Crate Selection

[Papillon Kisses]

Our vet bet behaviourist wants us to get Malcolm (Chi x) a crate to retreat to when anxious etc. We've already encouraged this behaviour with his beds but the idea is to have something more enclosed.

She mentioned that dogs tend to have a preference as to what type of crate they prefer and that sometimes you have to try a few out. I've been looking at the options available and articles about crate selection, but thought I'd consult the DOL knowledge bank.

Is there any way to predict what sort of crate a dog would like?

Best places to hire a crate to try before you buy?

What are your favourites (brands etc) out of the different types?

Pros and cons of different types/brands?

Malcolm happily curls up in his wooden outside kennel (with bedding) though it took being stuck outside in a thunderstorm to convince him it was a good idea. He loves bedding in general and burrowing under blankets and into pillow cases. Sometimes he can be found with just a blanket over his head. I'm not sure if this means he'd prefer one type over another or if it'd just be a matter of making it all plush on the inside. :)

Other than purely being something he takes to, I think I'd like the crate to be portable so we could take into my parents house when we visit. It being a quiet and dark place would probably be preferred as loud noises and light reflections are two of his main triggers.

Thanks!!

[Mjosa]

I bought about five years ago from K9+ a beautiful canvas crate, I think that it would be ideal for your dog, it is dark if you keep the roll up windows down, has a zip front door that can be left open and for travel folds flat.

These crates are made from super strong canvas.

K9+ are here on DOL

[JulesP]

I can't say that my dogs have had a preference for any particular crate. I prefer the K9+ crates as I find them the easiest to fold etc. Both my dogs love their crates, I have one set up all the time and one of the dogs will usually choose to be sleeping in there.

[Scottsmum]

I can't say that my dogs have had a preference for any particular crate. I prefer the K9+ crates as I find them the easiest to fold etc. Both my dogs love their crates, I have one set up all the time and one of the dogs will usually choose to be sleeping in there.

I can't see exactly why they would... Scottie has two crates at the moment - his metal foldable crate - which absolutely needs a bit more cushion in it and his flight crate - which is currently in half - so it's like a big tub bed. I think he probably prefers the tub / flight crate (which reminds me of a big cat carrier). At night he usually picks it - despite it being out in the laundry. But I think that's possibly to do with cushiness factors.

I have no idea if or where you can hire crates. Maybe have a look on gumtree for cheaper second hand crates or carriers?

Things I like about my wire crate: it's robust, has two doors, is *basically escape proof, folds flat. Dislikes: we got a big one, it cost a bomb, takes up a lot of room. We bought a cover for it - more cost - but we needed it. It does need padding for my old man who likes his luxury.

Good points for the flight crate - while it doesn't pack down as well but more bed like, secure, has a clip on water system.

You might get away with a large cat carrier?

[karen15]

My westie used the cat carrier until he was about 6 months old. I liked it in winter as I could cover it and put his hot water bottle in and he was all snuggly. He had enough room to either be close to or move away from the hot bottle.

It was a plastic, more enclosed carrier than the wire ones you can get.

Edited April 25, 2016 by karen15

[Pjrt]

For a small dog who likes to curl up under blankeis just a small plastic carry box like you can buy at bigw for next to nothing would be fine. The sort you could carry a cat in. Cheap, portable(handle on top, and comes in half easily for storage and transport. ) cosy and with solid walls to push and arrange blankets against.

Fits on the car seat with the seatbelt through the handle for travelling comfort and safety .

[juice]

The advantage of a wire crate is that if he is reluctant to go in a dark area , like he was with the kennel he may go for this type more than a soft crate. you can put a blanket over the top and always drop the blanket over more if he prefers.

i have a wire one, lots of nice bedding inside and blankets to nest and a soft blanket over the top.

i got mine online and free delivery, much cheaper.

Edited April 25, 2016 by juice

[Papillon Kisses]

Lots to think about! Thank you all for your replies. :)

It looks like the k9 pro crates would be the best option if we were to go with a (brand new) wire crate. They're well priced too compared to others seen online. I couldn't see their canvas crates, perhaps they're no longer sold. A forum search brought up lots of fans of noz2noz (?) soft crates though.

It's funny you should mention the cat carriers blinkblink. I've previously thought about getting Malcolm one of those cat igloo-type bed — most cats are around his size or bigger! :laugh: There's a massive price saving vs. similar dog crates too.

And those pods4pets look very lush Snook with the addition of a pillow (he likes his bumpers) and blanket. :)

[Mjosa]

You should email or phone K9Pro in regard to the canvas crates, I have the wire crates which my dogs sleep in at night with covers on, but they are much heavier than the canvas crates which I use when taking them to shows or away for the weekend.

Also the wire crates could damage the interior of your car whereas the canvas ones are car friendly.

[The Spotted Devil]

K9+ Soft Crates are great: http://k9softdogcrates.com.au/crates/royale2

I get my wire crates from Vebopet (online) - solid and very well built for the price.

[fbaudry]

My 2 cents worth, although all the main points have been covered. I have 3 crates, one of each type (soft, wire and plastic).

Plastic transport crate (PP40): it is permanently set up in the living room. I used it for toilet training my spaniel as a puppy, and is now used for meal time inside. Penny will sometimes take herself for a nap inside during the day (as does the cat), and waits in there if she thinks we're about to leave without her (as that's where she'll get a treat). Very easy to clean.

Soft crate: we mostly use it in rental accomodation, and sometimes at home in winter. It seems to be the preferred snoozing spot then. It was a cheap one but is still going strong (but I'm lucky to have non destructo dogs). It could possibly get quite hot in warm weather.

Wire crate: lives mostly in the car nowadays and used at training (and trials if only I could get my act together). I like the fact you can cover / uncover it as much as you like to create airflow and work on impulse control games. It can be "noisy" if you have a dog moving around (but I think that's just me being over sensitive to some metallic noises). I also think the noise, combined with the fact they're slightly "shaky" that puts off my sensitive little terrier. I've seen the vebopets ones and would definitely get one of these if i was to buy another one. I got mine from K9Pro and it started rusting shortly after I got it despite only being used indoors, and it feels a bit flimsy to be honest.

But as you stated earlier, you might not need a crate if you're never going to close Malcolm in (although it could be a handy skill to have). My cocker fits (tightly!) in a Snooza igloo, and there are plenty of choices when it comes to enclosed beds, like the gummi pets range:

http://www.gummipets.com/collections/houses

[huski]

I only ever recommend wire crates or airline crates until the dog is 100% proficiently crate trained. Soft crates are easy for them to bust out of.

Personally there is no way I would be trialing different types of crates - the crate I put you in is the crate you stay in and if the dog is properly crate trained I have never found the type of crate makes any difference.

I only use wire crates as they are easier to clean than soft crates IMO.

Edited April 26, 2016 by huski

[Kavik]

I use wire crates from Vebopet online for general use/trialling/training and have a soft crate specifically for Crate Games but that is all it is used for, wouldn't trust it for proper use at a trial.

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

I had a wire crate and rehomed it.

If I put a cover on it, evil hound would pull it in and eat it. Tho that was more difficult when I put cardboard box over the top then cover over that to hold the cover away from the wire.

But was a bit too much of a palaver. If I get a puppy I will probably have to get a new wire crate or one of those plastic tub ones so that the puppy can't break out of it.

The soft sided ones won't hold a determined dog.

However the K9+ ones have been good even when my dog is upset about other dogs being too close (clueless owners - seriously).

Don't confuse the K9+ Royale with K9pro. They're subtly different. My dog likes being in both or either. I felt more comfortable with her in the big Caprice K9+ when we went to QLD in summer. Or if she has to be in a crate on a hot day. I can get two coleman soft bladed fans in it with her too. And me if I'm desperate.

She likes the crates that are covered on all sides and dark. She does like to be able to see out a bit but not too much - like a cubby house. She also likes to go behind the sofa between it and the wall if the crate is not available.

I think if you want to see if your dog likes crates and what sort, maybe go to an agility competition and talk to people there. Lots of different crates and styles will be available to look at from the show dog on trolley styles, wire crates, lots of different soft sided crates...

I had a vebo pet soft sided crate but after a few years it died. Didn't help I used to give my dog a "bobalot" to kick around inside it. She ended up digging through the bottom to get stray bits of kibble.

[Papillon Kisses]

Our vet behaviourist doesn't want us to lock him, so being "escape proof" doesn't actually matter, he can just waltz out through the open door. :laugh:

I can see a door being useful in an emergency evacuation situation or maybe if we do nose work trials, but the latter is getting WAY beyond myself. Portability is important though for trips to Grandma and Grandpa's. :)

So much to think about, and I'm possibly overthinking it, lol.

[skip]

I had a large BonoFido crate for a decade for two small dogs. When I got my larger dog I brought a small one for my chi x and a medium for the chi x kelpie. Brought on line for about $80 the smaller one.

Love the solid frame that lops up Lu's it has three meshed open sides which was cooler if needed plus the roof can be opened to mesh as well.

My chi loves hers and the other dogs as well. Can't tell u how many times a dog won't hop in their crate and when I check its because the chi has already hopped in. Plus they look cute at trials with all three lined up.

My two small wire crates in car were $39 from a cheapie shop like Clint's. But fine for midgets.

Crates are great. Love mine

[RuralPug]

If the major use for the crate is as a secure den for an anxious dog, then the smaller the crate, the more secure the dog will feel.

So aim for a crate that dog can stand upright in and turn around in, but only just - and give a lot of bedding that dog can bury into if they like. If you choose a wire crate, make sure that it is well-covered with blankets or heavy towels to make a den.

If your dog is non-destructive, and you want the den crate to double as an occasional transport crate, then for a cat size dog I would probably also be looking at soft sided small pet carriers which when compared with soft crates have more den-like qualities, you just need to to choose one that has a walk-in door.

Regardless of the type of crate that you choose, the most important thing is to make the dog happy in the crate. Google "crate games" and "crate training" to find a method that suits you. :)

Edited - went back and checked, so assuming your Chi cross is cat -sized or less then a pet carrier like this one for example might be the thing to look for.

Edited April 26, 2016 by RuralPug

[Isabel964]

I have a lovely soft crate we got from Petban a couple of months ago. I don't know the brand but it has an expandable option that you simply unzip. When you unzip that left side s section unfolds open. I bought a sheepskin as the mat so it's pretty comfy! My dogs loves her All the best. I tend to agree that your dog will like whatever crate. Just make it comfy. Even the strong wire ones that look like a string cafe are good - your dog might like you to put a blanket I over it (except the entrance) to feel nice and safe and secure ... to make like a little personal cave type set up.

[Willem]

wrt 'den': ...crates can be a reasonable tool, but I always have some issues when people justify the use of a crate as a 'den'. Healthy and balanced dogs don't live in dens! Even their close relatives (coyotes and wolfs) use shelters (which can be a fallen tree, the cover of a bush, den like structures) only for breeding to hide and protect the young ones from predators and wheather, so considering that in most packs there is only one breeding pair and their yearly season, these relatives spend only a very little time in den like shelters - and they are never locked!

IMO there is a severe underlying issue if a dog has a need to hide from his pack members (dog owner, family memebers, other dogs), a healthy and balanced dog will feel much saver if he sees his pack members around him. Covered crates might help anxious dogs to find some less stressful moments to relax from an otherwise intimidating environment, hence covered rest places can make useful tools (and don't need to be lockable). However, it should also be noted that for some dogs the underlying cause of anxiety might have been irresponsiable long and forced stays and associated isolation in crates! Similar to an e-collar, dog owners should be aware that a tool wrongly used can do a lot of damage!...and how convenient is it to leave the dog safely locked in the crate for 'another 10 minutes', but hey, no crate user never ever left the dog locked in the crate for TOO long, of course - I just wonder how do we know when the period the dog stays in the crate is too long.

Then there is the argument that it helps wrt toilet training. Seriously?...how good does it feel sitting with a full bladder in a car or bus, perhaps in a traffic jam?...walk the dog - at the beginning it might need a walk every hour - and it will take only a few days for a successful toilet training.

Crates (lockable) are good for safe transport, to lock a dog for medical reasons, for short confinements as a better alternative to tethering or chaining, but there are always the associated risks that come with such a convenient tool.

@OP: I would go for the cheapest soft type crate as I understand that the main purpose is providing the dog with a hide-out and not to lock him away. If you also need a safe transport option (I have a cargo barrier in my car, so don't need a crate for transport) than a wire crate is an option too.

Edited April 29, 2016 by Willem

[Tassie]

Debating about whether to bother replying - think . But I really don't want other readers to think that this view is the only one.

willem said

IMO there is a severe underlying issue if a dog has a need to hide from his pack members

. My 7.5 year old Border Collie would beg to disagree .. he has the option of sleeping anywhere in the house, including furniture, and my bed, but he chooses to sleep in his airline crate, beside my bed. It is totally his choice ... the door has not been shut on that crate for about 5 years, and in fact I took the door off about 2 years ago. Sometimes he gets bullied out of his crate when my 14 year old BC girl decides that she wants to sleep in there. Again, dog's choice.

My dogs travel in wire crates in the SUV .. they have water and soft bedding in there, and on long trips, get toilet stops every two hours ... although they are capable of going longer. The big exception is when they travel across Bass Strait on Spirit of Tasmania ... then dogs are kennelled for approximately 12 hours.

They have soft crates for travelling - the first things that go into our dog-friendly accommodation .. you can almost hear the visible sighs of relief when they see their crates. Again, doors are open, except at bedtime, when I do close them in to safeguard the property.

Rory has his show trolley for use at shows and trials .. and if you ask him, he would definitely tell you it is his safe space, where he can relax. On odd occasions I have forgotten to fasten the door .. he stays in his crate.

Willem is correct in saying that like all tools, crates can be abused. And if the dog has not been trained in the use of the crate, it can be problematic.

With regard to toilet training .. many find it is comforting to both puppy and owner to have the puppy sleeping in a crate near the owner's bed ... then it is easy to hear when the puppy needs to go out, put a light leash on and take the puppy out to toilet, deliver the appropriate praise and then quietly put the puppy back in the crate with a little biscuit, to go back to sleep.

The thing that convinces me most of all of the value of crate training, to the dogs as well as to us, is that we find that dogs, who are supposed to have difficulty generalising, seem to have no difficulty generalising the concept of 'comfy safe place' ... happily going into different kinds of crates without needing to be specifically trained to them. Maybe it's not technically a 'den' instinct, but it sure seems to work well for the dogs, whatever it is.