Anthropomorphism.

[Dory the Doted One]

The Cynic in me wonders whether the real rescue was the puppies, Mum is just a By Product. Her job is done, now time to ditch her quick.

Hi there, Liz from Belgian Shepherd Rescue here. Actually the main focus of the rescue was the mothers. Unfortunately the only real evidence I have is Facebook messages to my team whereby I say, "I want the puppies out of there but i am more worried about the adults as they'll just be bred from again regardless". Unfortunately other than screen grabs and copy+pasting I won't be giving out my Facebook password any time to prove that!

You'll either have to take my word for it or like you say, be a cynic and choose not to believe me. Either way, they're all out of that environment which is the absolute best outcome we could have worked towards.

I'm not that much of a cynic. More than happy to be corrected. Thank you for the clarification.

[tdierikx]

Thanks for joining the discussion Liz... would you care to elaborate about Rosie's "protective" tendencies, and the chasing cats thing?

I do note that you are looking for a foster to adopt situation for Rosie... are you also looking for an experienced home for her as opposed to the bleeding heart type that will most likely respond to the flowery wording of the ad?

T.

[BSRA]

Thanks for joining the discussion Liz... would you care to elaborate about Rosie's "protective" tendencies, and the chasing cats thing?

I do note that you are looking for a foster to adopt situation for Rosie... are you also looking for an experienced home for her as opposed to the bleeding heart type that will most likely respond to the flowery wording of the ad?

T.

Sure I'd be happy to answer any questions about Rosie. I originally wasn't going to respond as it was pretty disheartening to read some of the assumptions and accusations being thrown around about the handling of her case but I feel it's better to clear the air and try to give some people an understanding of 1) the dogs and 2) the way we deal with them.

I am not sure how many people on this forum have handled working line (WL) Shepherds so please don't find this condescending, I just feel it's important to offer some background as to the breed, as I noticed many of the profile pictures are of small breeds and these WL Shepherds are a league of their own!

WL Shepherds are selectively bred with the following traits in mind (amongst others): high energy, high prey drive, high protective instincts. We see dogs with these traits often: Malinois, Dutchies and - as with Rosie's case - working line GSDs. Protective instincts in Belgian and WL GSDs are normal - it's part of why they make such great law enforcement, military and personal protection dogs. The other facet to German Shepherds in general is that they are "velcro dogs" who are extremely prone to separation anxiety, they bond strongly and it’s a double-edged sword when it comes to the breed in general.

So when it comes to Rosie she has the following issues:

She bonds incredibly quickly to one person and feels the need to protect them against, well, anything. In her particular case she has issues with other dogs being in proximity to her "person" and will attempt to place herself between other dogs and her humans; she’ll nudge, nip, mount, barge and bark at the other dog. Keeping in mind that much of Rosie’s past experience with other dogs has been trying to keep her numerous litters of puppies safe while on a 5m chain…. The behaviour isn't evident right away, it really only presents itself when she has bonded and feels the need to be protective. Yes, it’s borderline possessive, but it’s born of that natural instinct to resource guard and protect what she deems as “hers”.

- She has a high prey drive; she hated my cats. She would happily chase my cats all day long if given the chance and if she couldn't get to them (i.e. she on one side of the door, they on the other) she would bark and scratch at the door. This behaviour, again, is seen prevalently in the breed and to me, it’s something you manage and are constantly aware of rather than “train out” of them (unless you’re partial to e-Collars and let’s not go down that road today…)

Rosie is fundamentally a sweet, loving dog and she does not display outward aggression, but she does possess a high prey drive, high protective instincts and a desire to resource guard her humans. These things take time to work on, but they can definitely be managed in the right home.

In our experience, and with speaking to three different trainers and behaviourists, we decided the best way to rehabilitate Rosie (keeping in mind that she has not in her 4 years of life ever been treated as a family pet) would be with a foster carer - how else are we going to create the bond required to correct those behaviours? This then puts Rosie in a comfortable, no pressure situation while we work with paid professionals to get her issues under control. Sure, this does take a committed carer and it's a lot to ask but there are people out there who are willing to dedicate the time and energy to work with a dog like Rosie, which is where the emotionally charged advert comes in.

As someone pointed out it's much easier to rehome puppies and we had 4 black, female, WL Shepherds, all around the same age, all looking for foster/adopt homes. So how do you get people to engage? Respond? Send in an application? Donate to the thousands of dollars worth of bills we had? You anthropomorphise the heck out of that post. The practice is certainly up for debate and ridicule - as evidenced here on this forum - but you know what? It works. If anthropomorphising with an over-the-top Facebook post is going to ensure that our dog goes to a home that is committed to her and working on her issues then we’re going to keep doing it. If we’re being real, I’d dance naked on a rooftop singing ABBA covers if it meant that our dogs ended up in the perfect home - I love them, I care about them, I want the best for them, I’d do anything for them.

Rosie was being looked over. As another poster has correctly identified, the soft and mushy post is designed to pull at the heart strings but it’s then followed up with a very intensive application and screening process. I do want applicants that are emotionally invested in the dogs - who wouldn’t want that?

Now just a few things I’d like to address while I have some time (very valuable in rescue!).

TBH, when I first read your comment, “are you also looking for an experienced home for her as opposed to the bleeding heart type”, I was a little offended. To me it’s common sense to place a dog like Rosie with an experienced carer and to infer otherwise is condescending as anything. So to put it simply - yes, of course, no question. However, let’s get to the core of that question, what makes you say “as opposed to”? Since when did ‘experienced’ and ‘bleeding heart type’ become mutually exclusive? In fact, the experienced, bleeding heart types make some of the best carers! Being able to channel your emotions in to action is a valuable skill - it’s why Belgian Shepherd Rescue Australia exists… Similarly, we do not adopt our dogs out on a 'first come, first served' basis! The amount of time that our committee spends screening, interviewing, reference checking and trialling is crazy. For 3 reasons: 1) We have to protect the dogs in our care and the people charged with caring for them 2) We have to protect the reputation of our breed and 3) I studied Law at Uni so there is a sensible girl within my bleeding heart exterior who is not about to be sued and jeopardise the hard work we have put in to build this rescue.

I guess in summary, I know that the decisions we make and the way we run our rescue will not always appease everyone and that’s okay. Our dogs are safe, healthy and happy and that’s a job well done in my book. If anthropomorphic posts will continue to garner incredible homes for our dogs then so be it.

I must say that it is nice to have feedback though. We have definitely taken what you’ve said on board. For anyone that’s been following the rescue you’ll know the posts written in “first canine” are a new thing for us and we have taken heed of the comments discussing the length and extremity of the posts and it’s given us something to work towards. We are always open to constructive criticism, it’s something I feel is important so my inbox is always open. If you feel there is something we could work on then please feel free to flick me an email, had it not been for one of the forum members emailing me this thread I would never have seen the feedback.

Cheers if you read right the way to the end, now go outside and play with your doggies - it’s a beautiful day :)

[BSRA]

Oh, I also forgot one major point. Rosie was treated immediately for her neck wounds the day she came in to rescue. The ad was written 2 weeks after she came in to care, then it was posted a week later. It was a silly oversight of ours to not change the '2 weeks' to '3 weeks'. Rosie did not go without vet care!

[LisaCC]

Thanks for the reply BSRA, although I only see maybe 2 people in this thread with "lap dogs" as their profile pic, and one of those also has a rottie who I believe is being trained in IPO? There's a big range of people here on DOL

[tdierikx]

Thank you for enlightening us with regards to the screening processes involved with rehoming a dog like Rosie... there are so many rescues out there using emotive ads to pull in the unsuspecting adopter, and certainly do operate on a 'first come, first served' basis. Glad to know BSRA aren't one of those rescues... *grin*

T.

[raineth]

It's good to hear of the practices you have in place.

I still think the wording is very misguided and not in the best interests of the dog or the rescue's reputation. I am familiar with plenty of people involved in rescue who have no skill or knowledge to back up their bleeding heart. When I read that information, that is exactly what I am reminded of, and I imagine man other people are too. I really think you are more likely to turn away the kinds of knowledgeable and skilled person you need than attract them with that style.

[Salukifan]

As an experienced dog owner, I read those kinds of posts and conclude the rescue has no idea about dog behavior. That's the challenge I suppose. Generate interest from the right prospective homes. I'd be wanting a factual description of the dog. Her circumstances alone are enough to pull heartstrings on me.

[BSRA]

I am trying to take this all on board and again, thanks for the feedback. Out of interest, can anyone write an alternative post for Rosie?

[Salukifan]

Rosie is a 4 year old pedigreed German Shepherd dog from working lines rescued from a high volume breeders. She has spent much of her life on a chain, which had become embedded in her neck.

Rosie was rescued with her litter, all of whom have found homes. We are now seeking a foster carer or adoptive home that can help Rosie make up for the lost time she spent as a breeding dog.

Rosie will require socialisation and training. She has a sweet nature and is a playful girl but can become protective of people she has bonded to. Some ongoing training to deal with her resource guarding of her owner may be required.

Her ideal home would be with an experienced dog owner or adult family without cats and possibly with an exisitng dog to serve as a companion. We seek a home where Rosie will be fully included in family activities, allowed inside and treated as one of the family. She will blossom in the right home.

Edited October 1, 2015 by Haredown Whippets

[ish]

I think something along the lines of what HW just posted is perfect. Anyone considering fostering a WL GSD should already have done research and know a bit about what to expect - so the finer details need not be included. Some cutesy stuff like that she enjoys playing in water or toys etc is good as it reflects her individual personality but I'm another who feels the sob story attracts the wrong sort of people

[Salukifan]

Edited post to add that Rosie is playful ????

[Better Late]

I'll bite too, seeing as it was me who originally posted the thread.

"Rosie is a four year old, purebred German Shepherd from working lines, and as such she will require a breed experienced home or a home who has previously or currently owns high drive dogs (GSD, Malinois etc).

We are seeking a wonderful home that will provide her with structure, leadership, belly rubs, mental stimulation and an introduction to the wider world. She is an exceptionally sweet girl who would be a pleasure to have in the home.

The new foster carer or adoptive owner must be prepared to put ongoing work and training into Rosie as she does display resource guarding tendencies when it comes to the person she bonds with most, and we are prepared to offer ongoing support from our current behaviourist to allow Rosie to make better choices and, in essence, relax, which is what we at BSRA ultimately want for her.

As with most working line breeds she does have a very high prey drive and is not suited to a home with cats or other pocket pets, however this would certainly see her suited to either an agility or other dog sport home as her prey drive when channeled correctly will see her very easy to motivate."

Liz, I commend you for taking the time to respond to this thread. I still stand by what I said in my original post, I really cannot stand the tugging at the heartstrings, sob story descriptions as in my mind it is detrimental to the dog, but these are only one persons feelings on the topic and I respect the fact you are taking everything in this thread on board, as I originally posted it to create a discussion which is what we ended up with.

I do hope that Rosie finds an excellent home and I have no doubt she will with your help.

[Salukifan]

I like yours better Better

[_PL_]

Honestly, I thought it was an old american post and up for a bit of analysis. If it were my group and policies being pulled apart on the basis of a (sorry, frankly daggy lol) writeup I'd have an absolute shit-fit. Happy to be asked, although we're fairly known and it's all over the website anyway. But 'outing' on a forum... points to BSRA for being patient.

As I said before, 1st person is effective at generating interest, it just is. It's what you do after that initial contact which is important.

btw I want Leo :laugh:

edit; for embarrassing spelling mistake

Edited October 1, 2015 by Powerlegs

[Loving my Oldies]

BSRA, your response to this thread and the comments made makes me very very happy for any rescue dog who finds his or her way to you.

[Dame Aussie]

Honestly, I thought it was an old american post and up for a bit of analysis. If it were my group and policies being pulled apart on the basis of a (sorry, frankly daggy lol) writeup I'd have an absolute shit-fit. Happy to be asked, although we're fairly known and it's all over the website anyway. But 'outing' on a forum... points to BSRA for being patient.

As I said before, 1st person is effective at generating interest, it just is. It's what you do after that initial contact which is important.

Yes, completely agree. Whether one likes the style of write up or not isn't any real indication of how the rescue group actually chooses a potential adopter.

[Jemmy]

I don't think I've commented in here yet, but BSRA I just wanted to commend you on coming in here and clarifying things. Sounds like Rosie has the right team in her corner and I wish you all the best in finding her a family. I follow a few GSD rescues and do prefer the more factual style as opposed to 'first canine'.

[trifecta]

I am trying to take this all on board and again, thanks for the feedback. Out of interest, can anyone write an alternative post for Rosie?

Take a look at the profiles Sally Rogers writes for her dogs up for adoption - after all she is the rescue officer for the Belgian Shepherd Dog Club of NSW......with many years experience.