Humping Posture In 10Week Old Rotti.

[Paul777]

Thanks todierkx, correct.

Although I had no history on Ponti (brought home as an 18 month old) I suspect that he was raised in a family situation (he adored children & had a definite preference for human females) where the head of the house had no idea how to handle a dog of this nature & was given up because of mistakes made.

I hadn't given the 'collar grab' issue much thought before, but me thinks that 'dad' in the family must've used harsh corrective measures that needed training to undo. Grabbing his collar possibly triggered a bad memory? (again, it only happened the once where I thought that I had his attention)

It would piss me off if someone just grabbed me without warning as well.

It comes back to, if one desires respect one must give respect : )

Edited December 21, 2016 by Paul777

[Kavik]

Lots of dogs don't like having their collar grabbed, it doesn't necessarily mean they were mistreated - but it is something you can work on :)

[Paul777]

Hey Simply Grand

Yes I've had pups before but not for over 30 years. My attitudes about life in general were very different back then & although I trained my dogs myself (always expected an obedient dog) I'm sure that my methods back then were no-doubt harsh : ( & not worth remembering.

He IS a big baby. Yesterday I trod on his little paw & he screamed his head off. I'm an amputee. When one steps on something unknowingly when wearing shoes, one can feel it before full weight is applied & possibly able to react. With a prosthetic leg, there's no feeling at all & poor Zagan got my full weight.

He ran off screaming looking at me with suspicion & I had to go after him. I picked him up while sitting, with his back in my chest & cooed my apologies.

His reaction seemed to be one of relief. When I 'kissed better' his little paw he got all excited & licked my beard, lol. Once he settled he trotted after me without any limp, thank goodness. He was no-doubt just as frightened as he was hurt. Just a baby (he's sleeping off his breakfast under my feet as I type)

Yes, I've been reading SteveK9Pros ToT & I'm quite impressed with his ideas. As it happens, I'm also in the Hawkesbury area which is very convenient. I've yet to read the NILIF tutorial yet but will. A few tips from him now would be helpful keeping in mind that we'll be doing protection training later on.

I agree with your what works at 10 weeks may not be reliable later comment, so we're just doing the basics for now.

At this age, repetition, positive reinforcement & patience is the key. Zagan is very food driven & very smart which makes it much easier.

[Paul777]

Hey Kavik.

I'm what's called 'clairsentient' & get impressions/feelings that are rarely wrong (I've felt the presence of spirits since childhood, for e.g.)

From day one, my gut feeling was that Ponti was raised by a migrant family where the father used (like myself in my youth) harsh/incorrect methods to train.

To my mind, there's a big difference between "mistreated" & doing the wrong thing out of well-intentioned ignorance.

Ponti was very well trained & extremely obedient. He taught me much about mutual respect. It wasn't just me, others would say 'that dog can read your mind'. Yep, we were best mates & although he passed over more than 7 years ago, I still think off him fondly every day.

Ponti taught me that 'grabbing' his collar without getting his attention first (even unwittingly) is rude & ignorant & I never made that mistake again.

What I learnt from Ponti is being applied to little Zagan : )

Edited December 21, 2016 by Paul777

[Kavik]

Collar Grab game

[Paul777]

I'm fully aware that not all Rotties are the same... my pets were just fine at alerting if there was any untoward disturbance around the house, but they were also prefectly well behaved and socially acceptable canine citizens when out and about. I'm not of the opinion that a pet needs to be trained as a protection dog to "do their job" at home - mine simply assumed the role if needed, and were friendly when I wanted them to be.

In my new job I'm working in close quarters with security trained protection and patrol dogs (Rotties and GSDs)... and most of them are the cuddliest trollopes with those of us who have to look after them when they aren't out working. There are one or two who don't have an off switch, but we work around that issue.

T.

"cuddliest trollopes" hahaha Ponti was a different dog at home, than on a lead out & about. At home, I couldn't have asked for better. Being aware of his imposing stature, he'd gently try to show those who reacted with fear that he was harmless. Such a sweet natured fella.

On a lead out in public however, he was a different boy. So extremely protective that he wouldn't allow anyone to come near me. And not just on a lead, he'd do it in the car too. Whenever in public.

This is something that I'd prefer to avoid with Zagan.

It does come down to what one expects from their furry companions. A friend who has 4 cats, also has a mouse problem, useless things they are. Many would disagree with me, but a cat who can't be bothered eradicating rodents isn't worth feeding.

A dog who's not capable of bailing up a burglar for e.g., is better off housed with owners who don't expect that & just want "cuddly trollopes" 100% of the time. But that's just me : )

[Paul777]

While on the subject of 'protection' training.

For those who may not know, protection training comes after passing obedience training & before attack training.

Protection training is designed to build a dogs confidence.

[Loving my Oldies]

He IS a big baby. Yesterday I trod on his little paw & he screamed his head off. I'm an amputee. When one steps on something unknowingly when wearing shoes, one can feel it before full weight is applied & possibly able to react. With a prosthetic leg, there's no feeling at all & poor Zagan got my full weight.

He ran off screaming looking at me with suspicion & I had to go after him. I picked him up while sitting, with his back in my chest & cooed my apologies.

His reaction seemed to be one of relief. When I 'kissed better' his little paw he got all excited & licked my beard, lol. Once he settled he trotted after me without any limp, thank goodness. He was no-doubt just as frightened as he was hurt. Just a baby (he's sleeping off his breakfast under my feet as I type)

Oh - little sweetheart Dogs are so forgiving. I have one littlie who screams blue murder at the sight of nail clippers. And after I have managed to cut one (on momentous occasions, two), she is as sweet and licky (please don’t hurt me) and comfortable.

[tdierikx]

None of my 8 Rotties over the years have needed any training on how to behave when someone tried to enter my proprty without an invitation... *grin*

Invited guests were there for cuddles though... and who can say no to a Rotti demanding cuddles?

T.

[Paul777]

No, not the nail clippers!

When my beautiful Ponti got past 12.5yo, he could no longer go on his daily walk & got his exercise at his pace (still frolicked at times like a pup) in the backyard. The long walks obviated the need for me to ever to have clipped his nails, as the pavement would keep them trim.

I asked around & thought that I knew how to do it myself. On the 5th nail I got his quick. Gee did he yelp. It took 30 mins of a pressure pad to stop the bleeding with one hand, stroking him with the other while offering my apologies. I felt so bad.

He never forgot & wouldn't let me have another go (fair enough I say)

After a long explanation, while showing him a file & offering a demonstration of how it was done, he would allow me to file them down once a week or so, lol.

Because I did it weekly, it only took a few minutes. His relief when finished was obvious.

[tdierikx]

My uncle had a Rotti who let a burglar into the house and watched from the couch as the guy collected all the electronics and put them by the door... but as soon as the guy went to leave, Vandal jumped on him and pinned the poor bugger by the throat until my uncle got home... lol! The burglar was so scared he had messed his pants and was actually taken to hospital in a state of shock when the police came to deal with him. Vandal hadn't left a mark on him... *grin*

Good boy Vandal!

T.

[Guest crazydoglady99]

Hahahaha that's an awesome story T!!!

[persephone]

My uncle had a Rotti who let a burglar into the house and watched from the couch as the guy collected all the electronics and put them by the door... but as soon as the guy went to leave, Vandal jumped on him and pinned the poor bugger by the throat until my uncle got home... lol! The burglar was so scared he had messed his pants and was actually taken to hospital in a state of shock when the police came to deal with him. Vandal hadn't left a mark on him... *grin*

Good boy Vandal!

T.

Excellent!!

Friends had a GSD who would always let visitors onboard their houseboat... but they were not allowed off unless he got the 'OK' He once held two burglars at bay 'til his owners got back - they needed new clothes too ;)

[Paul777]

None of my 8 Rotties over the years have needed any training on how to behave when someone tried to enter my proprty without an invitation... *grin*

Invited guests were there for cuddles though... and who can say no to a Rotti demanding cuddles?

T.

hahaha, I can see it in my minds eye. And who'd walk past a Rotti protecting his home &/or owner? lol

It's the thing that I love the most about Rottis; so sweet-natured, who protect out of love & affection rather than meanness.

Which leads me to SteveK9Pro's methods. When I purchased Ponti, the trainers offered the same advice as SteveK9Pro's; 'Don't let your dog interact with other people'. Eventually it was just so obvious that Ponti was a friendly boy, I'd allow him to say hello to friends & family before sending him to his bed in the same room as us. I fully understand the psychology behind it, & he's right, but not letting them say hello makes me feel like a bit of a meanie.

I sold a Ducati motorcycle to buy Ponti after buying a house, to protect my then wife who'd been attacked the last time that we lived in a house & was terrified to be left alone in a large home. Didn't then realise that I'd love that boy more than any motorbike.

It takes me a few minutes to get my prosthesis on when I awake. In those moments, when I hear inexplicable night-time noises, I feel vulnerable. Especially since several neighbourhood break-ins, a few while occupants were home.

I know I don't need to explain, but people have their reasons : )

[Paul777]

Good boy Vandal, hahaha.

German Shepherds are another favourite.

I've heard several similar stories over the years. The funniest bit is when the owners describe the 'I did real good' smiles of satisfaction on the dogs faces.

One mate said the intruder relaxed when 'Fang' (forget his name) turned from menacing to happy puppy when greeting my mate Bill & as soon as the bloke relaxed, Fang turned back onto him bailing him up against the wall in the backyard as if to say "I'm not talking to you!" And then he'd alternate between turning to wag tail & grin at Bill, then menace the intruder, hahaha.

Serves them right.

[Simply Grand]

I think the dog that went "off his head" was his previous Rotti SG... I think he said he'd got it as an adult also.

T.

Ah, I see, that makes more sense!

[Simply Grand]

Good boy Vandal, hahaha.

German Shepherds are another favourite.

I've heard several similar stories over the years. The funniest bit is when the owners describe the 'I did real good' smiles of satisfaction on the dogs faces.

One mate said the intruder relaxed when 'Fang' (forget his name) turned from menacing to happy puppy when greeting my mate Bill & as soon as the bloke relaxed, Fang turned back onto him bailing him up against the wall in the backyard as if to say "I'm not talking to you!" And then he'd alternate between turning to wag tail & grin at Bill, then menace the intruder, hahaha.

Serves them right.

That's really cute (not for the intruder obviously!), good dog

[tdierikx]

'Don't let your dog interact with other people'.

I'm not a fan of that idea. I want my dogs to be friendly under normal circumstances. I want to be able to take them out in public or to the vet without them constantly being on alert and mistrusting everyone. Most dogs will naturally do what's needed to alert or stop an intruder if they are a part of the family unit...

T.

[Roova]

I think the theory is not to avoid people but don't let interactions happen where the dog starts to build a high value for other people. They want the dog neutral instead.

[karen15]

I haven't read all the posts but on the "value of people" my staffy was great at knowing the difference between allowed people and strangers. Allowed people were people I introduced him to (included neighbours). I had many neighbours comment over the years that when he barked they knew there was a stranger around. They always loved him. The little westie has started doing the same. Not quite as effective as a deterrent but we had a very sheepish neighbour the other night who'd been trying to get on my roof to retrieve a stuck toy. The little dog had given him what for from the front door.

I had a stalker when I got the staffy, so my dogs always sleep next to the bed. If someone gets in the house they can't be much help if they're outside.