Nsw To Ban Greyhound Racing From July 2017

[m-j]

Well the government has signed sealed and delivered their decision, we really will never know if the industry is capable of reform or not as they aren't being given a chance to prove it.

I think they had a good go at it though. Imagine if pet owners reduced the number of dogs being bred by 46%, there would be very little need for pounds, rescue organisations etc.

Yes I have no doubt it will be passed when it goes through the lower house, yet another dodgy move by Baird but anyhoo. I also have no doubt that the industry WILL win in court but the problem there is how long will it take? Years I suspect and by that time the livelihoods of many will be long gone. Pet food distributors closed down and bankrupt, people with mortgages crushed and then there's the reality of suicides. I hope those that are feeling like they can't go on read Baird's link to Lifeline on the end of his facebook post, you know, so they know where to ring

From what I've been told it is even looking bad for the industry in court, don't know why but as you have said many people will have lost their livelihoods and the worst bit being the dogs will be gone. The owners who aren't involved in the industry in any other capacity, who consider their dog as an investment (most wouldn't know their dog if they fell over it) which has just suddenly turned into a liability won't be feeling very sympathetic toward their dog/s.

[asal]

The most important thing people outside the industry have to consider, if they can think for themselves and see for themselves instead of blindly following the words of their corrupt Govt:

1. Industry participants HAVE NEVER denied that the industry isn't perfect, that there are a number of bad trainers who treat greyhounds like commodities and have a turnstile through their kennels to keep the good dogs coming in and the slow dogs going out.

2. They've never denied either that there have been live baiting going on, in years past it used to happen a fair bit with a lot of trainers, however luckily it has been phrased out over recent years by people that were willing to move with the times and to respect the laws.

3. Reforms have already been happening in the last few years, with more regulations and more concern on welfare issues, all of which were being addressed.

4. Most important of all, greyhound racing participants are not allowed by law to take matters into their own hands, they joined the industry thinking that all they had to do was do the right thing themselves and it was the responsibility of their racing authority to keep an eye on things and to enforce the laws and do regular surprise inspections on every single property of licensed trainers.

5. Yes there are too many greyhounds being euthanized for being too slow or not up to scratch, this was being addressed by new welfare regulations in the last 2 years who are now getting on top of this huge issue.

6. The report has been found to be flawed by prominent lawyers as it did not provide appropriate evidence, most of the submissions did not have evidence and relied on anecdotes and guesstimate figures as well as using inappropriate witnesses who had an agenda in wishing the sport shut down.

7. The 3 vets who gave submissions in the report, were later found to not have the necessary qualifications and were found to have lied, so at the moment, they are currently being investigated by AVA.

8. I don't have time to go through every website and post links to all the appropriate evidences and news updates from lawyers who have taken apart the report, but if you google enough times you'll find out for yourself that it is absolutely fact that the report is full of holes.

Because the racing authority didn't do their job, now 90% of law abiding greyhound trainers and breeders are going to be punished for something the other 10% did? The public cannot say that trainers knew about bad stuff and did nothing, because the public wouldn't even know about the number of trainers that reported illegal activities to their racing authority yet the officials either did nothing to investigate the reports or only gave the bad trainers a slap on the wrist with a small fine and short suspension.

People shouldn't judge each individual based on what others are doing. For eg, I'm a pretty much a homebody spending all my time with my dogs, so I don't know what my next door neighbour is doing. Then one day, the police comes to my door to arrest me and take my dogs away from me, apparently because my neighbour has been live baiting and cruelly abusing his dogs, so I must have known about it or either be doing the same thing.

The world has gone mad when a corrupt Govt can punish a whole society just because a bunch of vegan Greens and Animals Australia says the industry is 100% full of cruel live baiting trainers.

Sad times indeed that we live in...:-(

Exactly! and when is this same government intending doing anything as the churches both catholic and anglican reek of the appalling pedophilia coverups? will Baird be shutting down the churches and acquiring the real estate into consolidated revenue too ?

friend involved in getting justice said there are some 500,000 survivors still alive of all ages australia wide. bit bigger scene so a bit of action might be about time, gives "suffer the little children" a whole new slant I doubt Jesus ever had in mind.

Or are we to seriously believe dogs and their treatment ranks above the past and I don't doubt ongoing ruination of the lives of tens of thousands of children annually? or is it less distasteful because I am told approximately 70% euthanise themselves.

at least domestic violence only euthanises about some 500 or 600 annually, figures aren't high enough to warrant action against holding the entire population responsible yet

Edited August 14, 2016 by asal

[mystify]

A lovely public letter this morning from my FB friend who is mature aged. This letter explains the injustice of the racing ban so honestly;

My second letter to Scott Morrison MP.

Dear Mr Morrison,

Again I write, My name is Noelene Holloway, a 58 y.o. a committed Christian and Greyhound Breeder, Owner and Trainer from N.S.W. My main occupation being, after asking God about a job many years ago and turning to His Word “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent.” John 6:29

I present my second case of evidence to prove The Premier has had plotted to 'Ban' (and hence exterminate) our Majestic Greyhounds in N.S.W. for over 15 months with my firm belief that the N.S.W. Greyhound Industry is the cleanest, most organized and successful of any code of racing in the world.

This smear/propaganda Campaign to poison the public's mind against us, The Breeders Owners and Trainers of Greyhounds in N.S.W. followed the live baiting video shown by the A.B.C.'s programme "4 Corners".

Trespasses went onto private properties, and set up cameras for up to 5 months. A well-known Lawyer, Vince Murphy (brother of Chris), said all the video evidence did was to prove that Live Baiting was not widespread.

Whilst other states rightly dealt with those caught breaking the law, as did N.S.W., the Premier's plan for our demise here in N.S.W. was birthed and given life.

1. Since the Greyhound Racing Industry was established in N.S.W. 90 years ago by our ancestors, only 2 people have ever been charged with live baiting in N.S.W.

2. Since the introduction of Mr Paul Newson into the position of C.E.O. of Greyhound Racing N.S.W. by the Government, breeding has dropped by up to half, being a very acceptable and workable level.

3. Mr Newson brought in the rule that euthanasia of a healthy Greyhound is prohibited without G.R.N.S.W.'s permission, with the purchased of a million dollar adoption/re-homing centre at Wyee on the Central Coast, plus many other outlets paid for from our Welfare Fund, to rehome Greyhounds. No other code of racing have this Welfare Programme in existence (until the past month, if at all.)

4. Q.C. McHugh in his report, said he could not establish how many Greyhounds had been euthanized in N.S.W. over the past 12 years as data was never required, nor documented by our Government Regulated Body.

Firstly the Report presented that 12 years was the expected life of a Greyhound, hence the use of sensationalized numbers of 'somewhere between 48,891 and 68,448.' over 12 years were presented. Greyhounds Australasia where reported to have given the original number last year of 13,000 to 17,000 in Australia per year, (which would be approx. 3,000 per state). They testified to me personally that this number was 'Pulled out of the air." My question is "Who uses 'odd numbers", when using 'somewhere between'?"

Catastrophic injuries are a rarity on our superb and very well-maintained Racing Tracks in N.S.W. The Premier cited 'fractured skulls and broken backs' as one of his four reasons for Banning our Greyhounds. I speak for the majority of Trainers when saying "I have never heard of, nor witnessed these 2 specific injuries." They would be a rarity, as are catastrophic injuries. The Commission said "180" Greyhounds per year suffer catastrophic injuries. The Premier, in his propaganda campaign says now "136". Greyhound Racing N.S.W. Have evidence that between 1/1/16 and 21/3/16, two Greyhounds suffered a catastrophic injury. If that was the usual, this would amount to approx. 10 to 12 a year.

In the Commission, 3 vets presented themselves falsely as "experts", when giving false evidence. It has been ascertained that an 'expert' must have the name "Fellow" next to their credentials, of which none of the three vets of the Commission had.

7. The Premier says falsely that Greyhound Racing is only Legal in 8 Countries in the world. The truth is that Greyhound Racing is Legal Worldwide, with 'Google' saying 29 Countries race Greyhounds. Only two States in America have banned Greyhound Racing i.e. Idaho and Arizona.

8. The Premier keeps presenting the word "Slaughter". Both dictionary definitions would refute the usage of this word by the Premier. The only definition given (if you put 'slaughter definition" into google) is "Kill animals for food." Looking further, we find another definition "killing of great numbers of human beings (as in battle or a massacre). Never has it been found that great numbers of Greyhound were ever killed at once. The very large majority of Greyhounds 'euthanized' over the past 12 years were euthanized at a veterinary clinic.

The Premier is strongly portraying that 'Greyhounds" are the only animals getting unnecessarily euthanized ("Slaughtered"). According to The Sydney Morning Herald report of 6th June, 2010 (www.smh.com.au › News › Environment › Animals):-

. 250,000 cats and dogs are killed by the pound each year in Australia.

According to the report of September 12, 2015

"http://www.news.com.au/…/shelt…/story-fncynjr2-1226480386569"

. "Of the 67,573 dogs that ended up at the RSPCA in 2010-11, 19,583 (about one in three) were put down. Most cats that end up at the RSPCA are killed – 37,177 out of 64,617. Many of these animals are healthy and the figures do not include euthanasia at vets or other shelters. The RSPCA says it is a “highly complex” problem, with responsible ownership an important part of the solution."

The Premier puts 'Animal Welfare' at the helm of his attack on us, whilst ironically, the rally before us in Sydney this month was against the Premier's 'slaughter' of the Brumbies. It is said that it would be rare that, from a helicopter, a Brumby would be shot in the head for an instant death, but more likely, shot in the back, falling to break its legs, with a slow and painful death. There is also outrage that a very horrible procedure is being used with Dingoes in that they are collared with a device that will explode after the 2 year period they are being used for, the purpose of them killing wild goats. "http://www.thepetitionsite.com/…/hinchinbrook-shire-counc…/…"

I could go on about the horrible myxomatosis virus that slowly blinds and kills off rabbits, or the poisonous baits councils put around to kill Dingoes that carry young, killing other animals along with it, all being slow and painful.

Yet, Registered Greyhound Tracks have been banned from using purchased dead, gutted and defrosted rabbits from a reputable industry (that the RSPCA had no problem with)...us not even allowed to use a purchased rabbit pelt, or any animal other skin to train our Greyhound. It has to be 'synthetic." At one time we were forbidden to give our Greyhounds "Soft Toys" in the resemblance of an animal", but thankfully they overturned this very extreme measure.

It is constantly reiterated by The Premier that we have lost our Social License i.e. Our Public Acceptance. That is a 'surmise' by our Premier. Contrary, I believe a large majority in N.S.W. know, or are associated with someone who has an involvement with a Greyhound. People of N.S.W. (in my informed opinion and experience), are very favorable towards Greyhound Racing. A young girl who interviewed me from N.B.N. Television, deeply and sincerely apologized to me for what is happening to us by our so-called Premier (A servant of the people.) Another woman said this also of the journalists who went to their establishment to interview them.

Greyhound Racing Participants come from all walks of life. My whole family is involved, including my 93 and 89 year old parents having brought my 4 sisters and I up with the Greyhounds, our 14 offspring being 5 School Teachers, Electrician, Civil Engineer, Inspector for Welding, Cricketer hoping to play for Australia, Bank worker, Real Estate Agent, University student. My knowledge of Greyhound Owners and Trainers is that they are hardworking, honest, industrious and level headed individuals, who make a great contribution to the N.S.W. Community.

As is true, the work Greyhound Breeders, Owners and Trainers do each and every day in N.S.W. is a HUGE ASSET to N.S.W.

"http://www.businessinsider.com.au/these-are-the-economic-be…" says:-

"The industry is worth $335.7 million annually to the NSW economy in direct and flow-on benefits, according to estimates for the 2013-14 year.

During that racing season, 1,296 greyhound race meetings attracted more than 282,000 people, says a study commissioned by the Office of Liquor, Gaming and Racing on the size and scope of the racing industry in NSW.

Racegoers generated expenditure of more than $11.2 million, both on-course and in the community.

Use of the greyhound club facilities for non-race day purposes generated another $3.3 million of spending."

In this world we live in today, with the threat of "Terrorism" (TERRORISM = "The use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes.") we Greyhound Breeders, Owners and Trainers in N.S.W. feel we we are being 'Terrorized" by our own Government who were elected to do the right thing by us. Never before have I, nor anyone else I speak to, seen anything so atrociously committed by a Government of our so-called Democratic Australia. Our Democratic rights have been severely violated.

It is said "Make the lie BIG, make it SIMPLE and KEEP SAYING IT." This is what we believe has been done to us by our Premier.

At this moment, my beautiful Greyhound "Queen Esther" is sleeping. Her offspring are also sleeping. They do not know their purpose for living is being decided in our N.S.W. Government Lower House within 2 weeks. I recall from The Bible that 2,500 years ago The Jews were under the threat of extermination by an evil ruler. God raised up "Queen Esther" to save them. I believe God will bring vindication, justice and life back for us that will allow our Greyhounds in N.S.W. to continue racing, under a very professional, wise, compassionate and loving Body of Leaders.

Yours sincerely,

Noelene Holloway.

[Steve]

Ill give you that it demonstrates the injustice but why Scott Morrison? This is a state thing not federal and too bad it was a bit nutty sort of took away the good bits about what she had to say.

[mystify]

If by nutty you mean her religion views.....she's a Christian, nothing wrong with it.

Scott Morrison because he's her local MP, and GBOTA has been emailing every trainer in NSW (with a computer) advising trainers and breeders to send letters to their local MP as the MPs (particularly the lovely Sonia Hornery who supports us) will be going to debate on the petition in lower house in 2 weeks. Hopefully the more info we send to MPs who support the ban, the more we may make them think the ban is unfair and this will get more of them to go against the ban decision. At the moment it's 17 against 12 (I think roughly) so we need to sway more MPs

Edited August 14, 2016 by mystify

[corvus]

As an onlooker I read a newspaper article - one guy says "there's no money in Greyhounds" the next guy says "what am I going to do with this million dollar purpose built property?" another guy says "they're our pets, they live better than us" and the next guy says "the government has blood on their hands when the dogs get sent overseas or are all killed."

I guess wherever there appears to be inconsistency there are two main possibilities. 1) Some things are not true; 2) Most things are true. It seems counter-intuitive, but sometimes apparent inconsistencies are attempts to describe a complex and varied situation. Sometimes one thing is the case and sometimes almost the opposite, but both occur. In the case of greyhounds, people are very emotional and upset. I feel they are saying things without a lot of thought sometimes. Whether those things are correct in some circumstances or not is difficult to figure out. Sometimes there is a story in the grey areas between inconsistencies. There are a lot of things I have been unable to get a straight answer on in the greyhound racing industry. It became apparent after a while that this is because there really isn't one. Lots of variation in how things are done and how people are participating in the industry means there is no single answer that encompasses a majority.

[Steve]

If by nutty you mean her religion views.....she's a Christian, nothing wrong with it.

Scott Morrison because he's her local MP, and GBOTA has been emailing every trainer in NSW (with a computer) advising trainers and breeders to send letters to their local MP as the MPs (particularly the lovely Sonia Hornery who supports us) will be going to debate on the petition in lower house in 2 weeks. Hopefully the more info we send to MPs who support the ban, the more we may make them think the ban is unfair and this will get more of them to go against the ban decision. At the moment it's 17 against 12 (I think roughly) so we need to sway more MPs

Fair enough and I agree nothing wrong with being a christian - just thought it took it all a bit far that's all

[Steve]

As an onlooker I read a newspaper article - one guy says "there's no money in Greyhounds" the next guy says "what am I going to do with this million dollar purpose built property?" another guy says "they're our pets, they live better than us" and the next guy says "the government has blood on their hands when the dogs get sent overseas or are all killed."

I guess wherever there appears to be inconsistency there are two main possibilities. 1) Some things are not true; 2) Most things are true. It seems counter-intuitive, but sometimes apparent inconsistencies are attempts to describe a complex and varied situation. Sometimes one thing is the case and sometimes almost the opposite, but both occur. In the case of greyhounds, people are very emotional and upset. I feel they are saying things without a lot of thought sometimes. Whether those things are correct in some circumstances or not is difficult to figure out. Sometimes there is a story in the grey areas between inconsistencies. There are a lot of things I have been unable to get a straight answer on in the greyhound racing industry. It became apparent after a while that this is because there really isn't one. Lots of variation in how things are done and how people are participating in the industry means there is no single answer that encompasses a majority.

agreed and both are true for many.You dont make money out of breeding dogs because all you make goes back into the dogs including infastructure and facilities whch could be sold after you retire but if there is no one any longer needing the kennels etc they drop rapidly in value.

[The Spotted Devil]

As an onlooker I read a newspaper article - one guy says "there's no money in Greyhounds" the next guy says "what am I going to do with this million dollar purpose built property?" another guy says "they're our pets, they live better than us" and the next guy says "the government has blood on their hands when the dogs get sent overseas or are all killed."

I guess wherever there appears to be inconsistency there are two main possibilities. 1) Some things are not true; 2) Most things are true. It seems counter-intuitive, but sometimes apparent inconsistencies are attempts to describe a complex and varied situation. Sometimes one thing is the case and sometimes almost the opposite, but both occur. In the case of greyhounds, people are very emotional and upset. I feel they are saying things without a lot of thought sometimes. Whether those things are correct in some circumstances or not is difficult to figure out. Sometimes there is a story in the grey areas between inconsistencies. There are a lot of things I have been unable to get a straight answer on in the greyhound racing industry. It became apparent after a while that this is because there really isn't one. Lots of variation in how things are done and how people are participating in the industry means there is no single answer that encompasses a majority.

I actually do get that. But all I'm saying is that if feeds into the public perception of industry lies, cover up and BS. People don't know who to believe.

[Steve]

As an onlooker I read a newspaper article - one guy says "there's no money in Greyhounds" the next guy says "what am I going to do with this million dollar purpose built property?" another guy says "they're our pets, they live better than us" and the next guy says "the government has blood on their hands when the dogs get sent overseas or are all killed."

I guess wherever there appears to be inconsistency there are two main possibilities. 1) Some things are not true; 2) Most things are true. It seems counter-intuitive, but sometimes apparent inconsistencies are attempts to describe a complex and varied situation. Sometimes one thing is the case and sometimes almost the opposite, but both occur. In the case of greyhounds, people are very emotional and upset. I feel they are saying things without a lot of thought sometimes. Whether those things are correct in some circumstances or not is difficult to figure out. Sometimes there is a story in the grey areas between inconsistencies. There are a lot of things I have been unable to get a straight answer on in the greyhound racing industry. It became apparent after a while that this is because there really isn't one. Lots of variation in how things are done and how people are participating in the industry means there is no single answer that encompasses a majority.

I actually do get that. But all I'm saying is that if feeds into the public perception of industry lies, cover up and BS. People don't know who to believe.

Yes I agree but I would suggest that about now most have already made up their mind which side they are on and those for the ban will see it as inconsistent and those who are against will see it differently. Its hardly possible to control what ever anyone who may be interviewed or quoted has to say.

[The Spotted Devil]

People can say what they like to the media. Helps if there is a clearer industry voice counteracting that and not bagging out welfare groups for killing animals with made up or purposely misleading stats, the government for being corrupt and the general public for dumping their pets at pounds. That was the context of what I originally said. But yeah people can say what they like.

[Steve]

People can say what they like to the media. Helps if there is a clearer industry voice counteracting that and not bagging out welfare groups for killing animals with made up or purposely misleading stats, the government for being corrupt and the general public for dumping their pets at pounds. That was the context of what I originally said. But yeah people can say what they like.

Agreed and if nothing more comes out of all of this lets hope that lessons are learned and there is actually someone who can speak for the rest and keep the other crap down a bit - doubtful though.

[Pjrt]

For better or for worse and for whatever reasons, the tide of public opposition to Greyhound Racing has turned into a tsunami. The ONLY hope Greyhound Racing has of turning back the tide of public opinion is to act as one with absolute facts and cohesion. And even then I doubt anyone can face down a tsunami.

The earthquake happened a long time ago and little after shocks have been rippling through. The Greyhound racing industry has had plenty of warning and chose to either ignore it or fragment to their own corners of the ring or tell fluffy stories of their own special dogs etc, instead of uniting and acting as one.

Public opinion is everything here. As an industry it's great that Greyhound racing knows what it knows. That message has not gotten through clearly and decisively to the general public.

[corvus]

I actually do get that. But all I'm saying is that if feeds into the public perception of industry lies, cover up and BS. People don't know who to believe.

Well... I would say they believe those who say things that confirm their already held beliefs. ;) Inconsistencies don't seem to bother the majority of people IME. I don't think they even notice seeing as they are quite focused on confirmation. Those that are very opposed use them to their advantage, but often make the same kind of mistakes anyway. I doubt there were many on the fence after the live baiting scandal. Those that were never involved much suddenly had a good reason to care. It is difficult not to be moved by that footage. I still cringe and look away. Personally, I tend to dismiss sources of information of questionable accuracy. It doesn't make me think better or worse of either side of an argument. I just need better information. But, you know, that's what I've been trained to do. :)

I agree that a single, reasoned voice for the industry would help, and these are times when strong leadership is critical, but it's not going to happen. People still need to express themselves. We have had these discussions in the training world, and I have argued time and time again that emotive arguments and selective reporting loses the very people that are most persuadable. No one ever listens to me, though. They are very frightened that any shift from the party line might mean they are condoning things they vehemently oppose. I've had people come to me for information precisely because they have seen me present both sides of an argument without much emotion. So, I still believe it wins people over. But, people hate to be told to be quiet when they have a lot to say. They of course believe they are helping by saying it. Suggesting maybe they are not tends to result in a great deal of hostility!

[The Spotted Devil]

See my reply to Steve corvus. I get that confirmation bias is a thing. My comments were part of a broader discussion on the innacuracies being peddled by people who clearly haven't read the report properly.

[asal]

I actually do get that. But all I'm saying is that if feeds into the public perception of industry lies, cover up and BS. People don't know who to believe.

Well... I would say they believe those who say things that confirm their already held beliefs. ;) Inconsistencies don't seem to bother the majority of people IME. I don't think they even notice seeing as they are quite focused on confirmation. Those that are very opposed use them to their advantage, but often make the same kind of mistakes anyway. I doubt there were many on the fence after the live baiting scandal. Those that were never involved much suddenly had a good reason to care. It is difficult not to be moved by that footage. I still cringe and look away. Personally, I tend to dismiss sources of information of questionable accuracy. It doesn't make me think better or worse of either side of an argument. I just need better information. But, you know, that's what I've been trained to do. :)

I agree that a single, reasoned voice for the industry would help, and these are times when strong leadership is critical, but it's not going to happen. People still need to express themselves. We have had these discussions in the training world, and I have argued time and time again that emotive arguments and selective reporting loses the very people that are most persuadable. No one ever listens to me, though. They are very frightened that any shift from the party line might mean they are condoning things they vehemently oppose. I've had people come to me for information precisely because they have seen me present both sides of an argument without much emotion. So, I still believe it wins people over. But, people hate to be told to be quiet when they have a lot to say. They of course believe they are helping by saying it. Suggesting maybe they are not tends to result in a great deal of hostility!

so few realise how well organised AR is.

either get a equal campaign up and running or it is going to succeed across the board. wrote this as a reply to a vegan who believes horses too are now fur children like our dogs. (bit like a animal farm possible scenario perhaps, will it happen or not is the question)

I believe in freedom of choice and democracy. people donate their organs, their bodies for research. yet horses of no longer use whose owners do not have the facilities to keep, and no where to bury it, it are not to be allowed to send it to slaughter? that is a huge amount of meat going to waste and believe it or not dogs and cats cannot go vegan without health problems they are carnivores not omnivorous if u want omnivorous get a bear

if the greyhound industry is to be shut down because 20% are offenders, then why is the churches not being closed down to protect our children as pell and that anglican bishop have proved, the church isn't going to protect them, close em down. Baird can then cash that too along with all the utilities he is selling to the highest bidder.

as for the unfettered crap, the only thing fettered is the idiots who are registered breeders, they are the only ones being legislated into circles. it was said there are some 18 million dogs kept as pets, 90% of them couldn't possibly have come from registered breeders but the 90% who no one knows about are free to do as they please. the rspca figures was something like 176,000 Australia wide strays. the ankc only registers on average and its falling 60,000 in any given year registered where do u think the other 116,000 morphed from?

cloning?

cattle , sheep, goats and pigs are just as sentient as any horse, pigs for example are far smarter than dogs. I do think the day is comming when all abbatoirs will be closed down and everyone become vegan or chemically made 'meat' is the only choice. I expect it will not be too long before these will be extinct apart from a few kept so people can see what they looked like. but then this planet is being overrun by the human lemmings and once its stripped and uninhabitable the cycle will begin same as it did for the dinosours

the vegan answer for people might seem a good one, although thanks to the csg spread even if they can be grown cleanly in greenhouses as is being done in spain, the air polution coming from the csg fields is going to add up same as it did until hydrocarbons were banned, they aren't going to ban csg production, too many mega bucks involved. although this country isnt going to benefit, local manufacturers are already complaining prices are going so high they will have to relocate overseas where the SAME gas is being exported and sold at half what the aussie companies are being slugged for gas sourced in their own country. its a weird world now

you cant upgrade the horse to the status of fur child as has been done with dogs and deny cattle, sheep, goats, pigs and all other domestic animals the same rights and villify those who callously breed them for that worst of all vices, profit. almost forgot the chooks ducks and turkeys .

at least our govenment is being even handed, every other business has been or in the process of closure and manufactured overseas.

AH! HOW DID I MISS IT?

those who still long for a fur child will probably be able to import one along with their, shirt, shoes, dress, fridge, laptop, smartphone and everything else

on a more happy note, (Imp) after any animals name makes it more special anyway.

(ps, havent researched the exact figures, trying to remember what I read so any corrections would be appreciated)

Edited August 15, 2016 by asal

[Maddy]

As an onlooker I read a newspaper article - one guy says "there's no money in Greyhounds" the next guy says "what am I going to do with this million dollar purpose built property?" another guy says "they're our pets, they live better than us" and the next guy says "the government has blood on their hands when the dogs get sent overseas or are all killed."

I guess wherever there appears to be inconsistency there are two main possibilities. 1) Some things are not true; 2) Most things are true. It seems counter-intuitive, but sometimes apparent inconsistencies are attempts to describe a complex and varied situation. Sometimes one thing is the case and sometimes almost the opposite, but both occur. In the case of greyhounds, people are very emotional and upset. I feel they are saying things without a lot of thought sometimes. Whether those things are correct in some circumstances or not is difficult to figure out. Sometimes there is a story in the grey areas between inconsistencies. There are a lot of things I have been unable to get a straight answer on in the greyhound racing industry. It became apparent after a while that this is because there really isn't one. Lots of variation in how things are done and how people are participating in the industry means there is no single answer that encompasses a majority.

agreed and both are true for many.You dont make money out of breeding dogs because all you make goes back into the dogs including infastructure and facilities whch could be sold after you retire but if there is no one any longer needing the kennels etc they drop rapidly in value.

This might be true for companion dogs but it's not necessarily true for greyhounds. When you sell a litter of eight greyhound pups for $3,000* each, there is a hell of a lot of money in it. And while some might put profits back into better facilities, many don't. I'm sure there are a few who treat breeding greyhounds as a profession and try to do it to very high standards but the majority would be hobby or casual breeders- a couple of litters a year and to them, not really worth expensive upgrades to facilities or purpose-building things. Most breeders I've seen down here use little tin sheds in dirt yards- hardly the birthing suites at the Cedars-Sinai.

*This number is not pulled from the air, by the way. Took a random page of classifieds from GD, worked out the mean price of pups on that page. Mean was $3,125 a pup, median was $3000.

[asal]

has this been posted before?

http://www.racenet.com.au/mobile/article.asp?id=125683

neddies next

[trifecta]

has this been posted before?

http://www.racenet.com.au/mobile/article.asp?id=125683

neddies next

Standardbreds maybe, but gallopers never! If a Sheik can stop a mining company, and let's face it, they run the government, then Baird will be squashed in an instance. Let alone the fact the Thoroughbred racing industry is the second largest employer in the country and racing brings millions into the State economy.

[asal]

has this been posted before?

http://www.racenet.com.au/mobile/article.asp?id=125683

neddies next

Standardbreds maybe, but gallopers never! If a Sheik can stop a mining company, and let's face it, they run the government, then Baird will be squashed in an instance. Let alone the fact the Thoroughbred racing industry is the second largest employer in the country and racing brings millions into the State economy.

close, but so do greyhounds, the difference is that extra comma, Billions from tb racing