her to come to them, she is the best dog. It is definitely hard to judge on paper.......you need to see the dog and see what happens. People who are not experienced should leave the poor dog alone as things may get worse. It is better for this to be done by the people in the know............. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 21 hours ago, Lhok said: As to the whole dominance theory thing, if the dog is more Akita than border collie you are essentially starting a long drawn out battle that you might never win. Akita's can be stubborn and they don't particularly learn well under an dominant handler. IME with Northern breeds, you do best gaining their willing cooperation. Working with them rather than trying to be the boss. It is the same with my podengo as well. Their cooperation should not be taken for granted. They will give it to you if you make it worth their while, and that is just the kind of creatures they are. It's why I like working with them so much. They don't just do it because you told them, unless they are humouring you. You have to work to make it something they want to do, and if you do that enough, they become reasonably reliable. Barring spitz moments. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossumCorner Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 11 hours ago, corvus said: ... Barring spitz moments. That's our Rheneas. Yes he had all the blood tests, clear. And is now about 14-15, but still has the moments - losing his hearing and vision but not his attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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