brightstar123 Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Any advice about breaking this habit? I have a 6mth old female pup here right now that has learned (elsewhere) to pee in her crate. I'm taking her out every hour during the day and after meals or play and also waking up at 1am, 3am, 4am, 5am, 7am to take her out in the night. She usually pees at least once between those times and lies in it, as well as peeing outside. She doesn't make a sound or let us know she needs to go. When she has peed on the floorboards it can be just 20min after she has gone outside and again she gives no warning that I can see - no sniffing, pacing, circling etc. I don't have her roaming around the house when she is inside - she is in one room with me. I have noticed outside that she will often go twice in 5min as it seems like the first time she doesn't really go properly. She gets lots of praise for going outside and has a toilet command. They are usually pretty small wees as she is going all the time (doesn't have a UTI though, I checked). Basically she doesn't ever try to hold but nor does she drip/leak urine either. I have tried taking away the water at 7pm and putting food/treats etc in the crate too. It is a pretty small crate as well. She has no bedding because she eats it. She is otherwise a sweet pup and seems to be responding to training very well. I'm not so worried about the accidents in the house as that seems quite normal but the peeing in the crate is more concerning to me and it's becoming quite gruelling trying to get up enough to prevent it (whinge whinge whinge!) It think that's about it - any advice very welcome. Also any tips for removing/reducing the smell of urine in her coat without getting her too wet (long coated breed) would be great, as I can't completely wash and dry her all the time obviously. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 leave her out of a crate? use a larger pen instead, where she has a CHOICE of substrates ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRG Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 She should not need to go to the toilet as often as that. Has she been neutered? Maybe she has a problem and should be seen by a vet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brightstar123 Posted August 4, 2015 Author Share Posted August 4, 2015 leave her out of a crate? use a larger pen instead, where she has a CHOICE of substrates ? I did think about that and try it (at night) but anything I put in apart from indestructible toys gets shredded and eaten. What kind of substrates did you have in mind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brightstar123 Posted August 4, 2015 Author Share Posted August 4, 2015 She should not need to go to the toilet as often as that. Has she been neutered? Maybe she has a problem and should be seen by a vet. Yes I agree. No, she is entire. She has had a full vet exam including urinalysis and urine culture. Of course she could have a congenital/anatomical defect, she hasn't had any imaging to rule that out yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 What was she kept on /in before coming to you ? Where did she sleep /toilet? i am of the opinion that certain sensory things can trigger toileting - smells , the feel of different surfaces on feet , times, even temperatures ....or being under cover as opposed to a big sky ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 ..perhaps it's a hormone rush? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRG Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 When do you feed her? Maybe just feed in the morning and then restrict her access to water later in the day, and a brisk walk before bed making sure she is stimulated to toilet by the exercise. I agree with Perse about sensory simulation, so make sure she gets a good run on grass and other surfaces (eg cold concrete) before bed time. Make life easier for yourself by removing all bedding and let her shred some newspaper seeing that she likes to do that - it will also soak up any urine for you. re her coat - give her a good rub with a moist towel soaked in a mixture of hot water and oil of eucalyptus and squeezed dry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brightstar123 Posted August 4, 2015 Author Share Posted August 4, 2015 She is getting fed twice a day since she is still quite young, I could try once a day I suppose. What time would you remove the water? She does go out and have a good run around outside (grass/concrete) before bed and she always reliably pees before bed too. The problem with the newspaper is that she will actually swallow lots of it. Previously she was penned outside on concrete and grass and also crated - I do know that she toileted in the crate. Thanks for the tip re the eucalyptus oil :) I really don't expect her to be perfect as I know it's a big change and she needs to learn about being inside a house and where to go. What worries me is the number of times she is going and that she can't seem to or doesn't try to hold overnight in her bed. I haven't really encountered that before without there being a medical reason, so I was wondering if anyone has seen anything similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascalmyshadow Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 (edited) Is she a very small breed? If she is I would give her a bit more time, if she isn't I would be quite concerned, I have had a similar situation once. We bought an Airedale pup from a registered breeder within a week I started to suspect something was wrong due to how often he was weeing, vets thought I was being over the top and told me to give him time to mature, fast forward to 5 months old we ended up seeing a specialist and found out his urethra and ureters (I think that's correct) were not connected to his bladder, he was also going into renal failure because his kidneys were abnormal, we were advised to PTS as there was nothing the vets could do. Edited August 4, 2015 by Rascalmyshadow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 Sounds very odd! I would be videoing pup in the crate and seeing if she is actively peeing or leaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 Sounds like a combination of nerves & not knowing where or how she is supposed to go, given her previous lifestyle. If she has no bedding in her crate the cold could add to the problem, even people pee more when they are cold. I wouldn't restrict water for an animal at all & doubt it makes much difference as she will only drink what she needs anyway. I would also try her crate inside a large puppy pen with a piece of fake grass, puppy pad or something at the opposite side to her bed so at least she has another option of somewhere to go. Re soiling her coat you could try baby wipes but if its a lot I would cut her short for now. Maybe its just all a matter of time for her to settle down, some take longer than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRG Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 How big is her crate? Puppies brought up outside on concrete tend to tiddle when they feel like it, so, if the crate is too big, she will view it like a pen and not get the idea that it is her bed and bed means sleep. Ofcourse she might be doing it to get your attention, in which case, I would not be getting up 5 times a night to let her out and clean her bed. Tough love might be the answer. Note, I did not say to take the water away completely, just empty the bowl and leave only a small amount in there so as to restrict the amount she can drink after say 7pm but only if you are not feeding her later in the day. Some dogs will just drink until the bowl is empty - for the hell of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brightstar123 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Share Posted August 5, 2015 Is she a very small breed? If she is I would give her a bit more time, if she isn't I would be quite concerned, I have had a similar situation once. We bought an Airedale pup from a registered breeder within a week I started to suspect something was wrong due to how often he was weeing, vets thought I was being over the top and told me to give him time to mature, fast forward to 5 months old we ended up seeing a specialist and found out his urethra and ureters (I think that's correct) were not connected to his bladder, he was also going into renal failure because his kidneys were abnormal, we were advised to PTS as there was nothing the vets could do. Unfortunately she is a medium to large breed, so I agree, I am a bit concerned. She could well have a congenital defect. So sorry to hear about your pup Sounds very odd! I would be videoing pup in the crate and seeing if she is actively peeing or leaking. Very odd! Great idea about the video. I just assumed she wasn't leaking at night as she squats normally during the day. But you never know. Last night she stayed dry but I got up at midnight, 2am, 4am, 6am... sigh! How big is her crate? Puppies brought up outside on concrete tend to tiddle when they feel like it, so, if the crate is too big, she will view it like a pen and not get the idea that it is her bed and bed means sleep. Of course she might be doing it to get your attention, in which case, I would not be getting up 5 times a night to let her out and clean her bed. Tough love might be the answer. Note, I did not say to take the water away completely, just empty the bowl and leave only a small amount in there so as to restrict the amount she can drink after say 7pm but only if you are not feeding her later in the day. Some dogs will just drink until the bowl is empty - for the hell of it It doesn't feel like she is attention-seeking, she is generally quiet and asleep when I get up to let her out at night and goes back to bed quite happily. But I know what you mean, I feel like I am not helping the problem by taking her out every 5 min as she is not learning to hold. If I don't though, she goes inside Yes I only gave her a little water last night after 7pm so maybe that helped, although she doesn't appear to be a 'big drinker', I don't know where it all comes from :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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