Kibble Recommendations Please

[juice]

I havn't fed kibble for years, i prefer raw, ( roo, or chicken with VANS) .

However i have a new dog who really doesn't like the VANS , and is now walking away from it rather than eating, even after only adding a tablespoon to the meat.

She is an ex breeding bitch who is 3, and her breeder fed her red meat, kibble ( supercoat or VIP), with brown rice.

I think i am going to suck it up and get some kibble to go with the roo and chicken mince i have been giving her , but reading all the food reviews is doing my head in!

BT's are prone to skin problems, so i don't want to get anything that will cause an issue ( the breeder did mention she may get hotspots if i feed roo as its rich, so i am feeding chicken mince alternately)

So, i don't want to go high end and find its actually full of fillers and rubbish etc, which reading reviews paying more doesn't always mean good.

i could just feed the kibble the breeder fed, but i always thought both were not great?

i know this thread will cause lots of discussion! :laugh:

So far from reading reviews, Black Hawk grain free is my top pick?

My other option is to add to the meat she happily eats to make a complete balanced meal, just not sure where to start?

Edited March 27, 2016 by juice

[Two Best Dogs!]

I feed BlackHawk Grain Free and StayLoyal (all grain free), with various mixes of raw. I went with them because all the other affordable foods made her skin kinda flaky and her fur all coarse. They also had lots of corn and stuff. The emu oil in BlackHawk I think is good for the coat and skin I think

[The Spotted Devil]

I feed Artemis juice - really chose it for Zig's sake as Em does well on anything that doesn't contain corn. Ended up raising the pups on it (plus raw) and very happy with it.

[juice]

Any particular one?

[The Spotted Devil]

This one - Fresh Mix: http://www.artemispetfood.com.au/products/fresh-mix-adult/

Although they also do a grain free mine do fine on the brown rice and I like the rest of the ingredients.

[Scottsmum]

What about the VAN meat from the fridge section + RMBs?

http://www.vetsallnatural.com.au/raw-76-for-adult-dogs/

http://www.vetsallnatural.com.au/raw-76-graingluten-free-fresh-kangaroo/

Otherwise we alternate between Ziwipeak dry & Natures goodness grain free (maybe not the best best choice but its what my fussy boy will eat)

http://www.vippetfoods.com.au/product/natures-goodness-grainfree/

We tried a huge number of dry - have tried sunday pets brickettes and Ivory coat grain free and Scottie would not eat either. I actually returned the Ivory coat to the shop. So I have a vote of zero confidence for both of those. I really wanted him to like the ivory coat as it's aussie.

There was one other Aussie one I wanted to try but I never got around to it. Will see if I can find it.

[Willem]

https://www.woolworths.com.au/Shop/Browse/pet/dog-food-adult-senior?name=applaws-it-s-all-good-dry-dog-food-lamb-kangaroo&productId=899675 ... Applaws grain free ...pretty good value for the money, especially when it is on sale...

[juice]

I thought those VANS meals were just what i was feeding anyway, their complete mix with meat added? so no good as its the complete mix she is turning her nose up at.

I looked up the VIP grain free from Coles which the breeder is feeding, and its not that bad, especially when i saw the price of Black Hawk!

I havn't seen the Applaws before, will look at that too.

I think a visit to petshop to check out Artemis, BH and a few others might be my first job.

Edited March 27, 2016 by juice

[Scottsmum]

I thought those VANS meals were just what i was feeding anyway, their complete mix with meat added? so no good as its the complete mix she is turning her nose up at.

I looked up the VIP grain free from Coles which the breeder is feeding, and its not that bad, especially when i saw the price of Black Hawk!

I havn't seen the Applaws before, will look at that too.

I think a visit to petshop to check out Artemis, BH and a few others might be my first job.

I could be totally wrong but I think they're different. We were feeding the grain free VAN 76 and it just looked like mince to me - no other kind of obvious bits. It was a big gluggier than human grade mince but no more gluggy than minced chicken frames. It did have a distinct smell. I've not fed the mix you soak then add to your own meat so can't (*shouldnt*) really comment - but as I said I thought they were different. I note that they have a new grain free offering in that mix.

I find Scottie reliably eats the VIP - which you can get from coles and woolies. The orange label. He's not so fussed on the purple one. He's eaten the cat food too (I was literally days out from flying and didn't have a car - it was all the grain free food I could access LOL)

The Orange VIP is our one go to - He's been happily eating it for over 12 months - which is a record around here. Just as a side note - you can get it in three different size bags - when I was living in Sydney's inner west that was always the small and medium size - when I moved a bit further west (Baulkham Hills) I noticed I could only get the large size.

I could only ever find Applaws in coles. He wasn't a huge fan & I had to go out of my way to find it. It is imported - VIP is aussie. There have been reports of bits of plastic being found in it.

There were good reviews for the Costco grain free - but I think there was a supply problem. Not sure if anyone else can commnt on that.

[mackiemad]

I feed the meals for mutts sardine dry to my dog that has a contact grass allergy - in combo with raw patties (rabbit, Dr b's barf brand) it's the diet he has done the best on. Though his second best is the black hawk lamb and rice.

I'd try the VIP and go from there if it doesn't agree with her.

[RuralPug]

I am assuming that you are adding the dry supplement Complete Mix to mince and she does not like that. Personally I would probably go the extra mile to get her to eat the diet that I want her to eat before trying new foods.

Have you tried the "fussy eater" slow transition to a new diet? You start by feeding her the diet from the previous home for the first few days, then you offer a dish of 90% old diet and 10% new diet, well mixed. If she eats that, fine next day it is 80% old and 20% new, then 70%/30% the day after and so forth. Ok it is often messy and fiddly to slowly change, but it is only for 3 weeks maximum and then you are on 100% new.

Apologies if you have done it that way already and she is still refusing.

The next thing that I would try is changing the presentation a little. Do you just sprinkle the supplement on top of mince or just stir it in a little? I would be trying to change the texture of the VAN mix before adding it to the meat - you might try mixing her portion with a little plain yoghurt or mashing it with a canned sardine for added flavour and texture. Then stir that into the mince.

Also, even though you've been advised of previous diet, were you told precisely how it was presented. For instance, the mince and brown rice may have been in a home cooked casserole served separately from the kibble, or all mixed together. Some serve kibble soaked in water to make a gravy, some dry.

Lastly, was she fed within sight or sound of other dogs and bitches eating, and if so, is this still the case at your home? Sometimes a rehomed ex-breeding or show dog takes a while to get accustomed to new feeding styles and it will just take time if that is the real problem.

[juice]

Yes i tried a gradual change first, i mixed the mix into the meat, and even tried adding sardines or an egg to hide it and she still wont touch it.

She scoffs her brekky down, 2x4 bicuits and a couple of chicken feet.

Tonight i just gave her roo mince on its own with a 2x4 biccy ands it was gone in seconds.

She eats in the garage away from my other dog who is outside, as i never know with new dogs how they will go around food.

I checked with the breeder today and it was a cup of kibble, a cup of rice and 300g of meat all mixed in.

The VANS is pretty smelly and herby, so that could be whats putting her off.

Its a bit annoying as it has worked so well with all my past dogs and i like feeding raw, but don't know what else i could add to the meat she will eat in order to make it balanced enough without going kibble.

I might just try the VIP or Applaws and see how she goes on it.

I presume the brown rice he was feeding is a filler?

[RuralPug]

Yes i tried a gradual change first, i mixed the mix into the meat, and even tried adding sardines or an egg to hide it and she still wont touch it.

She scoffs her brekky down, 2x4 bicuits and a couple of chicken feet.

Tonight i just gave her roo mince on its own with a 2x4 biccy ands it was gone in seconds.

She eats in the garage away from my other dog who is outside, as i never know with new dogs how they will go around food.

I checked with the breeder today and it was a cup of kibble, a cup of rice and 300g of meat all mixed in.

The VANS is pretty smelly and herby, so that could be whats putting her off.

Its a bit annoying as it has worked so well with all my past dogs and i like feeding raw, but don't know what else i could add to the meat she will eat in order to make it balanced enough without going kibble.

I might just try the VIP or Applaws and see how she goes on it.

I presume the brown rice he was feeding is a filler?

Yes the rice is just a fairly easy to digest grain but it would have been cooked - quite possibly in stock which adds to the flavour. The VAN mix does smell strong but most dogs quite like it. No accounting for taste I suppose! Perhaps she thinks that it is - horror - medicine LOL.

I appreciate keeping dogs separate during meals, some breeds more than others ,but sometimes if it is possible to just have a gate or something between them so they can see hear and smell another dog it then stimulates them to eat the most horrible dinner just so the other dog can't get it. No set rule, each household knows what works for them.

Edited March 27, 2016 by RuralPug

[juice]

she can see my other dog in the pool area eating as i leave the garage door up for her, i even tried letting him out and giving him her leftovers and she wandered over and still wouldn't touch it.

Every dog i have had loves the VANS, she must be a bland sort of girl! :laugh:

[Scottsmum]

she can see my other dog in the pool area eating as i leave the garage door up for her, i even tried letting him out and giving him her leftovers and she wandered over and still wouldn't touch it.

Every dog i have had loves the VANS, she must be a bland sort of girl! :laugh:

Maybe something makes her "flair up".

Scottie will often not eat things which have grain in them - especially if I haven't realised (eg accidentally bought the wrong dog roll or treats are given to use with grains in them) Having a lactose intolerance myself I understand and appreciate him not wanting to eat something with grains in it.

[trifecta]

Juice, Bruce Syme, ie Vets All Natural, make a supplement which you could add to the mince portion of her diet if she doesn't like the texture of the muesli. However, does she really need a supplement? With raw meaty bones, chicken feet, eggs, sardines, a little offal and roo mince together with some pulped or even steamed vegetables she will be getting all her requirements.

[oakway]

Absolutely nothing wrong with the VIP grain free. If the dog has done well on the diet that the breeder has fed it why not continue with it. By the way kangaroo is not a rich (fatty ) food. That's why it is recommended to heart patients, but it is high in protein and you may find that the protein may be to high if fed in large quantities for SOME dogs.

[juice]

I suppose after feeding raw for so long, and getting good results , even people commenting on how good they looked when i changed to it i am reluctant to go to kibble again.

But if its what she is used to i think i will get a bag of VIP and let her settle more and see how we go.

Do i need to still do the boiled brown rice he was giving too or is it just a filler? can i just give extra meat and kibble?

She loves the roo mince, scoffs it up , unlike the chicken mince which she takes her time on. I like roo as its so lean.

[Scottsmum]

I suppose after feeding raw for so long, and getting good results , even people commenting on how good they looked when i changed to it i am reluctant to go to kibble again.

But if its what she is used to i think i will get a bag of VIP and let her settle more and see how we go.

Do i need to still do the boiled brown rice he was giving too or is it just a filler? can i just give extra meat and kibble?

She loves the roo mince, scoffs it up , unlike the chicken mince which she takes her time on. I like roo as its so lean.

I feed Scottie mainly VIP and chicken mince or necks.

I tried really hard to get him onto full raw but it just caused stress and upset and ultimately a visit to the vets to get his AGs done

but I understand what you're saying. Remember "the best diet is the one your dog does well on" (within reason)

I think the rice is nothing more than just a filler - but if she looks well and is a good weight why don't you let her settle a bit more and then experiment with getting rid of it? I'd probably swap it out for vegies anyhow if I thought she needed extra filling up - Or other "raw extras" which can add variety and nutrients and be fed as a bit of a treat (eggs, fish, yoghurt).

Coming into winter I like knowing they have a warm meal in their tummy (hello human emotions) so maybe some warm rice wont hurt. I often cook an extra egg for Scottie in winter and mix through his kibble.

[juice]

She recently had her last litter, and was rather rotund when i picked her up!

I just had her desexed aswell so don't want to put her through too much at once ( she had rather a bad desexing ( reaction to anesthetic ).

She could still do with dropping some more weight, and because i havnt seen her at her best yet its hard to judge.

just looking online and it seems i can get VIP in bulk like that, no idea how much it is in woolies, so need to go look and compare.