Raw Feeding Issue. Too Much Bone?

[laeral]

My 8.5 year old GSD has been fed raw since she was a puppy. Up until now she has had absolutely no issues with her digestion whatsoever. She has always been healthy, not smelly, lots of energy, good teeth and a very shiny coat. Up until this week anyway. She had to spend the night at the vets on Tuesday as she was very constipated and needed an enema (sp?) The vets said she had a lot of small rock hard bone fragments stuck in there and was quite horrified what I had been feeding her To be honest I have been quite slack over the last 3/4 weeks as I have been working 13 hour days and have not always managed to blend veggies for her so she has been having a rather large dose of chicken frames for her main meals. Her nutrition has been quite unbalanced and I feel terrible that I caused this

I have been told to feed her no more chicken frames and only lamb neck occasionally. I think the vet wanted to push kibble onto me but she knows how I feel about it, and didn't raise the issue again! So now I am torn and not sure what to do. On one hand I sort of feel that the reason that this has happened is that I haven't been feeding her properly over the last few weeks, and she has thrived on her normal feeding regime for the last 8 years. Do I really need to change her diet? But on the other hand, what if the vet is right and I am feeding her badly and could cause this to happen again. Maybe she does get to much bone in her diet.

At the moment she is fed twice a day

Mornings - either chicken frames/lamb neck/roo tails or wings

Evenings - blended veggies, small amount of roo meat/sardines or offal, joint supplements. Sometimes she gets an egg as well

Does this seem like a decent diet? Or should I cut back on the meaty bones in the morning and give her more meat? If I cut back on the bones, what sort of meat would be a suitable alternative?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated :)

[DeltaCharlie]

Ours get blocked up if we feed too much bone in a week, so I imagine 3 weeks would land us where you are. If it were me, I would go back to what you have fed for years and your dog has done well on. Just be careful not to feed so much bone again :)

[laeral]

Thanks for the reply. I feel like her diet has worked so well for her that I am reluctant to change it, but a bit nervous that this will happen again. I might look at cutting back on the bone a bit but keep the rest the same.

[Diva]

I would say yes to more meat, chicken frames and wings are very boney. A cheap source of boneless meat is beef or lamb heart, easy to get and nutritous.

[persephone]

Maybe a chicken frame every second day ..and a good chew of rootail/fish head or lamb neck on weekends?

[Roova]

While you have long days would you consider a premade barf? Still raw but bought frozen so you just need to get each segment out the night before. It might make life a bit easier for you at the moment whilst still meeting your health requirements?

[laeral]

I would say yes to more meat, chicken frames and wings are very boney. A cheap source of boneless meat is beef or lamb heart, easy to get and nutritous.

Thanks, i will have a look in the supermarket and see if they have them available. I am a bit limited as I live rurally.

[laeral]

Maybe a chicken frame every second day ..and a good chew of rootail/fish head or lamb neck on weekends?

Yes I think you are right,I will cut back on the chicken frames. I did start to feed a ridiculous amount due to ease. Poor mica

[laeral]

While you have long days would you consider a premade barf? Still raw but bought frozen so you just need to get each segment out the night before. It might make life a bit easier for you at the moment whilst still meeting your health requirements?

I have looked into this but she needs about 1 1/2 kgs of food per day so it wasn't really affordable. I can't remember how many patties that equated to but it was a lot!

I use the pre made barf for the cat, she doesn't eat as much lol

Edited October 2, 2015 by laeral

[laeral]

Any ideas what would be a good source of meat to increase in her diet? I buy her roo mince at the moment, as she is only having about 300gms a day. I couldn't really afford it if she was getting a kg a day. I will look into the hearts, but would welcome any other suggestions what other people feed.

[DeltaCharlie]

Ours get roo mince but we only pay $4 a kg for it so pretty affordable. It pays to ask around to find out who can do it for you. Rural places are easier to source meat from than cities :) Ours also get canned tuna once a week. We mix in their veggies etc with the mince.

They also get lamb brisket, Turkey wings, chicken carcasses, roo tails, fish heads and beef bones but we only feed bone 3 days a week, sometimes 4 (but that's when they tend to get blocked up so we try to avoid it).

[Salukifan]

How about chicken drumsticks? They have a higher proportion of meat to bone. Aldi have them at a good price. Chicken Marylands are also good and often seem to be on special.

A lot of chicken carcasses don't seem to be much but bone. I'd just mix it up more.

[WreckitWhippet]

Coincidently did you exercise her any less ?

[alpha bet]

Yes Vets love to push the dry food..... try not to fall into the trap....it is really just the whole pet industry out there pushing to convince the public that they do it better but really it is just all market hype.

I have had a GSD who had a similar problem... he was a dog who was prone to chewing bones up to nothing and hence was prone to blockage... so he rarely got bones but I did give him a lamb flap every week which kept his teeth in great condition. However I also added oil to his diet on a regular basis to help keep him lubricated. Back then he was on dry food and chicken loaf but we have learnt a lot more about the diet after going to the States and seeing how the independent research stacks up against the marketing. One thing we were told was that Older dogs do start to have trouble processing a lot of bones... so cut back once a dog is over about 6

Nowadays we feed Vets All Natural with 100% Roo Meat which we source from a local roo shooter - as many of the pet shops call it roo when it could be mixed with horse or other. we only pay $4 per kilo and it is beautiful clean meat -(contact me if you wish to get some) but we also like to add extra fatty meat as the roo is perhaps too lean so we look for cheap cuts of lamb or beef as well. The other thing I am looking for is organ meat... heart, lung etc .... but wanting to find it in a minced block as I hate handling it.

We also add leftovers from our table as well as yoghurt and fish.

Try not to be conned by the marketing of the commercial foods... really they are just producing a product to make it convenient so the public think they are giving their dog the well rounded diet.

Edited October 2, 2015 by alpha bet

[JulesP]

Yes Vets love to push the dry food..... try not to fall into the trap....it is really just the whole pet industry out there pushing to convince the public that they do it better but really it is just all market hype.

I have had a GSD who had a similar problem... he was a dog who was prone to chewing bones up to nothing and hence was prone to blockage... so he rarely got bones but I did give him a lamb flap every week which kept his teeth in great condition. However I also added oil to his diet on a regular basis to help keep him lubricated. Back then he was on dry food and chicken loaf but we have learnt a lot more about the diet after going to the States and seeing how the independent research stacks up against the marketing. One thing we were told was that Older dogs do start to have trouble processing a lot of bones... so cut back once a dog is over about 6

Nowadays we feed Vets All Natural with 100% Roo Meat which we source from a local roo shooter - as many of the pet shops call it roo when it could be mixed with horse or other. we only pay $4 per kilo and it is beautiful clean meat -(contact me if you wish to get some) but we also like to add extra fatty meat as the roo is perhaps too lean so we look for cheap cuts of lamb or beef as well. The other thing I am looking for is organ meat... heart, lung etc .... but wanting to find it in a minced block as I hate handling it.

We also add leftovers from our table as well as yoghurt and fish.

Try not to be conned by the marketing of the commercial foods... really they are just producing a product to make it convenient so the public think they are giving their dog the well rounded diet.

I used to ask my butcher to mince up liver for me.

[Salukifan]

Try not to be conned by the marketing of the commercial foods... really they are just producing a product to make it convenient so the public think they are giving their dog the well rounded diet.

No offence but isn't Vets All Natural a commercial food largely comprised of undigestible grain? You can demonise kibble if that's how you roll but there are plenty of happy healthy dogs around for whom kibble forms at least part of their diet.

I get where the vet is coming from. Kibble IS a relatively cheap method of increasing the fibre in a dog's diet. And the dog needs more fibre. If fur and feather aren't available then non digestible cellulose in the form of plant material is where you look to. Bone is NOT fibre.

Diced frozen veggies and dry baked pumpkin are two options.

As dogs age, their digestive system becomes less effective. Clearly this dog isn't handling the level of bone in its diet that it did as a youngster. Not the first older dog that I've heard of that required an enema to remove compacted bone from its bowel.

Never let principles get in the way of a dog's health. If cost is a factor and other fibre options (raw meat is mostly water by the way) aren't available then don't write off using kibble to provide fibre. If grain is the enemy in the owner's opinion, then grain free options are available. And yes, Vets All Natural is another commercial option.

Surely the focus must stay on preventing the recurrence of the issue. As Wreckit has highlighted, exercise also stimulates the gut to pass bone. More walking will help.

Edited October 3, 2015 by Haredown Whippets

[Dame Aussie]

I agree with HW, I would rather feed a combination of raw and good quality kibble than feed only raw and have health issues. By all means stick to raw if that's what you prefer, but if cost is an issue I wouldn't allow principles to cause issues for the dog.

We get lamb hearts at our butcher and they're a great meal. Also drumsticks, marylands and lamb necks have a good bit of meat on them. We feed frames but only a couple times a week as they are mostly bone.

You can add things like sardines/tuna/yoghurt/egg to kibble aswell.

Edited October 3, 2015 by Dame Aussie

[trifecta]

Agree with the comment about exercise - I have had similar problems with Shepherds as they age and cannot tolerate as much exercise as they used to get. As advised, I agree in increasing the meat content, also vegetables like pumpkin. I feed whole chickens instead of frames (when it is chicken day), I can buy a twin pack of number 11s for $12. Have a look in the supermarkets for specials, designated chicken shops if you have them in any local larger towns, and failing that, see if chicken wholesalers will sell direct to you.

[WreckitWhippet]

Dogs don't have to be old to feel the effects that a change in exercise levels can have on the digestive system. Dogs travelling or dogs that normally get a lot of exercise or free running can experience issues with constipation.

[Diva]

Like trifecta I feed whole chickens, usually for $3.50 a kilo but sometimes much less. I just whack them in half and they get a half each on chicken days, which are 2 or 3 days a week.

Edited October 3, 2015 by Diva