BarbedWire Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 A dog at DAS pound in Canberra has just given birth to a single pup. I am quite disappointed even shocked that this has been allowed to happen. Firstly I thought our society was better than this. The motherhood process (which includes unborn pups and their mothers) is in some way sacred. Then I wonder if the mother had adequate prenatal care, especially diet. I wonder what sort of dietary care will now be provided for both mother and pup. Thirdly I worry about the environment for a pup who will be surrounded by anxious stressed out dogs at the pound who will be barking and howling and no doubt the mother will also be stressed. I also worry if the pup will receive adequate socialization and exposure to the outside environment. The post in the Urgent thread says that the mother will stay there 'until her motherhood duties are completed'. This may mean she won't be adopted or even rescued while she has the pup with her but I am not sure that it will mean that she stay at the pound. Perhaps I am just jumping to conclusions. http://www.dolforums.com.au/topic/265334-das-due-5-january-2016/page__pid__6777859__st__15#entry6777859 #20 UPDATE 4 Jan 2016The girl in Yard 1 formerly yard 5 has just had her pup and both are fine. So she is not going anywhere at least until her motherhood duties are completed I would be interested to know what others think about this. This dog has been at the pound for four weeks. I do realise that she was available to rescue only and I do understand that it was probably difficult for a rescue to take her on because she does not get along with other dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbedWire Posted January 4, 2016 Author Share Posted January 4, 2016 Some photos. She looks badly done by. Poor girl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loving my Oldies Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 I guess it depends on the pound. Notwithstanding that, it is very sad. Like having a baby in jail :( All the normal parts of life are missing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 If the dog arrives at the pound very pregnant, and the pound can't find anyone suitable to take her home, what else are they supposed to do? I wouldn't be surprised if my dog was born in the pound. If not - she was extremely young when she arrived with the rest of the litter and her mum. The AWL was vague about the details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbedWire Posted January 4, 2016 Author Share Posted January 4, 2016 I guess it depends on the pound. Notwithstanding that, it is very sad. Like having a baby in jail :( All the normal parts of life are missing. I agree DDD. I thought that in Canberra the RSPCA took the pregnant ones because their kennels are more suitable but this dog came from the RSPCA. I may be wrong but I thought the RSPCA was given special funding to look after dogs in this type of situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbedWire Posted January 4, 2016 Author Share Posted January 4, 2016 If the dog arrives at the pound very pregnant, and the pound can't find anyone suitable to take her home, what else are they supposed to do? She was at the pound for 4 weeks, almost half of the pregnancy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_PL_ Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 A dog at DAS pound in Canberra has just given birth to a single pup. I am quite disappointed even shocked that this has been allowed to happen. Firstly I thought our society was better than this. The motherhood process (which includes unborn pups and their mothers) is in some way sacred. Then I wonder if the mother had adequate prenatal care, especially diet. I wonder what sort of dietary care will now be provided for both mother and pup. Thirdly I worry about the environment for a pup who will be surrounded by anxious stressed out dogs at the pound who will be barking and howling and no doubt the mother will also be stressed. I also worry if the pup will receive adequate socialization and exposure to the outside environment. The post in the Urgent thread says that the mother will stay there 'until her motherhood duties are completed'. This may mean she won't be adopted or even rescued while she has the pup with her but I am not sure that it will mean that she stay at the pound. Perhaps I am just jumping to conclusions. http://www.dolforums.com.au/topic/265334-das-due-5-january-2016/page__pid__6777859__st__15#entry6777859 #20 UPDATE 4 Jan 2016The girl in Yard 1 formerly yard 5 has just had her pup and both are fine. So she is not going anywhere at least until her motherhood duties are completed I would be interested to know what others think about this. This dog has been at the pound for four weeks. I do realise that she was available to rescue only and I do understand that it was probably difficult for a rescue to take her on because she does not get along with other dogs. That's very important. Particularly when you add hormones on top of that. Yes it is sad that she had her pup at the pound but if there was somewhere else to go where she could be safely isolated and managed then it would be different. I'd rather see her there if she has potential to put other foster dogs at risk, sorry. Her options sound limited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simply Grand Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 (edited) They wouldn't have known she was pregnant when she arrived, with one pup they may not have realised until she was whelping, or close to it. I'm surprised she's at DAS actually, unwell dogs, pregnant mums and puppies under 6 months always used to go to RSPCA as they had better resources to care for them. There were a few early pregnancy cases while I was at RSPCA where desexing went ahead, but most of the pregnancies that came through while I was there were either surrendered or seized late in the pregnancy or there was one case where she hadn't been de sexed as she had another medical issue we were investigating (not affecting pregnancy) and it was only as that was close to being resolved that we realised her belly had suddenly popped! At RSPCA they certainly got good care and nutrition both pre- and post-natally and as much socialisation for the pups as possible, although it could never be as good as them being raised within a caring home As far as society being better than that, if only that were so! People can be horribly uncaring about their dogs, we had people saying you can just have mum but I want the puppies back (so they could sell them)' you can keep mum but I want one of the puppies (so I have a cute puppy instead of my old dog), brand new or very young litters dumped when so still need to be with mum, etc etc. So sad. Edited January 4, 2016 by Simply Grand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbedWire Posted January 4, 2016 Author Share Posted January 4, 2016 She first appeared on this forum as being in urgent need on Dec 12. It was also noted there that she was pregnant and was from the RSPCA. The DAS website says that she has been at the pound for 30 days, so she must have arrived there on Dec 5. I am wanting to know when the pregnancy was confirmed - at DAS or at the RSPCA and if it was confirmed at DAS why was she not sent back to the RSPCA? DAS pound dogs are kept in enclosues/yards which from memory are about 1-1.5 metres by 2-3 metres in size. This dog has been moved to Y1 which is bigger than the other yards possibly about 2 by 4 metres. It is not kind to confine a dog to yards this size for such a long period and it is certainly not a suitable place for a bitch and pup to be kept. I am concerned about this pup's welfare. Surely it deserves a better introduction to life in Canberra in 2016. Puppy farms are banned in Canberra but the conditions being offered for this pup at DAS must come close. Maybe I am overstating my case and I have not acknowledged that DAS does have volunteer dog walkers. It is still very disturbing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simply Grand Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 Oh wow, I didn't realise she had all that background sars, that really doesn't sound right! Even if the RSPCA whelping kennels were full I would have thought she'd still be better off there in a normal kennel than at DAS it's very strange. I wonder if she unfortunately fell through the gaps or whether this is a policy change. As sad as it is for her (and I hope something can be done) I do hope it's a one off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbedWire Posted January 5, 2016 Author Share Posted January 5, 2016 Thank you SG for your helpful reply. I am not only worried about the pup's welfare but I am also concerned for the mother. According to her temp notes she is about 9-12 months old so is only a pup herself. If the pup stays with her until it is 8 weeks old, then the poor mother will have spent 12 weeks confined at DAS. I am also worried about what will happen to her after she has fulfilled her 'motherhood duties' as she was available to 'rescue only'. Will she be put up for adoption or has she already been deemed unsuitable because of her dog aggression issues? (It is not that unusual for pregnant bitches to be aggressive to other dogs.) It would not be the first time a dog from DAS (It was at the RSPCA) has been kept alive until its pups no longer needed her and then she was pts. I personally followed that one up and when I questioned the RSPCA staff about her well-being asking to see her I was told by a smarmy woman in the front office that she was very ill which I understood to mean that she was no longer with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted January 5, 2016 Share Posted January 5, 2016 In Adelaide - there isn't really a difference between RSPCA/AWL shelters and the pound. All the councils send the dogs they collect to one of those if they can't find the owner within about 24 hours. They don't take surrenders, you have to go to RSPCA/AWL. And they don't like taking surrenders either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keetamouse Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 DAS have a birthing area now and the mum would be away from the normal pens, I doubt she had the pup in one of the regular pens also I doubt they would have her and the pup in the 1st kennel, I think the question needs to be asked before the thread goes any further and becomes a DAS bashing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbedWire Posted January 6, 2016 Author Share Posted January 6, 2016 (edited) This thread was never intended to be a DAS bashing or bashing of anybody. I don't usually 'bash'. I just asked the question because I am concerned about the dog's welfare and that of her pup. I am also concerned that in Canberra in the 21st century better provision is not made for pregnant dogs who find themselves in her situation. Good on DAS if they have created a special area for her. I am only going on the website which says that she is in Y1. I personally have had good dealings with the people at DAS and I have found them to be good people who try their best for the dogs at the pound. They have to clean up after irresponsible dog owners and sometimes it must be difficult. My last dog came from DAS and they were wonderful. eta Bashing is not my style. I ask questions. I am an ex English teacher and I ask questions to instigate discussion and thinking about contentious topics in the hope that answers will be found. If I am critical of anyone it is the owner of the dog, although she is lost and the owner may not know where she is, and the lawmakers in the ACT who do not provide funding for better resources because they do not see animal welfare as a priority although they passed laws to ban puppy farms in the ACT. Passing laws is always the cheap solution. Edited January 6, 2016 by sarspididious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crazydoglady99 Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 DAS have a birthing area now and the mum would be away from the normal pens, I doubt she had the pup in one of the regular pens also I doubt they would have her and the pup in the 1st kennel, I think the question needs to be asked before the thread goes any further and becomes a DAS bashing. I agree ^^^ Maybe the post was not intended to be DAS bashing? I don't know. In the canberra times today is an article stating the RSPCA is overfull and has been unable to take any new dogs for over a month.. might explain the situation?? Sad for the dog, yes - but at least she and her pup are safe and being cared for at the pound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbedWire Posted January 6, 2016 Author Share Posted January 6, 2016 DAS have a birthing area now and the mum would be away from the normal pens, I doubt she had the pup in one of the regular pens also I doubt they would have her and the pup in the 1st kennel, I think the question needs to be asked before the thread goes any further and becomes a DAS bashing. I agree ^^^ Maybe the post was not intended to be DAS bashing? I don't know. In the canberra times today is an article stating the RSPCA is overfull and has been unable to take any new dogs for over a month.. might explain the situation?? Sad for the dog, yes - but at least she and her pup are safe and being cared for at the pound. Really? It is not DAS bashing. Have a nice day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarbedWire Posted January 7, 2016 Author Share Posted January 7, 2016 She is still at the pound in Y1 (as per the website) with her pup. She is so gorgeous and if I were able to bring her home (which I can't) I would be calling her Gretchen or Gretel. She's a beautiful gentle girl who deserves better. Her yard door is labelled 'Do not walk'. I do hope she is able to get some exercise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melzawelza Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 It's always healthy to questions the practices of pounds and shelters, even if they are generally good, as long as it's done constructively, which I think Sars has done. I guess the problem is likely that she has shown aggression to other dogs - there may not be many rescues with placements that are able to take her and her pup on safely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keetamouse Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 This thread was never intended to be a DAS bashing or bashing of anybody. I don't usually 'bash'. I just asked the question because I am concerned about the dog's welfare and that of her pup. I am also concerned that in Canberra in the 21st century better provision is not made for pregnant dogs who find themselves in her situation. Good on DAS if they have created a special area for her. I am only going on the website which says that she is in Y1. I personally have had good dealings with the people at DAS and I have found them to be good people who try their best for the dogs at the pound. They have to clean up after irresponsible dog owners and sometimes it must be difficult. My last dog came from DAS and they were wonderful. eta Bashing is not my style. I ask questions. I am an ex English teacher and I ask questions to instigate discussion and thinking about contentious topics in the hope that answers will be found. If I am critical of anyone it is the owner of the dog, although she is lost and the owner may not know where she is, and the lawmakers in the ACT who do not provide funding for better resources because they do not see animal welfare as a priority although they passed laws to ban puppy farms in the ACT. Passing laws is always the cheap solution. It was a general statement at no stage was I directing what I said to you or anyone person, I have been on DOL for many years and just didn't want the thread to go the wrong way like they have in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 It's always healthy to questions the practices of pounds and shelters, even if they are generally good, as long as it's done constructively, which I think Sars has done. I guess the problem is likely that she has shown aggression to other dogs - there may not be many rescues with placements that are able to take her and her pup on safely. That would be my guess. re birthing in pounds, if desexing is an option then I'm all for it but it isn't always, sometimes it's too late etc. It's pretty easy to rehome puppies as opposed to adult dogs so I don't have a real problem with it as long as the pups and Mum are well cared for, and that really depends on the staff and facility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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