Training Tips For A 7 Month Old Boxer

[Tor]

Thanks so much for all the great advice everyone. Persephone, he LOVES tug, so we do that quite a bit. He also likes balls, he's getting pretty good at retrieving actually although still has a "keep away" tendency. The Spotted Devil, I like the idea of getting him to do more stuff before he gets to go and play, so I will incorporate that. We've recently started "find it", mostly just as an indoor wet weather activity at this stage, but he seems to like that too. And hide and seek with my kids.

I'm such a novice, could someone explain a bit about the idea of "building value" as I don't think I'm quite getting it. I know he'd be doing so much better in experienced hands, whenever the instructors do something with him he is so good and responsive. He's really a lovely dog.

[The Spotted Devil]

Thanks so much for all the great advice everyone. Persephone, he LOVES tug, so we do that quite a bit. He also likes balls, he's getting pretty good at retrieving actually although still has a "keep away" tendency. The Spotted Devil, I like the idea of getting him to do more stuff before he gets to go and play, so I will incorporate that. We've recently started "find it", mostly just as an indoor wet weather activity at this stage, but he seems to like that too. And hide and seek with my kids.

I'm such a novice, could someone explain a bit about the idea of "building value" as I don't think I'm quite getting it. I know he'd be doing so much better in experienced hands, whenever the instructors do something with him he is so good and responsive. He's really a lovely dog.

You're doing great!

The way I think about "value" is just "what does my dog prefer?" Just like if I put broccoli and cheese in front of you and you get to choose ONE there's a good chance you'll choose the cheese. So how do we build value for broccoli if you think it's quite good but not if there's CHEESE as an alternative (I think I'm chanelling one of my Springers :laugh:) So maybe you only get cheese if you pick up the broccoli first. Next time I want you to sniff it. Then take one bite. Then take two bites before you get the cheese. Before long you realise how great broccoli is and how if you take a few bites you get cheese afterwards. Then you start to want MORE broccoli because it leads to more cheese! Maybe you realise there's more than one way to eat broccoli and gee it's good in and of itself! Hey presto we've transferred the value from cheese to broccoli :D The same principle applies to building value for YOU (broccoli) when there are more fun things to do such as playing with other dogs, running and hunting (cheese)!

And whilst I might choose broccoli at home, don't think I'm going to make it my first choice if I'm dining out. Will need a little more training in new environments first.

So when something goes wrong in training I ask myself "where is the value now and where do I need it to be?" Saves getting upset with your dog and helps to frame it objectively.

ETA: Often a good trainer will get results from unfamiliar dogs for a couple of reasons...firstly, timing and mechanics. If you reward quickly and generously the dog learns to pay attention because WOW you're so much fun! Also, a good trainer will understand how to engage a dog through body language and play. Finally I do think there is a bit of a novelty factor when someone (with good timing and mechanics) trains an unfamiliar dog.

Edited June 19, 2016 by The Spotted Devil

[Tor]

That's a great explanation of building value, thank you! And yes I think there is a bit of a novelty thing going on, although there's no doubt my timing could be much much better.

[The Spotted Devil]

That's a great explanation of building value, thank you! And yes I think there is a bit of a novelty thing going on, although there's no doubt my timing could be much much better.

Trust me the latter comes with practice. Lots of it :laugh: Your dog will forgive your mistakes so make sure you do as well. And video your training - use your iPad or iPhone and a tripod - they are very, very honest!!!

[Willem]

That's a great explanation of building value, thank you! And yes I think there is a bit of a novelty thing going on, although there's no doubt my timing could be much much better.

Trust me the latter comes with practice. Lots of it :laugh: Your dog will forgive your mistakes so make sure you do as well. And video your training - use your iPad or iPhone and a tripod - they are very, very honest!!!

...that's a keen assumption (that everyone relies on this specific brand - must have something to do with conditioning :laugh: )...just for the records: it doesn't have to be a product of this specific brand :D - I use a windows phone and a windows convertible and it works just fine too :D

(disclaimer: ...take last comment with a pinch of salt - we don't want to go off-topic regarding brand discussions :D )

[The Spotted Devil]

I didn't know there was any other type

[Willem]

I didn't know there was any other type

yep, Pavlov works for the interests of these brands too :D

Eta: ...I had to throw the 'Pavlov' in, otherwise we would be really total off-topic :laugh:

Edited June 19, 2016 by Willem

[persephone]

Thanks so much for all the great advice everyone. Persephone, he LOVES tug, so we do that quite a bit. He also likes balls, he's getting pretty good at retrieving actually although still has a "keep away" tendency. The Spotted Devil, I like the idea of getting him to do more stuff before he gets to go and play, so I will incorporate that. We've recently started "find it", mostly just as an indoor wet weather activity at this stage, but he seems to like that too. And hide and seek with my kids.

I'm such a novice, could someone explain a bit about the idea of "building value" as I don't think I'm quite getting it. I know he'd be doing so much better in experienced hands, whenever the instructors do something with him he is so good and responsive. He's really a lovely dog.

:D T S D explained it really well >

THIS link, followed by THIS LINK is a VERY good read !

[Tor]

It's wet and rainy here today so we've been playing "find it" and my daughter laid a scent trail for Sebastian. Then I thought I'd get the clicker out again for the first time in three months and after a few reminders about how click-treat works, I taught him high-five! It took about three minutes, I'm so impressed with him.

Clearly the clicker is the way to go with him. Next stop - LAT

[sheena]

It's wet and rainy here today so we've been playing "find it" and my daughter laid a scent trail for Sebastian. Then I thought I'd get the clicker out again for the first time in three months and after a few reminders about how click-treat works, I taught him high-five! It took about three minutes, I'm so impressed with him.

Clearly the clicker is the way to go with him. Next stop - LAT

[Tor]

Ok. If I can ask another question from the DOL brains trust, I've been reading about LAT. and watching a couple of YouTube videos and I'm a bit confused. There seem to be two ways to do it; one is, you see a distraction (I'll say another dog) and your dog reacts. You stand still and ignore, waiting for your dog to look around at you, however long this takes, you then click and treat. The other way seems to be; your dog sees another dog and before it reacts, you click to get their attention and then reward.

Have I got that right?

[The Spotted Devil]

Ok. If I can ask another question from the DOL brains trust, I've been reading about LAT. and watching a couple of YouTube videos and I'm a bit confused. There seem to be two ways to do it; one is, you see a distraction (I'll say another dog) and your dog reacts. You stand still and ignore, waiting for your dog to look around at you, however long this takes, you then click and treat. The other way seems to be; your dog sees another dog and before it reacts, you click to get their attention and then reward.

Have I got that right?

I use it as follows: look at the thing, mark "yes", look at me, get a treat. If your dog is too exited to think straight you are too close to the distraction. Step back. Waaaaay back if necessary. Once they have the idea, add your cue. Does that help?

[Tor]

I think so. So the click or mark or whatever gets their attention?

[The Spotted Devil]

I think so. So the click or mark or whatever gets their attention?

Sort of - the click or verbal marker says to the dog "yes, that's the behaviour I want! Look at the dog!" As a bonus the dog will look at you. Then you treat. After a few times your dog will start to predict that they get the treat when they look at you. So just start holding off on the verbal marker until they do. So it becomes "look at the dog, look at me, "yes", treat"

[Tor]

Ahh ok, that makes sense. Thank you! We will start tomorrow

[Willem]

I always trained it that 'LOOK AT THAT' meant 'LOOK AT ME' at the end, and used a toy (stick, ball etc...) I held in my hand away from the body using it as a 'lure' to get her focus back on me when I hid it behind my back (this version is pretty popular on YouTube)....it's just a clever way of redirecting the focus from an object the dog wants to look at back to me. Treat as reward linked to the verbal marker or clicker. Frequent repetition imprints this wanted reflex (dog's focus back on me) and links it to the clicker or verbal marker.

This approach allows the handler to control the distraction respectively trigger for the distraction (toy in this case), hence it is training in an absolute controlled environment. Once the reflex is imprinted it will also work - depending on the arousal state and how stable the dog is - in an uncontrolled environment, e.g. when the dog's focus is triggered by another dog.

Today I don't have any problems anymore to get her focus and use the verbal markers (clicker sound with the tongue, her name, 'eh') during 'normal' training as required.

[The Spotted Devil]

I use LAT for counter conditioning. I don't just want to change behaviour but how the dog emotionally feels about the trigger. That's why I want the dog looking at the trigger then looking at me. The trigger STARTS the game rather than making the dog feel scared, aroused etc.

[sheena]

Ok. If I can ask another question from the DOL brains trust, I've been reading about LAT. and watching a couple of YouTube videos and I'm a bit confused. There seem to be two ways to do it; one is, you see a distraction (I'll say another dog) and your dog reacts. You stand still and ignore, waiting for your dog to look around at you, however long this takes, you then click and treat. The other way seems to be; your dog sees another dog and before it reacts, you click to get their attention and then reward.

Have I got that right?

LAT is you are marking the dog looking AT the trigger WITHOUT REACTING & the click also acts as an interruptor. The dog pretty quickly picks up the game as long as you don't go too close too soon. Always set you dog up for success. If you click & he doesn't turn to you for the reward, then you are too close to the trigger. It is entirely different to marking him for looking at you. But there is no reason why you can't play LAM too. the good thing about LAT is eventually the trigger becomes an advantage to you instead of a distraction. :)

[sheena]

I always trained it that 'LOOK AT THAT' meant 'LOOK AT ME' at the end, and used a toy (stick, ball etc...) I held in my hand away from the body using it as a 'lure' to get her focus back on me when I hid it behind my back (this version is pretty popular on YouTube)....it's just a clever way of redirecting the focus from an object the dog wants to look at back to me. Treat as reward linked to the verbal marker or clicker. Frequent repetition imprints this wanted reflex (dog's focus back on me) and links it to the clicker or verbal marker.

This approach allows the handler to control the distraction respectively trigger for the distraction (toy in this case), hence it is training in an absolute controlled environment. Once the reflex is imprinted it will also work - depending on the arousal state and how stable the dog is - in an uncontrolled environment, e.g. when the dog's focus is triggered by another dog.

Today I don't have any problems anymore to get her focus and use the verbal markers (clicker sound with the tongue, her name, 'eh') during 'normal' training as required.

LAT & LAM are two different games, but no reason why you can't play both. The dog has to know that it is OK to look at the trigger, but then turn back to me & tell me it's there, so the trigger becomes the cue for the dog to look at you. If you only play LAMe then you could end up with a dog that is completely "handler focused" whereas you want a dog that can switch between handler & obstacle, especially if you are doing dog sports. JMO though...I may be wrong.

[Tor]

Ok we started tonight with the cat as a handy distraction. I'm not sure he completely gets it yet, he kept offering a high five, but he was by the end shooting quick glances at the cat and then waiting for his treat. We will continue tomorrow with thmy chickens as distraction.

I'm also going to start training an emergency recall, maybe using a whistle. I just need it to be able call him away from other dogs, I found a program recommendation in an old thread from here: http://www.shirleychong.com/keepers/lessons/Lesson6.html

I have a five metre line, but think I might get a ten metre, plus a bungee

Edited June 21, 2016 by Tor