House Training - Positive Vs Negative Approach

[missymac]

Last night we had some friends over. I mentioned to them that we are getting a puppy soon.

I know the old fashioned method of house training was that if your puppy made a mess you rub their nose in it and smack them and send them outside.

I don't know if anyone on here still does that but from what I've read surfing the net while doing my research for my new pup we're encouraged to instead ignore mistakes (but prefer to avoid them happening of course), and give praise when the pup goes in the spot that we're trying to teach them to use.

Anyway, the couple that was over have a little dog (don't know what it is, came from a petshop), we were talking about when I get a pup and the guy said make sure you discipline them, if Molly went toilet inside I'd rub her nose in it give her a smack and stick her out. I didn't want to say anything at the time but I disagreed because every website I'd read on house training encourage the opposite (giving praise for correct actions instead of growling for incorrect actions).

So anyway, I was just after opinions and what worked for you.

[KitKat]

I know the old fashioned method of house training was that if your puppy made a mess you rub their nose in it and smack them and send them outside.

This just doesn't work....if the dog learns not to pee and poop inside it's because they've work it out another way...all the dog learns from this is to be careful of grabbing hands IMO.

Positive is the only way to go with housetraining...be observant and consistant.

we're encouraged to instead ignore mistakes (but prefer to avoid them happening of course), and give praise when the pup goes in the spot that we're trying to teach them to use.

exactly

I didn't want to say anything at the time but I disagreed because every website I'd read on house training encourage the opposite (giving praise for correct actions instead of growling for incorrect actions).

That's when you go "Oh...i the way I did it was blah blah blah...and my dog Fluffy picked it up really quickly"

[Guest Tess32]

It's very old fashioned and just plain illogical. Most of all - it's unnecessary! Unneccessary force is abuse.

Some dogs will simply start peeing/pooping when you aren't there, as they will associate you with punishment and poop. Some will get nervous and their confidence will suffer.

All my dogs have been house trained in a week or under - just follow the positive advice and take them out just after eating and then heavy with the praise.

Nat

[missymac]

I think it shows how uneducated a lot of people are when they buy dogs.

My grandma used to breed goldies so she would have used the old fashioned way. My mum hasn't house trained her own dog so she thought you still did it the old way, I quickly corrected her saying that dogs aren't trained that way anymore.

That's when you go "Oh...i the way I did it was blah blah blah...and my dog Fluffy picked it up really quickly"

I haven't got my pup yet so haven't actually personally had experience house training a dog. Plus I was worried that it was kind of like telling someone else how they should raise their kids.

[KitKat]

Simple....use the 'friend' excuse "My friend got a new puppy a little while ago, the pup was housetrained in no time...but they did it this other way...blah blah blah"

Well...with all advice..it's up to the listener to take it on board or not

[Tracey*]

All my dogs have been house trained in a week or under - just follow the positive advice and take them out just after eating and then heavy with the praise.

Nat

Woah! That's amazing!

Mischa started to go outside on her own to pee & poop a few weeks ago, it took about 3-4 weeks to get to that stage. She's had accidents maybe once a week, once or twice, which is good in my book and was probably my own fault anyway

Positive is always better I say. I'd rather make it a pleasant experience for all of us, rather than scare her into doing things.

[Guest Tess32]

hehe.

Both GSD's took about 3 days at 8 weeks old, my collie was 4 months and took a day.

Nat

[poodlefan]

I use both methods.

I praise the pup for doing the right thing.

I slap MYSELF in the forehead if there's an accident inside - because I'VE stuffed up by not being vigilant or taking the pup outside regularly.

Rubbing dogs noses in poo belongs to a time when teachers beat children in schools. Both were stupid, cruel and ineffective in teaching desired behaviour.

I've trained a dog in two weeks and another took two months - to some degree it depends on the dog.

Edited May 5, 2005 by poodlefan

[SALTWOOD]

I have housetrained a lot of dogs as I have been breeding and showing for many years now and I have developed a bit of a routine which suits our family and lifestyle so I thought I would share it.

All my dogs get to come in the house of an evening. They get a lead on and tied to separate chairs in the family room when I am training a pup so everyone is getting the same treatment and no jealousy can occur. Also we get to eat our dinners without having the dogs wanting to climb up on the table to join us. I give them chew toys to amuse themselves with when they are restrained.

The pup gets used to not being able to go whereever he wants to go whilst he is "untrustworthy" and I get to monitor him. Every 1/2 hour or hour I untie him and take him outside to "wee". I tell him to "wee" and praise him when he does it.

After I get an idea on how far between "wees" the dog can last I will let him off to play in the loungeroom with the toys or cuddle on my lap but every 1/2 hour or whatever I will put the lead on him and take him outside.

The occasional accident will happen but rarely, because if I forget to take the pup out, I have to clean up the mess so I tend not to forget.

The finished product is a dog that doesn't mind being restrained inside, is clean in the house because he hasn't learned to soil inside plus a dog that will "wee" on command!!

[Tracey*]

My goodness, a DAY! I've still got the door wide open 'just in case'.

We're trying to teach her to ring the bell to be let outside now ...

[KitKat]

I was happy with my pup...within two weeks he was barking to let me know it was time to go outside

Unfortunately the only times we made mistakes was when were at a friends place but he didn't have the full idea at that point though.

Now however he will go for hours without going to the toilet and will wait till we get home.

[missymac]

I use both methods. I praise the pup for doing the right thing. I slap MYSELF in the forehead if there's an accident inside - because I'VE stuffed up by not being vigilant or taking the pup outside regularly.

Saltwood, I will keep your method in mind when my pup arrives.

Edited May 5, 2005 by missymac

[George my Doggie]

I house trained George in under a week using the positive method. The negative method doesn't work. A dog has a very short associative memory (about 3 seconds according to a book I have called 'puppy school' [it was my bible when I first got George]) so in order for a dog to link and action with a consequence, it will have to happen in under three seconds of the event.

It's no use punishing a dog for something it has done while you weren't watching it because it will not know what it did wrong. All it will learn is that it's owner becomes agressive for no reason and is not to be trusted.

Never ever hit any animal. Don't punish it for doing wrong.

Positive methods are the only way

Some more advice for house training :

Don't bother with paper training, it's quicker and easier to teach the dog to go outside from the start.

Keep the door that leads outside closed, so there is a clear definition between inside and outside and the dog doesn't get confused.

Try to keep your dog in one room until it is housetrained, but give it some supervised freedom of the house every day.

Take the pup outside every 30mins-1hr

Praise your dog like crazy when it goes where it is supposed to

That's what I did, worked very well. But it depends on the dog. From what I've heard, herding and working breeds, poodles and most gundogs learn very fast.

Edited May 5, 2005 by George my Doggie

[poodlefan]

George MD, I think that should read..

Herding and working breeds, most poodles and gundogs learn very fast.

I'm afraid my youngest dog was not a quick learner in the toilet training department. However, he's made up for that shortfall by mastering climbing onto the laundry bench, opening up the overhead cupboard and helping himself to the dog snacks kept in the top shelf. Little &%&$&%

[MolassesLass]

Since my puppy enjoys sleeping in the bathtub, I've been contemplating teaching her to pee in there........tempting, but not sure I have the patience and skill to define for her properly exactly what I expect. Would be a great party trick though.

[George my Doggie]

Well, of course it depends on the individual dog's personality, temerament etc. I was just reffering to the breed in general ^.^

[KOE]

Elka arrived yesterday and at 10 weeks no mess my secret is to,

1. puppy sleeps in bed when cries or wiggles I wake up.

2. as soon as puppy opens eyes straight outside

3. as soon as eats and drinks outside.

4. always keep back door closed and inner doors open so there is no mistake

5. if I am out confined to the bathroom with heaps of toys, they dont mess near their toys

I have done this with my shepherds each one from a baby and wham housetrained in no time. I have also taught them to pee on command, helps while travelling

[m-j]

So anyway, I was just after opinions and what worked for you.

Hi

Aside from all the above reasons nose rubbing is not the way to go because,

to rub a dogs nose in it is just teaching it to pee/poop wherever the owner can't see it. When a pups gotta go they've gotta go, if they haven't been taught to vocalise or let you know they want to go out (hence one of the reasons to crate the dog when you can't watch it or put it outside), and after many nose rubs they eventually work out that going to the toilet inside makes the owner mad so they hide it.

Do you (not you personally) shove a childs nose into it's nappy to potty train it?

Just a word of advice a friend taught her dog to stand by the door in the lounge and look at them when she needed to go out. This was very effective when they were in the lounge, but not when they were anywhere else, so the dog would go inside, we taught her to bark at the door problem solved. There are other things you can get the dog to do if you don't want the dog/pup to bark.

hth

cheers

M-J

[Pete]

I do agree, especially with the newspaper bit LOL. You need to try and avoid the situation where the dog does toilet inside, althought in most cases accidents will happen. Observe your dog and you will know when it is wanting to go outside. If you walk the dog out with you it will eventually start going to the door to be allowed outside.

Here is a great link with loads of valuable puppy information: http://www.k9events.com

[missymac]

Do you (not you personally) shove a childs nose into it's nappy to potty train it?

This is what I told my husband when I was explaining that I disagreed. I said a puppy is like a baby, do you punish a baby because it can't go to the toilet to relieve itself?