Child Loses A Hand

[Jemmy]

It's horrible for everyone involved. But it does concern me that you cant even leave your dogs in your own property. The dogs didn't get out.

There's a gap where my gate meets my fence line that a small child could possibly stick their hand in, in light of this I'm going to have to look at options to block this access. My dog can't get out but apparently now I have to account for people getting in. Do I think she would bite? No, but is it worth the chance?

[Rebanne]

Years ago I had to tell the next neighbours not to let their visiting grandchild feed my 3 dogs Goodo's under the fence. It was a minute gap and my fear was not the dog/s biting the fingers, but if the child got a fright and pulled back the metal fence could have caused damage my dogs would have been blamed for.

Sorry but the blame lies with the 8 yo and the supervising adult.

[Podengo]

Why would you let a child out on the street if you can't teach it to keep its hands out of strangers properties? Surely by that stage you can teach them things like "don't get into strangers cars" "don't put your hands into strangers properties" "don't take candy from strangers".

[Rascalmyshadow]

I can't believe people are blaming the victim once again.An 8 year old child .You can tell kids not to do something and guess what sometimes they do it anyway because they are kids not adults.

It is about time people stopped breeding and owning aggressive dogs,Society needs stable human friendly pets; not ones that maim and kill.

Seriously???

An 8 year old is not a toddler and should know better. What if the kid was poking the dog with a stick or had teased the dogs in the past.

The dogs are the victims not the child.

My house is double gated with locks, 6ft fences etc bit like Fort Knox, yet years ago my next door neighbours stupid teenage son thought he'd jump my fence to retrieve his football, didn't make it back before he had my male st poodles jaws wrapped around his leg, left multiple very deep puncture wounds. Oh and my dog was a very social boy under normal circumstances.

Laws have become so bad my kids are not allowed to have friends at our house with the exception of two of my neighbours kids, not worth the risk of losing one of my dogs if a brat doesn't listen.

[BarbedWire]

Some posters don't seem to appreciate the enormity of what has happened. The child could live for another 72 years, a long time to be without a hand, and it was probably the dominant one. I knew a young man who had lost his hand in a work accident. Instead of a hand he had a hook. I used to wonder what it would be like being intimate with a man with a hook. Poor guy! Poor child!

Also poor dog, poor owners, poor parents, and poor any spectators.

[Lhok]

I understand the enormity of it, no one wants a child to be left maim for life.

But there also has to be some personal responsibility here as well. Having one adult to supervise eight children playing in a street is more then a bit dumb to me. Also teaching children they can't go where ever they want and do whatever they want and to look after themselves by teaching them to think before they act can't hurt either.

Yes at eight years old I did dumb stuff but never would I have approached dogs behind a fence my parents drilled it into me that dogs bite and even though I love dogs and was completely wanting to go pat every dog I saw I knew that dogs bit and to stay away from dogs I didn't know.

--Lhok

Edited August 31, 2015 by Lhok

[Animal House]

An 8 year old might have had no experience with dogs, still a child, and probably saw the dogs nose sticking out under the fence and went for a pat.

This is the fence apparently, there is a communal footpath, that's where the kids were playing supervised by an adult, but 6 kids all playing are hard to keep track of no doubt.

And the blurb for those who can't access the link

Newcastle City police duty officer Inspector Gerard Lawson said the girl was on the street, playing in a cul-de-sac with other children, when she put her arm underneath a fence to pat one of the three Alaskan malamutes that lived there.

One of dogs then bit the girl, leaving her with severe injuries.

''There were other children in the area playing, under supervision of an adult,'' Inspector Lawson said.

''An investigation has been launched by Lake Macquarie City Council rangers and they're being assisted by Lake Macquarie detectives.

''At no time has it been suggested the dog was out of its yard.''

Neighbours said the girl did not live in the street but visited often to play with friends who did.

They said the girl and her little sister were on a play date with around six friends in the early afternoon when the kids went up a public path beside the house where the dog lived and the 8-year-old put her hand under the fence.

It's believed the children saw what happened.<br data-cke-eol="1">

A neighbour heard screaming and helped to comfort the shaken children and the girl's sister, who was in ''a terrible state'', until their parents were called.

On Sunday, no one was home at the house where the dogs lived and the backyard was empty.

There were wooden sleepers underneath the house's rear Colorbond fence, but one had fallen over, leaving a space large enough to put a hand through.

It's believed all three animals were taken away by council rangers.

A former neighbour posted on Facebook the dog was usually well-behaved with young children.

''I have grown up playing with this dog who has bitten her hand and it has been fine with every other kid on the street,'' Laura Garside said.

A spokeswoman for Lake Macquarie City Council said rangers were continuing their investigations into the incident on Sunday.

A crime scene was set up at the house after the attack on Saturday afternoon, but it was not still active on Sunday.<br data-cke-eol="1">

[Carita]

There's a photo of the fence in this link My link. The gap the child had to go out of her way to even climb an embankment & low retaining wall to protrude through that fence.

3 dogs on one side of a high metal fence with 8 children on the other... I bet those dogs were feeling tormented

This region is rife with Sydney funnel web & red back spiders so why hasn't that child been educated in reaching through such ideal conditions

[Rascalmyshadow]

How much more secure does a dog have to be?

Doesn't take much to do serious damage to a small hand.

[Little Gifts]

Seeing that gap makes me realise we need to be vigilant to check our fence lines regularly for things our doggies might be getting up to when we are not home. The gap in that pic is a getting to a risky size particularly as it leads into a thoroughfare.

Kids do dumb stuff. Hell even adults do dumb stuff. You can teach and you can tell and you can supervise but still stupid things with bad consequences happen. This really seems like an actual accident with no clear neglect. Sure the supervising adult could have done better and sure the dog owners could have patched up that gap earlier but apportioning blame solely on the dogs or the child will not stop a random accident of a similar nature happening to another child. We need to all do the best we can to keep children and pets safe, learn and change where there are learnings to be had from events of this nature but also accept accidents can and do happen. I wouldn't like to see those dogs put down for this anymore than I am happy a child lost her hand this way.

[Jemmy]

Seeing that gap makes me realise we need to be vigilant to check our fence lines regularly for things our doggies might be getting up to when we are not home. The gap in that pic is a getting to a risky size particularly as it leads into a thoroughfare.

Kids do dumb stuff. Hell even adults do dumb stuff. You can teach and you can tell and you can supervise but still stupid things with bad consequences happen. This really seems like an actual accident with no clear neglect. Sure the supervising adult could have done better and sure the dog owners could have patched up that gap earlier but apportioning blame solely on the dogs or the child will not stop a random accident of a similar nature happening to another child. We need to all do the best we can to keep children and pets safe, learn and change where there are learnings to be had from events of this nature but also accept accidents can and do happen. I wouldn't like to see those dogs put down for this anymore than I am happy a child lost her hand this way.

You've summed up my feelings as well.

[Purdie]

I can't believe people are blaming the victim once again.An 8 year old child .You can tell kids not to do something and guess what sometimes they do it anyway because they are kids not adults.

It is about time people stopped breeding and owning aggressive dogs,Society needs stable human friendly pets; not ones that maim and kill.

So if a kid runs out into the road and gets knocked down by a car is that the car driver's fault? Yes kids do things they shouldn't but that doesn't mean they aren't to blame for the consequences.

Adults should be watching that children do not run on the road or go near strange dogs; but accidents can still happen in the blink of the eye.

[Purdie]

Seeing that gap makes me realise we need to be vigilant to check our fence lines regularly for things our doggies might be getting up to when we are not home. The gap in that pic is a getting to a risky size particularly as it leads into a thoroughfare.

Kids do dumb stuff. Hell even adults do dumb stuff. You can teach and you can tell and you can supervise but still stupid things with bad consequences happen. This really seems like an actual accident with no clear neglect. Sure the supervising adult could have done better and sure the dog owners could have patched up that gap earlier but apportioning blame solely on the dogs or the child will not stop a random accident of a similar nature happening to another child. We need to all do the best we can to keep children and pets safe, learn and change where there are learnings to be had from events of this nature but also accept accidents can and do happen. I wouldn't like to see those dogs put down for this anymore than I am happy a child lost her hand this way.

A most sensible post .

[Amax-1]

Mmmm, I'm not actually sure how I feel about this. A dog that would bite a human's hand to the point that the hand couldn't be saved? That's pretty extreme no matter what the circumstances.

The dog would have smelled "human" through a fence, a small hand under a fence is unlikely to be interpreted as a major threat by a stable dog. Perhaps this dog should have been better contained.

Familiarity with human interaction dilutes aggression towards humans, but a dog doesn't have a sensory inhibition to bite because someone is human or a child. Dog aggressive dogs can be fine with a another dog they live with, yet tear a random dog apart given the opportunity, so the dog in this instance may have bitten from either prey drive or territorial aggression albeit a human hand under the fence didn't belong in the dog's territory.

[Simply Grand]

Mmmm, I'm not actually sure how I feel about this. A dog that would bite a human's hand to the point that the hand couldn't be saved? That's pretty extreme no matter what the circumstances.

The dog would have smelled "human" through a fence, a small hand under a fence is unlikely to be interpreted as a major threat by a stable dog. Perhaps this dog should have been better contained.

Familiarity with human interaction dilutes aggression towards humans, but a dog doesn't have a sensory inhibition to bite because someone is human or a child. Dog aggressive dogs can be fine with a another dog they live with, yet tear a random dog apart given the opportunity, so the dog in this instance may have bitten from either prey drive or territorial aggression albeit a human hand under the fence didn't belong in the dog's territory.

Yes, I understand that, and that is what concerns me. If a dog doesn't, as a result of its breeding and socialisation, have the inhibition not to inflict a serious bite on a human hand under a fence then I think it probably is a dog that needs to be more carefully contained.

[Salukifan]

You know, a few years back on this forum I'd have analysed and debated about what happened with the best of them.

Now I just think its a tragedy. For the child, her family and the owners of the dogs. Their lives will never be the same.

And the other kids who witnessed it. They'll be traumatised too.

[cavNrott]

Making excuses for people doing stupid things is an Australian curse and has led to a generation of half wits. The blame belongs to the parents and the child plain and simple.

The wisest thing I've read in this thread.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

Unfortunately it all comes down to education and supervision, both of which are all too lacking these days.

I don't blame the dog for this, it was in it's own yard doing nothing wrong.

I feel very sorry for the little girl and her family and for all concerned, it's a horrific result of her making a mistake that should not have happened.

I hope it doesn't colour her feeling about all dogs for the rest of her days.

[Angelina]

I have 2 dogs, and I love them dearly

but if they are capable of this type of aggression, I am sorry, its just not safe

Regardless, if I have them locked up or whatever.

I do not want to be responsible for the severe injury to a child like this.

sometimes, things happen, a child may not make the best judgement, but your dog should not react in that way. If it does, it should not be in suburbia.

[megan_]

Mmmm, I'm not actually sure how I feel about this. A dog that would bite a human's hand to the point that the hand couldn't be saved? That's pretty extreme no matter what the circumstances.

The dog would have smelled "human" through a fence, a small hand under a fence is unlikely to be interpreted as a major threat by a stable dog. Perhaps this dog should have been better contained.

I agree with this

Prey drive could have triggered the attack. However, the owners do bear some responsibility because of the gaps in the fence. All dogs should be safely contained, especially if the fence line is near the road/footpath. This is especially true if you have a breed that is known to have a high prey drive.