Elderly Dogs

[Bubitty]

Hi Folks

Just been discussing with MrB how to handle Bubby in his old age. The old man is a golden and is 11. Bubby is still rather fun loving, loves walks and food and seems fairly robust despite his age. He's been trim his whole life so always been able to eat a fair bit.

I'm just wondering at this age would you do your best to preserve their health or go all out and give them whatever they want (within reason).

Bubby has always had an iron tummy and can eat anything. MrB thinks we should just spoil him (which means take away yum cha and sushi and lots of human food, Bubby ADORES yum cha).

I want him to have the best retirement years but I'm thinking maybe he could go to 15. MrB is pessimistic and keeps worrying Bubby won't wake up one day so he likes to treat him. Just wondering what you guys would do?

[Bubitty]

Thanks Snook! That's a great post! Gives me a lot to think about!

We go for a few walks a day (the excitement of starting a walk is a BIG DEAL for Bubby).

With arthritis is there anything to look out for? We only go to the vet once a year and nothing about this has ever been brought up. He doesn't seem sore but does walk home slower than he starts out.

[Tassie]

Others might not agree, but my strategy is to treat older dogs as though they are still youngsters, unless and until they need to be treated differently. From Goldens I've known, your Bubby should still be good and active through to about 14.

Maintaining good joint health and function, and good muscle mass, as well as a healthy lean weight, are really important. If Bubby is not on any joint supplements, you might want to investigate those. And activity, mental and physical, is super important. It's never too late to teach older dogs new tricks. :D

If you have access to a really good canine conditioning and rehab person .. maybe holistic vet, canine physio, good canine chiro .. IMHO it's a good idea to schedule regular maintenance check ups, so that if any niggles develop (as they tend to do in older age ), you can address them early on, and limit the impact.

I was so pleased yesterday when I took my BCs for a mechanical inspection and tune up, that my holistic vet was very happy with their condition. The 14.25 year old got a big tick .. although she has lost some muscle mass in the hind end. She still really loves to join in agility and rally training with the 7 year old, and although I limit the number of reps she does, and the heights she jumps, the sparkle and joy in her eyes is well worth it. Mine also have a range of conditioning exercises advised by a canine conditioning specialist.

So the short version .. listen to your own instincts, and keep your Bubby as active and lean as you can .. with luck, he should have several good years left.

[Willem]

@OP: if you and your partner love your dog, always remember: food - especially non dog food - is not love!...a lean, well nourished older dog will have much less issues with joints, digestions etc. etc....conversely every 'kg' more weight than the dog should have will increase pain in case of arthritis or other joint / spine issues. With more pain he will be less motivated to walk and to run, which will further lead to a deteriorating health....if you want the best retirement years for him: treat him and feed him like a dog :) .

[Bubitty]

I haven't committed to supplements either!

We have him sleep in the study with ducted aircon so no worries about the chills!

I actually think its probably a good sign since he likes to do really festy things like go lie in the rain, dig a mud puddle and sit in it in the rain. He doesn't seem "frail" if you know what I mean. Most of the time I see MrB making him go inside, keep warm etc

[JulesP]

I just can't believe he is 11yo

Edited June 4, 2016 by JulesP

[Rebanne]

I can't believe Bubby is 11! I think Mr B needs a little talking to. Even my Fern, who is frail and not yet 10 likes to still do her doggy stuff.

[Tassie]

Just a note ... my experience, and my holistic vet's advice is that appropriate supplements can be very beneficial given prophylactically .. that is, before a dog is symptomatic of arthritis or joint issues. Obviously in conjunction with other measures like lean body condition, regular varied physical and mental activity.

Your Mr B sounds as though he's a bit of a softy .. that's lovely :) - but I think you have the right attitude.

[Kirislin]

Feather is 14 and I do pander to her now, but I dont think of it as spoiling her, and if it is, then so what. She's never been a enthusiastic eater and often now I'll put her food down and she looks at it as if she just cant face it at that time. I take it away, but if she seems to want it later I will give it to her, I do hand feed her sometimes too. I wouldn't do it with a young healthy dog though. I have a friend who says he wouldn't do what I do for her, but I just think she's not being deliberately difficult, she's old, and sometimes confused, and no doubt sometimes in pain, so I will be as patient as I can with her. I also dont feed commercial dog food to my pack but I sometimes buy her "chunkers" which she seems to enjoy. I've managed to keep her in fairly good condition, I just do what it takes.

The others only get fed once a day, but I feed her if she looks like she wants to eat, no matter what time of day.

[huga]

I've always had the mindset to keep them healthy as possible and nutrition is a big part of that. They've always had good quality food and fish oil. They are very rarely treated with food. The last time Lola went to the vet (just before Christmas), it was the beginning of her down hill slide. She had a thorough going over, x rays, bloods and was prescribed pain relief. I asked the vet if she needed to lose weight and he said her weight was decent, especially for an elderly pug - but I could probably get a few hundred grams off her in an attempt to make it easier for her. So over the period of a few months, I did.

That said, you can bet I am taking her out for ice cream in the next couple of days.

Edited June 4, 2016 by huga

[Little Gifts]

Thanks Snook! That's a great post! Gives me a lot to think about!

We go for a few walks a day (the excitement of starting a walk is a BIG DEAL for Bubby).

With arthritis is there anything to look out for? We only go to the vet once a year and nothing about this has ever been brought up. He doesn't seem sore but does walk home slower than he starts out.

We have been lucky with all our dogs living good ages. Keeping their weight under control is important. I am not a big fan of giving dogs people food as we have so many additives in our foods and there can be hidden sugars, fats and salts. Our oldest was getting massage/reiki treatment for arthritis and was on Sasha's Blend. Our massage therapist recommended we start the same for our 9 year old girl even though she doesn't have identified arthritis or joint issues. It has made a huge difference to her activity, flexibility and general health. So maybe think about trying something like SB to see if there is a difference.

Our oldest lived to almost 17 and never spent a day just sleeping. She was in the thick of it with the other dogs all day every day - she was just a little slower and did a lot of it sitting on her butt rather than standing up! She even refused to stay behind on walks so we had to buy a pram so she could go in that when she got tired. Let Bubby do whatever Bubby shows interest in doing and just adjust it according to his age limitations as needed.

[Scottsmum]

Re: Diet - We spoiled our last dog and it wasn't the best of moves. I could never stop Scottsdad form sneaking her really naughty food (like take away chinese and pizza) and when she got really sick and ended up living out her days on ID - it was really unpleasant as she hated it. Luckily we could still "spoil" her on occasion with BBQ chook (no skin) so all was not lost - and she had that every night for her last week :)

But I do wish we'd been a lot stricter in her senior years ...

[Papillon Kisses]

@OP: if you and your partner love your dog, always remember: food - especially non dog food - is not love!...a lean, well nourished older dog will have much less issues with joints, digestions etc. etc....conversely every 'kg' more weight than the dog should have will increase pain in case of arthritis or other joint / spine issues. With more pain he will be less motivated to walk and to run, which will further lead to a deteriorating health....if you want the best retirement years for him: treat him and feed him like a dog :) .

Agreed! There are so many ways to show love for your dog without giving him unhealthy food. You can shower him with praise and affection, take him for walks and swims, play with him, cuddle him, let him join you on the lounge, teach him fun new tricks, buy him new toys, buy or make food puzzle toys, learn TTouch or take him to a practitioner, take him to Nose Work classes (suitable for all ages). Simply be present with him.

Save the unhealthy treats for when he's gone off his food or is truly IN his last days. Which your boy isn't from your description.

And you can get healthy dog treats and feed them in appropriate amounts. Rotate them so they stay interesting. Malcolm's favourite thing at the moment is snapped off pieces of a whole dried salmon head. It's the most disgusting thing ever to handle and smell, which is probably part of the appeal :laugh: but also high in those omega 3s.

[westiemum]

My Sarah (westie) will be 15 early in July. She's doing remarkably well. She has some arthritis for which she has good pain control and she's occasionally a bit incontinent. But all very manageable.

She's on a raw diet and has fresh or frozen veg with her Adelaide Dog mix each evening. In the mornings she has either chicken wing or neck, turkey neck, half a chicken frame or a bone. I keep cans of homebrand mackeral (in oil) and sardines as a back up The only treats she gets are the occasional warm take-away chook meat (no cooked bones) which she adores or the occasional Adelaide Dog treat (no preservatives, artificial flavours or colours). Mine protest commercial dry dog food and really put on the grumps on the rare occasion that it comes out.

I think the thing that makes a huge difference to my dogs is that they are really well hydrated. Sarah 'pees pale' - ie her wee is a very light yellow colour with barely any smell. She has a moist breakfast, plenty of clean water on tap inside and outside and her dinner bowl is topped up with water at night where she 'drinks' the lot along with her raw meal. I know Yonjuro does the same thing. So I know she is well hydrated.

So apart from her arthritis and minor occasional incontinence she's doing very well, is a happy waggy tail girl who dances for her dinner. So no real difference here on meals and treats than when she was a younger dog.

ETA: She's next to me on the lounge at the moment with her bottom on a warm hot water bottle! Happy Days!

Edited June 4, 2016 by westiemum

[Rozzie]

Our Golden was 16 when he died. He was fit and active, and treated like a dog not a person.

[SarasMum]

My shepherd was 10 and my staffy x is now 11.5. We started supplements a few months back, not because they needed it, but because they were getting older. We lost the shepherd a month ago from hemangiosarcoma and the same day the staffy x did her cruciate. The vet has said that management is her best option and that we were and are doing all the right things re food and supplements. She has pain killers daily. She has joint guard daily along with Omega 3.6.9 oil and either sardines, mackeral or yoghurt to mix the joint guard into. She only eats Royal Canin over 10 which has added joint stuff.

She can now only go on a very short walk to keep her from withering away in front of the fire, she misses Maddison terribly and will stay inside all day and only toilet after meals, so once in the morning and once at night after dinner.

I didn't give Maddison any naughty foods until the day she came home from the vet with us knowing it was just a matter of probably days. We had party pies, boston buns and a very small amount of chocolate. Even though she wasn't going to make it I didn't want her feeling any more sicker than she already was.

[JRG]

I have had a number of dogs well into old age - my current one is 16yrs 4 months and bounces about like a two year old. The only concession I make to her age (apart from a coat at night and some 4cyte) is she takes her exercise with the older pups rather than with the mature bitches - she can indulge them and they do not push the boundaries in fact as my godson put it, it is lovely to watch them "paying their dues to the older statesman" (ie waiting for her to finish her apple, following her round, licking her lips and lying with her)

[westiemum]

JRG my SArah has just started on the 4cyte too. How are you finding it?

[rubiton]

At 11 with no obvious issues I wouldnt do anything as yet re joint/arthritis supplements etc. Then you have somewhere to go when he starts to show up issues. AS an older dog the vets usually suggest an annual blood test which will tell you whats going on where you cannot see. Keep him relatively fit and not overweight (if they are too heavy this will make them more suspectible to joint issues. Our old dog started cartrophan shots when she was 6 until 2 weeks ago at 17. From 6 those twice year courses of 4 weeks worked wonders. If she went sore I found that having rapigel available and putting it on before and after walking (just cut down the distance if she was sore) was more beneficial than complete rest (if its arthritis not an injury). I would wash it off after an hour.

When just the cartrophan wasnt quite working the next move was to go to joint powder - probably started that around 11 or 12 I think so 5 or 6 years after the cartrophen started. I did try magnets but she wouldnt have anything to do with the magnetic rug. Probably 4 or 5 years ago (12 or 13) her blood tests showed kidney issues so she was on medication for that ever since. She had the kidney food for a while but one brand stopped making it and the other brand upset her so we stuck to the old dog supercoat food. Last couple of years (so around 15) she moved onto the vet mobility joint food and other joint treats but drank too much on just that food so was half and half with the old dog supercoat food. But we waited before bring each option in as if you throw everything at once later on you've got nothing else to try.

Ultimately we lost her last week at 17yo - weak leg bones ascaused by her kidneys probably getting to the end and a massive spleen tumour. But all the arthritis supplements we had added over the years had done their job. Until last Novemember she was generally still going on 2km walks every day (sometimes she'd be sore but she'd be ok in a few days). And on her last day she bounced her old dog bounding (she thought she was sprinting but it was the speed of a medium jog to us) for the entire 1.2km walk. In November it appears she had a very very mild stroke (compared to the previous ones) and had a lot of coordination issues and was a lot weaker in her hind end and sore in her back - she was then put on Neurotin as that was the only anti inflam she could have being on the kidney tablets. SHe also started to get that 'old old dog look' more and more from last September - prior to that you wouldnt have guessed her age and many commented she had plenty of time left.

My parents Golden Retriever was about 15 when they lost him too - dogs are living to older ages these days if things are caught and treated early.

[Katdogs]

Bubby is 11? How did that happen so fast!