Greyhound Racing To Be Shut Down

[Diva]

The report says if I live in NSW and lure course it should be a criminal offense for me to keep a chook or a cat because I might decide to live bait.

They found no evidence of any wrongdoing in lure coursing. None of the financial or cultural incentives that apply in commercial greyhound racing apply in lure coursing.

But I would be banned from pet keeping because as a meek and mild middle aged participant in a dog sport I might at heart be an animal abuser.

Time to ditch the idea that there has to be an actual risk to animals for your personal liberties to be infringed. Not doing anything wrong and having less than zero probability of acting cruelly counts for less than nothing if this becomes law.

It would set a huge precedent to take away your ability to own animals because someone who knows nothing sees a possibility someone 'could' act cruelly, despite no supporting evidence.

Edited July 14, 2016 by Diva

[BarbedWire]

Good point about the OHS Westiemum

Edited July 15, 2016 by sarspididious

[SkySoaringMagpie]

But IMO lure coursing effects and other consequences can be dealt with and are not a reason to pause the greyhound industry shut-down IMO. I would hope that genuine lure coursing without gambling, prize money or live game would continue - unless of course the Commissioner is concerned that lure coursing will simply evolve into a facsimile of the greyhound racing industry - ie that lure coursing will fill the industry gap and attract the bad element - and yes its probably a reasonable concern in a self-regulated sport like lure coursing. But haven't actually read that in the report - that's just late night surmising on my part.

For various reasons lure coursing is unlikely to be where greyhound people end up, assuming they end up anywhere and don't just give it away. For a start, lure coursing is unsuitable for many track greyhounds who have been trained on oval tracks. The attributes that make a dog a good racer don't necessarily make it a good courser, and vice versa. Those who have been participating in LC for the last 12 months know this from personal experience. Plus there is the whole business of there being no money in it.

[mita]

Interesting overview of greyhound racing in the US.... from ASPCA. Seems only 7 states now support it. The overall decline in the industry is described, citing increasing lack of community approval & support ... given what abuses tend to go with it & which can be a huge challenge to eradicate. Especially as the industry is a source of big earnings for individuals & for government coffers via taxes on gambling.

But the point that struck me, was how they say the final death knell came from economics. In order to counter the abuses, a large amount of regulation had to be put in place....& that, in itself, cost a lot to both individuals & government bodies. Eventually, it cost more overall to keep the industry going than it was bringing in.

http://www.aspca.org/animal-cruelty/other-animal-issues/greyhound-racing

So while its decline was stirred along by community distaste re what happens to the greys.... it finally died from money issues. Still surviving in only a handful of states.

I tried to find information on what has been the consequence for the greyhounds & especially what has happened if hobby greyhound sport has started up. Still looking.

ADDED: For balance with another view, here's the Greyhound Association of America's website. They say they want a 'clean' sport that takes in welfare concerns. They comment that you've heard the stories in the greyhound racing industry...& say, 'So have we' and invite help in making things right. Off to read it thoroughly.

http://www.gra-america.org

Edited July 15, 2016 by mita

[westiemum]

Apologies if this has been discussed before tonight - but I've only just caught up with it on the late night repeat.

The 7.30 Report tonight aired an interview with a clearly highly traumatised vet who worked for Greyhound Racing NSW over 2014 and 2015. He reported he and his family have been threatened by greyhound trainers because he is speaking out. He has spoken out about the evidence he documented of the horrific injuries and track euthanasias that never appeared in the Steward reports because they 'didn't want to set-off the Greenies'. He also stated that the attitude of the GRNSW hierarchy after the Four Corners Live Baiting revelations in February 2015 was 'it could have been worse' and they were relieved that all that was reported was the live baiting and that at that time the money laundering and other cruel practices were overlooked. So from their perspective it was weather the storm and then business as usual. The vet stated that the incident which pushed him out of the industry was a greyhound who sustained a tail injury in a race 19 months ago. He told the trainer from Rockhampton that the tail should be amputated. At the end of the meet the tail was found at the starting gate, rope attached where it had clearly been pulled off, probably using the start gate. The trainer denied any wrong doing and is still training in Rockhampton 19 months later. Despite the photographic evidence aired on the programme there has been no investigation by GNSW.

Dr Bryant says he wants the industry shut-down Australia-wide as its absolutely incapable of reform. Must say after yet more shocking images on the 7.30 report tonight I can't come to any other conclusion. An orderly shut-down is the only solution and it has to be Australia-wide,

The programme also raised another question in my mind - who cares for people like this vet and no doubt many others who are clearly severely traumatised by what they have witnessed in this industry? And what gives this industry the right to continue cruelty and corruption like this that traumatises employees? Surely these are serious OHS breaches as well. Fact: vets have the highest rate of suicide of any profession (I found this out while working at the University of Adelaide Vet School in 2012) - and this industry I suspect is part of the problem. Dr Bryant is clearly very very unwell.

Suggest people look at the programme on iView but beware the images are very graphic.

Suggest you edit the bolded part. Anyone can see this post. :)

Thanks sars - careless late night wording. Please could you edit your post too?

Edited July 15, 2016 by westiemum

[mita]

Straight talking letter to the public re greyhound racing in Qld from the newly appointed Integrity Commissioner, Ross Barnett. His former role was as a respected police officer... which may be useful background experience for hunting down any bad eggs as he promises.

Seems the Integrity Commission will operate separately from the commercial wing so it's answerable only to ethical standards. Also steps like higher fees for licences to be put in place. He also puts emphasis on the adoption of greyhounds, via their Greyhound Adoption Program which will be under his wing. Figures show a big increase in greyhound adoptions from the recent publicity.

Of course, the challenge will be putting the plans into action. I notice they urge anyone who has concern about a greyhound/s to contact them. Interesting to see what kind of process they have ready to handle such reporting.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/queensland-is-ahead-of-the-game-in-eliminating-livebaiting-and-animal-cruelty-from-racing/news-story/d55be2fb4c8337341d0a7494c88058fb

Edited July 17, 2016 by mita

[Sheridan]

Only available to subscribers, Mita.

[mita]

I looked up the background of Ross Barnett the new Integrity Commissioner for racing in Qld. Certainly made his mark in policing & its administration. Even the not-easy-to please advocate for child abuse matters, Hetty Johnson, describes him as 'one of the good guys'. She has high standards of practical accountability.

I wish him well in designing & policing greyhound racing processes for the best welfare of the dogs.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/31485517/from-hold-up-victim-to-one-of-queenslands-top-detectives/#page1

Another reference I found, was that he was involved in the calendar showing Qld Police Service dogs that was sold for charity at last year's 'Ekka.

Deputy Commissioner Ross Barnett said all money raised from calendar sales would go to the Animal Welfare League of Queensland, Police Legacy and the National Breast Cancer Foundation.

http://mypolice.qld.gov.au/dogsquad/2015/08/07/queensland-can-enjoy-paw-enforcement-pictures-all-year-long/

Edited July 17, 2016 by mita

[m-j]

The racing culture could be changed, not overnight though, by forcing them to be accountable for the dogs welfare before, during and after racing.

Sorry but this could not be more wrong. I have earned my living helping organisations shift and re-align their cultures, and the factors for successful culture change do not exist in this industry and probably never will. .

You're probably right but I feel optimistic as I am currently working in an industry that has been forced into being accountable and ethical and while it ducked and weaved in the past now it is being properly policed so people are towing the line as they are worried about the consequences. The industry I'm talking about is far bigger than the Greyhound racing industry.

[sas]

I am the President of the NSW Lure Coursing Association and wrote the post Lhok shared. "Unintended consequences" aren't very comfortable on the receiving end. We are in shock but gearing up to fight this if we have to.

May be a strange question...do you think that those highly competative in your sport could potentially be doing exactly the same as they do in Greyhound racing to improve performance?

[MonElite]

I am the President of the NSW Lure Coursing Association and wrote the post Lhok shared. "Unintended consequences" aren't very comfortable on the receiving end. We are in shock but gearing up to fight this if we have to.

May be a strange question...do you think that those highly competative in your sport could potentially be doing exactly the same as they do in Greyhound racing to improve performance?

Those is that sport that want to be be competitive might want to consider a dobermann to compete with :-)

Second place at the recent trial was Monelite Vivid ET WAC.

And I can guarantee that Monelite Dobermanns are happy to be chasing a plastic bags, or a ball, they don't need to be trained to do more than that. And still get ribbons and prizes.

She is also very happy to be sharing her bed with a fluffy cat.

Those that want to meet her come to the Dobe Club stand and the upcoming Dog Lovers Show this weekend.

[WreckitWhippet]

I am the President of the NSW Lure Coursing Association and wrote the post Lhok shared. "Unintended consequences" aren't very comfortable on the receiving end. We are in shock but gearing up to fight this if we have to.

May be a strange question...do you think that those highly competative in your sport could potentially be doing exactly the same as they do in Greyhound racing to improve performance?

Unlikely.

My bitch scored 2nd in the Sight Hounds last time she ran.

She stays fit, with road work, free runs, slip runs, on the flirt pole and behind our own machine.

For the record I have also raced Greyhounds and did not partake in live baiting and swabbed clean when tested.

[Sheridan]

I am the President of the NSW Lure Coursing Association and wrote the post Lhok shared. "Unintended consequences" aren't very comfortable on the receiving end. We are in shock but gearing up to fight this if we have to.

May be a strange question...do you think that those highly competative in your sport could potentially be doing exactly the same as they do in Greyhound racing to improve performance?

I don't think it's a strange question; I think it's a really rude question. Why would you even ask that? They chase plastic bags.

[Diva]

Yes I am sure that the competitive lure coursers do not live bait. They just have fit dogs that love to do it.

As for getting a Dobermann to course, as much as I like them I am pretty sure ALL lure coursing dogs will be caught by the proposed regulation, Dobes, Terriers, Goldies, cross breeds, EVERYONE.

Edited August 1, 2016 by Diva

[Salukifan]

I am the President of the NSW Lure Coursing Association and wrote the post Lhok shared. "Unintended consequences" aren't very comfortable on the receiving end. We are in shock but gearing up to fight this if we have to.

May be a strange question...do you think that those highly competative in your sport could potentially be doing exactly the same as they do in Greyhound racing to improve performance?

I'm glad people are asking this question. I get why people might think that. However, what you need to understand is that there's bugger all science to suggest that live baiting DOES improve performance anyway. It should have gone out with rubbing dogs noses in accidents.

My response? Come and see for yourself. PM me for details if you like. People do seem to struggle with the idea that a dog can be SO motivated to chase plastic. Why? Movement triggered prey drive.

They are looking at a plastic bag when they start. They grab the plastic bag at the finish. There is absolutely no doubt to the dog that what they will chase is plastic. Knowing that, some dogs look at you like you are an idiot. They KNOW what it is and what it is not.

However, you will see my dog go screaming berserk when he hears the gear start. He has never even seen a rabbit. He got the top sighthound score in the PM run last trial.

We showed a politician a 12 week old Border Terrier pup chasing bags when she visited. If the instinct is there and is strong enough, they will chase.

Lure coursing is a test of that instinct. It was developed for Sighthounds. specifically so that live animals would NOT be coursed. You don't need fur to motivate a dog with movement triggered prey drive. It won't fit under the tie downs we use and it would flip pulleys anyway.

The best way to improve performance in our sport is to improve fitness.

The dogs do it because they love it. If you'd seen Dodger dancing around with the plastic bag in his mouth after his last run, you'd get that they love the game.

Come and see. You'll meet ordinary every day pet owners getting a blast out of watching the dogs chase. Best spectator dog sport ever IMO.

Edited August 1, 2016 by Haredown Whippets

[Kavik]

I met said Border Terrier pup last Sunday - a real cutie :D

[Salukifan]

I met said Border Terrier pup last Sunday - a real cutie :D

Sure was!

[Dogsfevr]

One of the first "it " items our litter of puppies get is a plastic bag ,why because it crackles,its light;its fun .

We will fill a sock with plastic bags again because its fun ,plastic bags are used in the show ring because the sound is interesting for ear set in the ring .

But no live baiting here unless you call the shopping items in those bags live bait & yes they love there fish fingers that come out of those bags

[WoofnHoof]

My husky LOVES lure coursing, wish there was a club here.

[luvmybulldog]

My husky LOVES lure coursing, wish there was a club here.

Are you in Brisbane?