westiemum Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 1475906498[/url]' post='6849050']1475896776[/url]' post='6849006']Remidog you say you have proof of purchase;what does that consist of,has this guy put his signature to anything ? He should know that he needs to transfer ownership and my concern is that if he was to take the dog back and you don't get your money back or he does this again to someone else.you need to contact the registry that handles your dogs microchip and tell them the old owner has not signed the transfer papers. If you send them proof of purchase they may contact him and ask him to change ownership to you at once or they may do anyway once you have shown a signed document / receipt of sale. No signature on anything. I just have microchip form details, vet information etc. We have all of the communication between us saved which can clearly show that the dog was sold to us as well as a copy of the advertisement of the dog. We will print a transfer of ownership form tonight and get him to sign tomorrow if it's decided she will stay with us. My dad is actually a lawyer so could also do a stat Dec for me no problems as well. Hopefully there doesn't become any bigger issues here I would hate to think that they would just take the dog back and we would be out of pocket all that money! If they so desperately wanted her back we would definitely give her back before a situation like that would arise. I wouldn't be letting them take the dog without paying or transferring cash on the spot. Then write a receipt/note which you both sign noting money exchange and transfer of dog ownership back to them. And check with your Dad. But personally I think the dog us better off with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remidog Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 1475906498[/url]' post='6849050']1475896776[/url]' post='6849006']Remidog you say you have proof of purchase;what does that consist of,has this guy put his signature to anything ? He should know that he needs to transfer ownership and my concern is that if he was to take the dog back and you don't get your money back or he does this again to someone else.you need to contact the registry that handles your dogs microchip and tell them the old owner has not signed the transfer papers. If you send them proof of purchase they may contact him and ask him to change ownership to you at once or they may do anyway once you have shown a signed document / receipt of sale. No signature on anything. I just have microchip form details, vet information etc. We have all of the communication between us saved which can clearly show that the dog was sold to us as well as a copy of the advertisement of the dog. We will print a transfer of ownership form tonight and get him to sign tomorrow if it's decided she will stay with us. My dad is actually a lawyer so could also do a stat Dec for me no problems as well. Hopefully there doesn't become any bigger issues here I would hate to think that they would just take the dog back and we would be out of pocket all that money! If they so desperately wanted her back we would definitely give her back before a situation like that would arise. I wouldn't be letting them take the dog without paying or transferring cash on the spot. Then write a receipt/note which you both sign noting money exchange and transfer of dog ownership back to them. And check with your Dad. But personally I think the dog us better off with you. If they press to have her back it will definitely be only if they can give us cash back on the spot. My dad told me quite often people do bank transfers and then call for them to be reversed. I don't think these people would do anything like that at all but I guess you can never be too careful. It's not about the money at all, we purchased the dog thinking it would be forever, but if it's not we don't want to be out of pocket the receipt/note idea is a good one, thank you! We took her for a walk through a national park near us this morning and she had a great time! It's hard not to get attached, but I'm trying to keep a bit of distance in case we have to give her back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Tomorrow .. can you meet them somewhere neutral ? WITHOUT THE DOG the dog will make things difficult - she will be really pleased to see the 'old' owner ..and that will make you feel awful. I do hope they are not visiting your house Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purdie Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 You are going to have to decide by tomorrow if you want to keep the dog or not and stick to your guns either way. What if he turns up and wants the dog back are you going to just cave in and hand her back. I think this guy has a cheek ;he had the dog listed for sale for some time and so had reached a decision that was best for the dog then after the sale he neglects to fill out a transfer of ownership and changes his mind and where are these grieving teenagers; no where to be seen; if they wanted to keep the dog so much they should have paid more attention to the dog and helped with it's care.This family may well be distraught but what about the feelings of you and your family and the dog . You have been put on an emotional roller coaster and i don't think that is fair on you and your family. I guess you could tell your 2 year old that the dog missed it's mum and wanted to go home but really you have been put in a very.stressful situation. If you decide to give back the dog make sure you get cash in hand before you hand over the dog.Take a third party witness with you whatever you decide to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulesP Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Good luck for tomorrow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remidog Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 You are going to have to decide by tomorrow if you want to keep the dog or not and stick to your guns either way. What if he turns up and wants the dog back are you going to just cave in and hand her back. I think this guy has a cheek ;he had the dog listed for sale for some time and so had reached a decision that was best for the dog then after the sale he neglects to fill out a transfer of ownership and changes his mind and where are these grieving teenagers; no where to be seen; if they wanted to keep the dog so much they should have paid more attention to the dog and helped with it's care.This family may well be distraught but what about the feelings of you and your family and the dog . You have been put on an emotional roller coaster and i don't think that is fair on you and your family. I guess you could tell your 2 year old that the dog missed it's mum and wanted to go home but really you have been put in a very.stressful situation. If you decide to give back the dog make sure you get cash in hand before you hand over the dog.Take a third party witness with you whatever you decide to do. We definitely want to keep her, there's no doubt about that. The issue is just we weren't sure if the right thing to do was give her back if they were that upset. And also we want to do it right as have all her details in our names, and not be worried that someone could come and potentially snatch her and us not have proof that we own her. We plan on having all the forms printed to be signed tomorrow if she is staying with us. We have made it clear that we want to keep her. I just don't want a big drama over it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remidog Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 Good luck for tomorrow! Thank you :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remidog Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 Tomorrow .. can you meet them somewhere neutral ? WITHOUT THE DOG the dog will make things difficult - she will be really pleased to see the 'old' owner ..and that will make you feel awful. I do hope they are not visiting your house Well the whole reason he wanted to come was to visit the dog. From he messages he has sent yesterday it seems he knows she will be staying with us as he's not said things like "she will have a great life with you" etc. I feel like I can't say no to him visiting her now because that's what we organised and the last thing I want is for any of this to turn nasty I have no problems with having a civil relationship with this people and meeting them out somewhere in the future every now and then so they can see the dog. I just don't want to be stressed out about the situation anymore. I hope tomorrow goes well! Eek! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Best Dogs! Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) Please try to relax! The more you talk about it, the more it sounds like they are struggling with their decision because they do not know what is right either. Fair enough, sounds like they love their dog a lot! So of course will be struggling with all of this. Take your documents, sit down and have a chat with them. Make a cup of tea for everyone. Whatever decision happens, make sure both you and him are clear on it so no room for confusion. (with polite language of course! You are all going to be a bit emotional regardless) If it looks like it's going to become your dog, but with some visits allowed, just ask them to put it in signed writing that the dog is yours but they'd like to visit her or get updates on how she is going at christmas or something. Get the chip changes signed. If it looks like they've realised they've made a horrible mistake and are all set to reorganise their schedule for their dog - I'd give her back and look for another dog. Busy hours and a small yard do not a bad owner make. They can work around it and through it, but may not have realised that it is totally feasible. It is very easy to put up a rehoming add then forget about it until it all happens and you're without a loved companion. You mentioned earlier they'd offered to return the money and then some? I think that would lean against it being a scam and more of an "oh god what did we do". It is unfortunate that sometimes people think the best thing is to surrender a pet, without realising they can work through it. I did it once, because I had people telling me that as a uni student I couldn't possible care for my 3 pets properly, between study and work. So I rehomed 2 of them. I have regretted it ever since, in retrospect it was completely feasible! But I did not realise this because everyone else seemed to think I couldn't. So I sympathise greatly with the former owners, especially since they worked up the courage to contact you so quickly! I didn't want to bother the new owners but even 8 years later, it still hurts. So please try not to overthink it. You are being very reasonable, but you don't know what's going on in their heads and what they're thinking. That is why you need to sit down and talk about it! But also try not to overthink it and go in with assumptions that they are a poor owner or a dodgy scam - as it may come through in your conversation with them. You are doing your best and you're being quite a decent person about it. Have the meeting and hear out their thoughts and feelings, share yours, come to an agreement of sorts together. Edited October 8, 2016 by Thistle the dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Great post TTD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remidog Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 Please try to relax! .Busy hours and a small yard do not a bad owner make. It is very easy to put up a rehoming add then forget about it until it all happens and you're without a loved companion. You mentioned earlier they'd offered to return the money and then some? I think that would lean against it being a scam and more of an "oh god what did we do". You are doing your best and you're being quite a decent person about it. Have the meeting and hear out their thoughts and feelings, share yours, come to an agreement of sorts together. Thank you Thistle the dog, really appreciate the reply. I've only quoted a few points of yours as your reply was really long :) I definitely don't think they are bad people or that they didn't care for the dog, I know they did. And like you said, small yard and busy hours do not make a bad owner. My hope if she goes back to them is that they have realised they can fit walks etc in and make that time for her. I also think they are genuine people and not a scam. In fact, that hadn't crossed my mind until I read a few comments. I just want to make sure that we all enter the agreement properly, and that we are protected whichever way it goes. If she becomes our dog we want her registered asap with our details, and if she doesn't then we expect a full cash refund. I definitely don't think these people are trying to rip us off, probably they just really miss the dog. And I can see why, because we love her already! And thank you for the kind words :) I'm trying to be a decent person and see this from all sides, and focus on what's best for the dog. I just hope that whichever way it goes we can get it fully resolved tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 They have a reciept for the purchase of the dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remidog Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) We have the partner of the man messaging us now asking for her back. I guess we will just give her back but I'm so frustrated and upset at this whole thing. I'm in tears and it just feels like we are getting the raw end of the stick because we fairly purchased this beautiful dog after waiting so long to find the right one, and now we have to give her back because they miss her Edited October 8, 2016 by Remidog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Best Dogs! Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Oh remi, lots of hugs! You will find yourself a gorgeous GSD that does not come with such complicated attachments! Can you go to some local dog shows to meet breeders in person? It seems to me they pass news by word of mouth when a dog is in need of a home, internet advertisements being a last resort. I'm sure they'll know of many dogs who have gone back to breeders through no fault of their own and are waiting to put muddy paws all over your heart! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remidog Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 Oh remi, lots of hugs! You will find yourself a gorgeous GSD that does not come with such complicated attachments! Can you go to some local dog shows to meet breeders in person? It seems to me they pass news by word of mouth when a dog is in need of a home, internet advertisements being a last resort. I'm sure they'll know of many dogs who have gone back to breeders through no fault of their own and are waiting to put muddy paws all over your heart! Thank you. I have emailed every registered breeder on the list on the dogzonline website so hopefully someone can help us. Horrible situation and I wish the owners put more thought into their decision because it's not been fair on us. Technically I know we don't have to give her back, but I can't keep her with all this pressure on us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirislin Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) Oh remi, lots of hugs! You will find yourself a gorgeous GSD that does not come with such complicated attachments! Can you go to some local dog shows to meet breeders in person? It seems to me they pass news by word of mouth when a dog is in need of a home, internet advertisements being a last resort. I'm sure they'll know of many dogs who have gone back to breeders through no fault of their own and are waiting to put muddy paws all over your heart! Thank you. I have emailed every registered breeder on the list on the dogzonline website so hopefully someone can help us. Horrible situation and I wish the owners put more thought into their decision because it's not been fair on us. Technically I know we don't have to give her back, but I can't keep her with all this pressure on us If you do allow them to purchase her back, perhaps tell them to contact you first (to give you first choice/refusal) if they once again realise they cannot keep her. Edited October 8, 2016 by Kirislin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Oh remi, lots of hugs! You will find yourself a gorgeous GSD that does not come with such complicated attachments! Can you go to some local dog shows to meet breeders in person? It seems to me they pass news by word of mouth when a dog is in need of a home, internet advertisements being a last resort. I'm sure they'll know of many dogs who have gone back to breeders through no fault of their own and are waiting to put muddy paws all over your heart! Thank you. I have emailed every registered breeder on the list on the dogzonline website so hopefully someone can help us. Horrible situation and I wish the owners put more thought into their decision because it's not been fair on us. Technically I know we don't have to give her back, but I can't keep her with all this pressure on us Understand - but I still worry about these people - they are far more concerned about themselves than their dogs welfare. I admire the approach you are taking but I'm not sure I would have been as understanding as you are. Good luck - lots of good advice here and I hope tomorrow goes OK for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remidog Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 I worry about that too, I really feel we have so much more time etc for her, but I feel like we are stuck between a rock and a hard place. I think we will just give her back we don't want to and feel like it's so unfair but now we have two people messaging us and making us feel bad. And if she's not in our name etc then if she's lost/stolen we have no proof of ownership and we are out of pocket a lot of money It's horrible to have done everything right and then get bitten like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddy Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Personally, I'd just give the dog back. I couldn't live with a dog that already had so many negative associations attached to it and given the dog's future welfare with the original owners is all just speculation (which you're probably not being entirely objective about, given the emotional stake you have in the issue*), I don't think there's any real reason to fight it out. Give the dog back, get one that doesn't come with a heap of baggage and stress, save yourself a lot of trouble. As an aside.. seems to be plenty of mature GSDs listed here and they're not exactly a rare breed so finding another shouldn't be that hard. *Not trying to be mean here, but I think it's almost impossible to look objectively and carefully at a situation when you're already so emotionally invested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavNrott Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 They have a reciept for the purchase of the dog. I would keep the dog because life will be better for the dog with you. Remidog said she has nothing bearing the previous owners signature and that's a bit of a worry. It sounds like you don't have a signed receipt. I hope you do. Ask your Father to look closely into the laws of rehoming/selling of an animal. You need to know these details just in case. The rescue girls on this forum can probably also help with the rules. They know what they are. What the previous owners are now doing is below the belt. First the distraught teens who were not caring for the dog anyway and now the partner/wife. I would keep the dog because she'll have a better life with your family and this is what it was all about until the old owners started moving the goal posts and making it about themselves. Both you and they know the dog is in a better home with you. All should start thinking about the welfare of the dog again. I would call the previous owners and tell them I'll not be returning the dog and would like to cancel their visit on Sunday because the dog has settled in nicely and she'll think they've come to take her home. It would definitely unsettle her. Perhaps you can take the dog to meet them on neutral territory in a week or two if they still want to see her. It's natural for them to miss their dog for the first few days but they don't want to keep her or they would not have gone to those lengths to find her a new home. What they're feeling is a knee jerk reaction to her absence and in a few more days they'll get used to her not being with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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