So worried about snakes!!

[talking dog]

@TtD: if you want to make your garden safer, you might want to consider also this:

 

The worst case scenario is a snake with dogs in a plain garden where the snake can't hide and get cornered. All the snakes I found till now in our garden (eastern brown, red bellie, tiger) tried to get away to hide somewhere. You obviously want that they hide in a spot where they can't be reached by a dog, hence laying out and securing PVC pipes, e.g. along the fence, provides safety for the snake and for the dog. This hiding spots alone won't attract snakes as long as they are kept clean from food that otherwise would attract mice and rats (the prey the snakes are after). The pipes, e.g. 50 - 80 mm dia, 1.5 - 3 meters long) have also the advantage that they can be easily inspected and cleaned, and if you really find a snake one day in one of them, just close the ends with 2 pipe caps and call the snake buster.

 

Edit to add disclaimer: I just checked - in NSW (and it might be similar in other states) it is actually illegal catching a snake without a licence! Even in your own yard! You have to call a licensed snake catcher  - the last time I called one I had to wait 3 hours before he came to pick up the snake! Although illegal, I felt much safer regarding dogs, pets and kids, with the snake (red bellie) safely in the bucket and the lid closed.

Edited January 22, 2018 by talking dog

[PossumCorner]

On ‎22‎/‎01‎/‎2018 at 3:14 PM, Thistle the dog said:

   ....  just the name of the wire to keep them out that I can set around our boundaries would hopefully reduce the amount of snakes ...

Bunnings sell it, fairly expensive as wire mesh or netting goes, but get what you pay for it is very useful.  I use it around chicken brooders to keep mice/rats from decimating baby chicks, but if there was a snake after them also does the job.  It is much cheaper at places like Abbots, so worth doing a bit of hunting around for steel or fencing supplies places near you to price compare if you need longer rolls. 

 

Hey and agree re the talking dog posts, I'm not reading them through any more than I read Willem's:  a tad too gobbleldegook.  Heart maybe in the right place, head goes off at a tangent now and then. 

 

Here is the wire: I like Whites because a/ they are Australian b/it is good quality and c/ they have the decency to warn of zinc or whatever on their products up-front and offer advice.

https://whitesgroup.com.au/fencing-solutions/aviaries-cages/mouse-mesh-details.html

 

Edited January 24, 2018 by PossumCorner
Fixt.

[Kelpieboy]

Hi , new to the forums ( will do an intro piece when I get the time). We live in the crossroads of the southern Riverina , perfect brownie country  with a decent creek running a few hundred metres from our back fence , about 50  acres of bush in front of us , farms surrounding us with longish grass and the rest of the stuff that makes rural Australia just right for the brownie. When we moved here ( from QLD ) in 2014 we encountered brownies on almost a weekly basis all summer so we decided to do something about it. We removed anything that a snake could slither into , under or hide behind in the yard including raising the lowest level of all shrubs to around 500mm. The grass in the home yard is kept at a very low level all year round , the grass in the outer paddocks is burnt back in late August every year which makes movement for snakes difficult. We renovated the fences as much as possible , removed water sources , in short we did almost anything we could think of that would make life in our yard inhospitable for a snake.

Still the next summer we had snakes although not anywhere near as many. During that summer we also installed inground snake repellers and almost instantly we had no more snakes in the yard , that we or the dogs could see or find. Now I am not going to say that the snake repellers are the ducks nuts and everyone should go out and get them , stick them in the ground and not worry anymore , that would be foolish. I do think however that they do work as intended IF AND ONLY IF you do all the other stuff and remain ever vigilant. I will say this though , it is more than mere coincidence that snakes were seemingly avoiding our yard ( others on the street have lost a total of 5 dogs to snakebite compared to our 0 ) since we cleaned up and installed the vibrating stakes. It is also more than mere coincidence that we had an young brownie intrude our yard and found only a few metres from the front door this afternoon then upon inspection discovering 3 out of 4 devices no longer worked. These were the battery operated version and  have now been replaced with 4 new battery ones and 4 new solar types.

 However each should make up his own mind but to me any deterent is a good deterent because I cant estimate the cost of my dogs lives to me and a few days sweat and a few dollars is not even coming close to that cost.

[gillybob]

You just need to watch the Victorian snake catcher to see how many snakes he catches next to or around snake repellers! They don't work, don't expect them to.

Snakes are with us all the time even in the cities, if you have a yard with no water supply, cover, long grass, anything that can be a hiding place helps to make your yard not inviting.

They don't like to travel over short grass because it makes them vunerable, they love frogs and mice/rats, that's what they eat. So if you have a home with frogs and mice and rats you proberly have snakes now and then.

I have a 1/4 acre block divided by a fence the top half isn't snake friendly the bottom half is, Ive been here for 8 years and have seen two snakes.

I live near a creek and know that there are Tigers and RBBs and Browns, Copperheads because I have seen them. I love snakes and Im happy to have them in the bushy part of my yard. My dogs don't go there in summer to autumn. I believe we need to learn to live with snakes because we are loosing them very quickly and we need them, they do a job in nature.

Ive lived in Qld and NSW with the same attitude, in QLD it was all the most dangerous snakes and I never had a problem because I left them alone, made things not inviting and we all got on.

Do some reading on what snakes you have in your area and what they eat and the conditions they like, that will give you ideas on how you can make your yard safe for you and your animals.

If you have a snake please call to get it removed, most people are bitten because they are trying to kill a snake, snakes are shy, but if you corner them they will defend themselves.

Checkout your local snake catcher, have the number on your fridge just in case, they will catch and take the snake away.

Edited March 22, 2018 by gillybob

[Kelpieboy]

With all due respect to you gillybob but I can only go on the evidence I have seen in regards snake repellers. They are only described as repellers and not stoppers and should be treated as such. If used in conjuction with various other measures and as part of an overall scheme to repel snakes from a certain space then they can be effective. That is what my personal experience and visible evidence is showing me. We removed habitat and food/water sources , made the land as open as possible , grass is kept short , dogs food and water is inside the house..........we did it all and still snakes appeared although in greatly reduced numbers until we put the shakers in the ground. Maybe they were the tipping point for the snakes , on top of the rest of our measures , they decided to avoid the area. Who knows how a snake thinks about such things.

If you fail to remove the habitat and especially a food source then almost nothing will deter/repel a snake determined to get to a food/water source.

 

Now you may like snakes so good for you , me not so much. I guess with a 1/4 acre block you either live in a city or a town so snakes aren't all that common when compared to the bush so your attitude to them is understandable. I on the other hand live on a 25 acre setting in amongst thousands of acres of farm/ grazing land that is just cherry ripe for the brownie and they are here in large numbers. In the bush good luck to you snakey boy , go for your life but you come onto my land and be seen then your lifespan is measured in seconds and I make no apologies to anyone for that attitude. I have lost too much to them in the past to have a live and let live attitude , especially the brown.

 

You describe snakes as shy , yes to an extent most are but some like the brownie or the Taipan are certainly not shy especially when young.  Fight or flight is the way of things and too many times have I seen these type of snakes , when young , take the first option almost immediately. Mature snakes are a different kettle of fish and will usually take the second option if possible.

It should also be remembered that at various times of the spring to autumn seasons snakes will react differently. Early on they are very hungry and will become aggressive easily , same in late summer/autumn where the dual function for snakes is to hunt  for the winter hibernation coupled with breeding season. At these times even the lazy RBB can become quite feisty very quickly.

 

Now as for the vibrating snake repellers  , do they work or not ? My evidence says that used as part of a defensive system then they are effective in the role they are designed for , others may find that not to be the case although I would suggest that some people might think merely by deploying these devices that they are safe from snakes. However I don't believe it is my place or yours gillybob to state categorically that they do or don't work. I f someone feels that deploying them as a part of a defensive system then who are you gillybob to say not to , same as its not my place to say to use them.

 

 

[persephone]

Snakes . 
we live with them ..live in some fear of them ..have respect and admiration for them .
they take a dog every few years ..but we live in their bush ..we provide the water , in neat little containers , we provide lots of mice who feed on spilt grain, crumbs of dog food , etc  ( yes, we do use a 'safe' poison regularly..)

we see tracks on the sand to & fro water sources ...  90 times out of 100 they go on their way . IF they are in , or  directly around the house ..then they go to God . No questions asked . That said, there have only been two this Summer, thankfully - one of those a youngster , in the kitchen . late one night .Gave me a bit of a shock, it did. LOL .

We have Eastern Browns - fast, well camouflaged  - and sometimes, King Browns - absolutely gorgeous beasties, But NOT in trellises outside the kitchen , sadly . 
I would not spend money on those repeller things as I do not believe their effectiveness.
yes, I know stomping on the ground alerts snakes to our presence and allows them to move .
I also know of snakes who shelter in machinery sheds, ..or shearing sheds with the movement of sheep ..or under house floors , where I'm sure there is all sorts of vibration being carried  down to ground level ...  I hope the newer ones  keep you as safe as you believe they wilL. 

This page is interesting..but dated  > LINK

Edited March 23, 2018 by persephone

[W T]

1 hour ago, Kelpieboy said:

With all due respect to you gillybob but I can only go on the evidence I have seen in regards snake repellers. They are only described as repellers and not stoppers and should be treated as such. If used in conjuction with various other measures and as part of an overall scheme to repel snakes from a certain space then they can be effective. That is what my personal experience and visible evidence is showing me. We removed habitat and food/water sources , made the land as open as possible , grass is kept short , dogs food and water is inside the house..........we did it all and still snakes appeared although in greatly reduced numbers until we put the shakers in the ground. Maybe they were the tipping point for the snakes , on top of the rest of our measures , they decided to avoid the area. Who knows how a snake thinks about such things.

If you fail to remove the habitat and especially a food source then almost nothing will deter/repel a snake determined to get to a food/water source.

 

Now you may like snakes so good for you , me not so much. I guess with a 1/4 acre block you either live in a city or a town so snakes aren't all that common when compared to the bush so your attitude to them is understandable. I on the other hand live on a 25 acre setting in amongst thousands of acres of farm/ grazing land that is just cherry ripe for the brownie and they are here in large numbers. In the bush good luck to you snakey boy , go for your life but you come onto my land and be seen then your lifespan is measured in seconds and I make no apologies to anyone for that attitude. I have lost too much to them in the past to have a live and let live attitude , especially the brown.

 

You describe snakes as shy , yes to an extent most are but some like the brownie or the Taipan are certainly not shy especially when young.  Fight or flight is the way of things and too many times have I seen these type of snakes , when young , take the first option almost immediately. Mature snakes are a different kettle of fish and will usually take the second option if possible.

It should also be remembered that at various times of the spring to autumn seasons snakes will react differently. Early on they are very hungry and will become aggressive easily , same in late summer/autumn where the dual function for snakes is to hunt  for the winter hibernation coupled with breeding season. At these times even the lazy RBB can become quite feisty very quickly.

 

Now as for the vibrating snake repellers  , do they work or not ? My evidence says that used as part of a defensive system then they are effective in the role they are designed for , others may find that not to be the case although I would suggest that some people might think merely by deploying these devices that they are safe from snakes. However I don't believe it is my place or yours gillybob to state categorically that they do or don't work. I f someone feels that deploying them as a part of a defensive system then who are you gillybob to say not to , same as its not my place to say to use them.

 

 

Sorry mate, but they don't work, and here is why:

 

they claim to send out vibration that would alarm the snake to move away. Now, it is somehow true that most snakes will try to get away if you stamp your feet on the ground thus generating some kind of vibration (like a little local earthquake); snakes are very sensible and can recognize from the energy that results in those vibration that you are just too big to be on their food list, and that it might be even dangerous for themselves to get too close to the center of this little "earthquake".

 

Now consider the energy that is required for you to walk (and stamping your food on the ground): you have to move and carry actually your own weight. Now I don't know how big you are, lets talk about a person that has 70 kg. To get some understanding how much energy is needed for moving a 70 kg body just imagine that you have to carry this body for a while on your shoulders and I guess we can agree that this is a very exhausting exercise. Now every tool / device that would have to simulate a person walking would require to deliver a similar amount of energy - and that is where these gadgets fail: just hold one in you hand and feel their vibrating energy and compare it with having a 70 kg heavy person sitting on your shoulder - the energy (in form of vibration) those device send out is by far not comparable with the energy required to carry / move a 70 kg body. Maybe it could simulate - if it is a bigger one - the energy of a small mouse, but mostly it will be something with the size of a cockroach, so the likelihood that they attract snakes is actually bigger as those vermin is actually on their food list.

 

If you still have your invoices you will get your money back as selling them is fraud. Maybe write to ACCC - snakes can be a serious problem and claiming that those gadget protect you and your family from snakes can be close to manslaughter. 

[Kelpieboy]

Each to their own on this subject. I believe as a PART of a system they play a role , on their own without all the other precautions that role would be somewhat diminished. I feel safer with them deployed than without and that will do me just fine. To me any precaution is worth investigation and employment rather than doing nothing.

 

In regards to snake catcher videos showing things that don't work .....I will say only this , one must consider the motives of the snake catcher when weighing up the video evidence. The video would hardly be likely to show much that is/may be effective because of the vested interest of the video maker. I would suggest that a fair % of repellers and other alternative devices are either non functional, poorly/incorrectly deployed or used as a one out in an otherwise snake friendly environment. Sorry but a snake catcher video just isn't independent enough for me to take as gospel.

[Kelpieboy]

4 hours ago, W T said:

Sorry mate, but they don't work, and here is why:

 

they claim to send out vibration that would alarm the snake to move away. Now, it is somehow true that most snakes will try to get away if you stamp your feet on the ground thus generating some kind of vibration (like a little local earthquake); snakes are very sensible and can recognize from the energy that results in those vibration that you are just too big to be on their food list, and that it might be even dangerous for themselves to get too close to the center of this little "earthquake".

 

Now consider the energy that is required for you to walk (and stamping your food on the ground): you have to move and carry actually your own weight. Now I don't know how big you are, lets talk about a person that has 70 kg. To get some understanding how much energy is needed for moving a 70 kg body just imagine that you have to carry this body for a while on your shoulders and I guess we can agree that this is a very exhausting exercise. Now every tool / device that would have to simulate a person walking would require to deliver a similar amount of energy - and that is where these gadgets fail: just hold one in you hand and feel their vibrating energy and compare it with having a 70 kg heavy person sitting on your shoulder - the energy (in form of vibration) those device send out is by far not comparable with the energy required to carry / move a 70 kg body. Maybe it could simulate - if it is a bigger one - the energy of a small mouse, but mostly it will be something with the size of a cockroach, so the likelihood that they attract snakes is actually bigger as those vermin is actually on their food list.

 

If you still have your invoices you will get your money back as selling them is fraud. Maybe write to ACCC - snakes can be a serious problem and claiming that those gadget protect you and your family from snakes can be close to manslaughter. 

Not going to get into an argument with you over this but the "science" you use to support your case is flawed in several directions. In regards to the legal assertion you have made at the end of your post shows you have no real understanding of the Law in these matters.

 

However just to play the game a bit...........if your flawed science was in any way true then surely I would encounter snakes at or around the repellers because according to your science a snake might think it was vermin. That is what you asserted is it not  ? Just so I am clear on this , you state that you believe the repeller would actually be an attractor and therefore may be dangerous ?  I suggest you revisit your science before making further comment using that science as your cornerstone argument.

Anyway have a good day sir , we are all entitled to an opinion.

[gillybob]

Sounds like a bit of an advertisement for repellers to me.

 

[Kirislin]

On 9/22/2017 at 8:12 PM, karen15 said:

this lovely fellow was across a single lane road (read huge) where my horse lived. I had to poke him with a stick to get him to move off the road and into the tree. Note for next time, close car door before stick poking incase snakey thinks car is safe refuge.....

thats not a venomous snake

 

[W T]

4 hours ago, gillybob said:

Sounds like a bit of an advertisement for repellers to me.

 

you know they must do a good job if they are sold in NZ https://www.trademe.co.nz/home-living/outdoor-garden-conservatory/gardening-landscaping-supplies/other/auction-1582966560.htm 

[gillybob]

Those poor Kiwis I cant think of anything worse than a country without reptiles, do they have any? I cant remember any Kiwis that I have known mentioning them.

I love a nice reptile be it a snake of any kind or a lizard or any other small animal.

Imagine  life without Geckos or skinks in your garden. My Blueys eat my strawberries and snails, I don't mind. Its usually a race between me, the dogs and the Blueys.

Edited to say that supposed rat/mouse wire kills snakes very slowly over days, its terrible stuff.

Edited March 30, 2018 by gillybob

[sparkycat]

I am in a country town and have a winter creek at the bottom of my yard - in the last 5 years I have had a large brown in the garden and a cute little Red belly black in the house.

 

The brown was scared away by my Lappie barking and me yelling at everyone to go inside - at the same time one cat decided the yelling was the Borzoi's fault and chased them across the yard with them doing the Borzoi death scream !!!!

 

The little red belly (about 30 cm long ) was last Friday night and it slithered along the wall into my Lappie's fur ! Luckily she was 90% asleep so I got her into another room before she realised what was happening. I had a chat to the little snake and we decided it would be better outside. Plastic container over the top - it kept popping it's head out then a piece of cardboard slid underneath then threw the lot over the back fence - the Borzoi's didn't wake up off their couches and the cats were in another room. But I did have a Brandy after that !

 

Now huntsman are another story - horrible things !!!!!!!!

 

 

[Animal House]

 

Beautiful story sparky, especially the cat chasing the Borzoi's 

 

I wish there was more people with your attitude when it comes to snakes. 

[Scottsmum]

On 3/30/2018 at 1:13 PM, gillybob said:

Those poor Kiwis I cant think of anything worse than a country without reptiles, do they have any? I cant remember any Kiwis that I have known mentioning them.

 

There are tuataras.

Cool fact: not a lizard or a snake.

 

https://blogs.adelaide.edu.au/environment/2017/05/12/guest-post-150-years-not-a-lizard/

 

https://goo.gl/images/rVSEv4

 

 

 

Edited March 31, 2018 by Scottsmum

[gillybob]

Thanks SM.

If you like snakes and are interested in snakes from everywhere have a look at viperkeeper on facebook, great page and very interesting man with a lot of knowledge of snakes.

He is in USA but has vipers and cobras as well as PNG Taipans and Browns and Indo pigmy mulga snakes.

Check it out his collection is beautiful and he helps supply snakes for venom collection and has helped in making the anti-venine for PNG Taipans that kill thousands of people a year in PNG.

[PossumCorner]

Thousands a year!  Not questioning that it's right, have no idea, but sheesh that's huge numbers.

[RuralPug]

13 hours ago, Scottsmum said:

There are tuataras.

Cool fact: not a lizard or a snake.

 

https://blogs.adelaide.edu.au/environment/2017/05/12/guest-post-150-years-not-a-lizard/

 

https://goo.gl/images/rVSEv4

 

 

 

Wow! 

[RuralPug]

6 hours ago, PossumCorner said:

Thousands a year!  Not questioning that it's right, have no idea, but sheesh that's huge numbers.

A quick google tells me that indeed, it used to be over a thousand per year. Since the Port Moresby General Hospital began to treat snakebite victims with anti venom, the annual death toll has dropped to only a couple of hundred a year.  The taipan is endemic throughout PNG. 
It's amazing what you learn on DOL!