Adding A Dslr To My Mirrorless Kit

[Spoony]

I haven't been visiting here lately, yeah slack I know, but I figured who better to ask than a bunch of dog lovers that lover too shoot!

I currently shoot with Fujifilm X-T1, have a 12mm 2.8 Zeiss, 35mm 1.4r fuji, and 50-230mm 4.5-6.7 Fuji.

The majority of shutter actuation on this camera has been for dogs. While I love the body, size, and image quality I get out of the X-T1, the more and more shooting I do, I find the focus system to be frustrating me. In low light it can struggle at times, but lots of that is because I shoot the 35mm at 1.4 o often, which is shallow DOF, but largely it's the ability to track and focus action. It does 8fps which isn't bad but need all of that to snag the odd really good keeper. Also the EVF black out while shooting (a general mirrorless issue) make it hard to keep the camera on subject at times.

I've also started go garnish more interest from people in my shots. I'm shooting lots more for rescues, but have recently become one of the agility clubs I'm a member of's official photog. They based this on shot's I've already taken, so I can get good shots with it (I'll put examples below), but it can be hard work, with low keeper rate. For a while I've wanted to start a little enterprise in photography, just haven't bothered jumping in properly as I enjoy shooting more for fun and charity. However this gives me the opportunity to be promote and sell my work with a captive audience, some of which I know personally, with exclusivity. I do large format printing for a living which affords me the ability to offer cool visual products at good prices.

As you can understand my confidence in shooting action is a bit low due to gear restrictions. Partly due to the focus system but also because my zoom is so slow I can't shoot late into the day or under lights with that lens. I can get a Fuji 50-140 2.8 but that is nearly $1900, by all accounts an awesome lens, but I feel I'll still have the same reservations, plus I don't think it offers enough reach.

Hence I'm considering getting a DSLR body for this type of shooting, and perhaps keep the X-T1 for shooting short focal lengths. The tilt screen on the X-T1 can be invaluable, and while the odd DSLR has this, their focus systems are way behind the X-T1 in speed when using live view, which I think is important when shooting ground level using tilt screen. Sure one can lay on the ground, and I do at times, but often that gets the wrong response from the subject (ie, lets just lick his face haha).

I've pretty much decided on the lens. The Tamron 70-200 2.8 VC, which by all comparisons I've seen vs the Canikon variants it' rates right up there but is far better value. Hopefully can source a good second hand one for just under $1k or new they are $1340.

The real decision is weather I stay in the APSC world or move to full frame for this purpose. I'm leaning toward Nikon bodies, largely as I want to keep top image quality. While I understand that in good light there is really nothing between most modern sensors, in low light Nikon has the edge generally, but they also noticeably surpass Canon in dynamic range and the ability pull detail from shadows or even highlights. I find I do a fair bit of this push/pull in post with the X-T1 due to lighting conditions I like to shoot in. That and I feel at the moment Nikon offers the best value in either category.

So my options are D7200, currently at $1100 brand new with rebate, or full frame D750 at around $2270. Obviously it's a fair price difference.

Both have really good focus systems, Nikon's 3D tracking is really well regarded, low light focus is awesome. The D750 does have a few advantages more than just Full Frame, tilt screen, a group focus mode etc, but other than most of that they are similar.

Now in good light there is bugger all between them in image quality. In low light the D750 shines, apparently near on 1.5 stops better than the D7200, understandable given the big sensor.

Initially I figured the D7200 would do, it's sensor is ranks as the best APSC sensor to date, its IQ matches or surpasses the X-T1 and it gives me the bonus of added reach on a 70-200 lens.

However I jumped into the X-T1 not knowing as much back then and for some things, like action focusing I am now disappointed. Hence I'm thinking of going the D750 so I will know without going to a $7k body I'll have all I can really have.

My logic though, at least with shooting agility (which will only be a small part of it's use) is that the D7200 offer more reach and can constantly shoot at F2.8 and rarely need cropping. The D750 will have less reach and likely often needs some cropping. So in Good light the D7200 wins. However in good light a 1.4x converter would change this for the D750, now at F4 the DOF would be similar I think and everything would be back on part, perhaps edged to the D750.

As the light fades however the D7200 is going to struggle more with ISO and shutter speeds required. BUT the D750 again has less reach, so would just have to either only keep shots at a wide view that stay crisp, or crop in which then brings it back in line with the D7200 in IQ. Same if using a 1.4x in one light, the Full Frame advantage is largely negated. BUT it does give the option to just shot at 2.8 on FF without as much reach and get top shots, the D7200 doesn't.

For shooting action out of the ring, if I hopefully start doing some paid shoots, reach is maybe not quite as important as one can work the range better? So advantage goes to the D750 for shooting later into the day + shallow DOF

My logic is still to keep the X-T1 for short duties, but I worry if I splurge on the D750 I'm gonna love what it does and then go poor buying great shot lenses. While it has a tilt screen, I doubt it's contrast detecting only Live view focus system is going to be much use unless the dogs/animals stay still in their pose (yeah right? lol). This is where the X-T1 is better.

Curious to hear peoples thoughts.

A few examples showing the handy work of Tilt screen, plus agility shots with the X-T1 and a $290 lens

Tango - a rescue available for adoption with Animal Rescue Qld https://www.petrescue.com.au/listings/397672/feed_show by Dan P, on Flickr

Scarlet - ARQ rescue pup, wolfhound mix by Dan P, on Flickr

Brisbane Agility Club Comp by Dan P, on Flickr

Brisbane Agility Club Comp by Dan P, on Flickr

ADCQ Agility by Dan P, on Flickr

[Spoony]

Cheers for your insights. Very helpful being from someone currently using the X-T1 + also having a history with Nikon DSLRS. The D700 by all accounts is a great camera, it's sensor tech is now behind the other two due to age but focus performance still good. However apparently the D7200 and D750 are better again. Given your experience of the D700 vs the X-T1 that really does give me confidence.

Yeah I agree with your thoughts on the 50-140mm, it's just too expensive to justify on the X-T1 for me. For $400 odd more one can get a 70-200 2.8 of great quality plus another body! I've also heard/and noticed the same about the bokeh from it too.

I'm guessing peoples success rate with dogs, X-T1 + 50-140mm isn't much better, or consistent, likely they've managed to 'snag' some good ones 8fps like I'm able to do now. It's not reliable and I'm sure shooting at 2.8 would make it even harder.

I totally hear you on the size thing too. Hence why I'm thinking I'll keep the X-T1 for both personal and pro use (when/if I get there) for short range. With the fast lenses and with ISO not too high it produces really great images, and I've printed 1000mm in size from it and still looks good even though it's only 16mp. I'd be like you if I didn't have such a small kit. Reluctant to drag a D750 and big lenses around everywhere. Now I have 3x Fuji lenses, the body and a flash in a bag the size of a footy and just over 2kg or so, which is awesome.

While the D750 buffer in raw is limited (15-17 shots I think), it's fps is 6.5 vs 8 in the X-T1 which is about 23 Raw, so the shoot time isn't that much different and I manage fine with that now. I feel how many keepers you have in that time is more important than sheer quantity.

Edited November 5, 2015 by Spoony

[huga]

I have a D700 and a D800, but I shoot weddings, not action. All my lenses are primes, my favourite is the Sigma 35mm Art. I would suggest hiring if you can, that way you'd get a really decent idea before you commit. I will say that going from DX to FX blew my mind.

My D800 is lighter than my D700, the difference is noticeable. But everything hurts after 12 hours of shooting anyway.

Edited November 6, 2015 by huga

[Spoony]

Good info. While I'm not thinking about shooting other genres much, I think it may happen, the D750 leaves that opportunity a bit more open too. A mate who is also into photography has talked about us starting to do some weddings together, firstly would be friends/family I think. D750 is one of the lightest and smallest full frames about, probably not as solid built as the two you have but good enough I think.

[Spoony]

Things I've thought of too! Yeah plenty are using the X-T1 at weddings these days so I could use both still. Having different lenses on different bodies ready to go would be handy.

You're correct about how they 'look' and render, though I think Nikon's rendition and colours are closer to Fujifilm than Canon at least. Could be something adjusted in post somewhat though?

I figure if you're shooting different focal ranges too on each camera it may not matter as much as the 'look' here is also different?

Mate has canon gear though, which he'll likely update soon but will stick with canon due to invested lenses. He would swap if it wasn't for that.

[Spoony]

Hmmm this album of a D750 + 70-200 2.8 shooting agility gives a good idea of its abilities. It seems focus tracking is used with plenty of sequences very sharp (no chance of that with X-T1). Loving the subject isolation in some of shots, cleans up what is generally messy backgrounds at fields and gives great depth.

[Spoony]

Yep very true. I was a bit neive when I bought into the xt1 and there was a bit of hype around when I was shopping about focus ability.

In reality the hype one could only relate to older mirrorless bodies. In real usability terms for tricky action certainly not the right choice for the coin.

Has taught me patience and different technics though. Which may still be handy

[Spoony]

Figured I'd update this thread. I ended up sourcing a new D750 Lowepro toploader bag + Used Tamron 70-200 2.8 for $3k total.

It's certainly a different beast to the X-T1 in regards to focus performance and handling. It snaps off shots and focus rapidly quick. Shadow recover and low light is very impressive. Able to shoot at 1/800th of second after the sun goes down and still get clean shots with punchy colour is awesome. A

Even if the X-T1 had the 50-140mm 2.8 on it it couldn't achieve this, mainly because their ISO claims are bit bogus but also because ISO 6400 is the limit. The one under lights on the XT-1 at ISO 6400 would have had the shutter speed under 1/200th and a total blur.

Reality is any of these example below either doubt the ISO or 1/2 the shutter speed vs the X-T1. I thought the internet claims were just fanboi's ragging on Fujifilm but I did a little exposure vs shutter vs ISO test myself and they aren't.

Agility example below is under crappy lights and at ISO 8000.

Agility under lights. D750 1/640th + ISO 8000, not too shabby by Dan P, on Flickr

I'm in awe how it nails focus with such shallow DOF with a running hound, ISO 3600

Striker on the boardwalk by Dan P, on Flickr

Another at ISO 4000, forgot to reduce the shutter speed but it seems don't really have to be that mindful anymore, at least when using this camera

Testing the new D750 + Tamron 70-200 VC 2.8 by Dan P, on Flickr

BMX DOG :) hehe

Testing the new D750 + Tamron 70-200 VC 2.8 by Dan P, on Flickr

Edited December 7, 2015 by Spoony

[Spoony]

Yeah for sure!!! And agree, my X-T1 + 12mm 2.8 + 35mm 1.4 + 50-230mm sloth + Nissin i40 all fit in my sling bag at near the same weight not much more size than the DSLR + 70-200mm 2.8.

Mind you most of it is that lens, sure the body is somewhat bigger and has a bit more weight but given the performance difference on any level that's not good light and static subjects it's more than acceptable. Couple the 50-140 2.8 on the X-T1 and in my opinion the advantage really chopped down to almost insignficant. It's not a great deal smaller (12mm length and a few mm diameter, 300 odd grams) than the Tamron, yet can't offer close to the same performance in quite a variety of situations on each comparative body.

In saying that the Fuji 'kit' will be my grab and travel go too + for close range, the compact fast super sharp primes and also sharp compact zooms (even the cheap XC's are aweseomely sharp, destroy Cannkion' cheap lenses) are where that systems at, for me at least