jfletcher Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 Hi, Just looking for some advice, we picked up our now 9 week old Shih Tzu pup last week. He was smaller than the rest of the litter and most likely to be the runt, which we knew. We understood that his breathing was a little heavy & he was congested but after a trip to the vet last night, we found that he has a case of Cleft Palate at the back of his mouth/throat. It took three attempts with a Torch to find it. Based off images of other cases, his doesn't seem as severe, the split is quite small in comparison. He is underweight but he seems to be fine for whats expected of his size and breathing circumstances. We are going to bottle feed him, and attempt different foods. We are waiting to here back from the vet to find out about surgery, but just wanted to see what the general opinion is about whats best for the pup. Most cases I have read, the pups are only days old & PTS, Hercules is already 9 weeks old and no one has picked up on it til now, he plays, eats(not enough but eats), sleeps and has a beautiful personality. Please help me and share your opinion and advice. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretel Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 Have you spoken to his breeder? I don't think bottle feeding is necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeimMe Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 It sounds like a lot to take on...are you sure the breeder won't offer you another pup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 One of my dogs has a cleft palate, although the cleft is to one side and comes forward to the front of the mouth, it also doesn't completely communicate with the nasal passage. If food is not getting stuck and liquids don't come out his nostrils when he drinks, he may be OK. Sometimes you can close the cleft surgically, although it is tricky surgery. If your Vet hasn't done many it may be a good idea to seek a specialist opinion although it sounds as though they are doing that. Be guided by them as to the course of action. I bought my pup with full disclosure, on the understanding that pet insurance won't cover congenital conditions so I have been out of pocket for 2 corrective surgery attempts but I don't mind at all, she is an awesome dog. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 I would be sending pup back and asking for refund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 If the pup can have surgery or expect to live a quality life, able to eat & drink without the need for tubes etc & will not suffer any malnutrition, dietry deficiencies leading to other problems etc then maybe it will be ok. If not euthanised is the kind thing to do. Your vet will advise you. Write a list of questions you need to ask so you don't forget when you go. The breeder should offer you a refund or another puppy. Contact the Office Of fair Trading for advice of your rights & then you can quote them to the breeder if they are not obliging or understanding about this. It gets complex if you want to keep the puppy. The breeder may refund or give you another puppy & want that one back however given the circumstances & obvious genetic fault I cannot see why they would want puppy back. Was the pup from a registered breeder ? that is registered with Dogs NSW, not council permit. If so maybe phone them for advice too if not happy with breeder response. The main thing is what is best for the puppy long term. Hard to part with them when they are so cute but it may have to be. Best of luck with it all. Very sad for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*kirty* Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 What do you mean when you say he is congested? This pup sounds like he will need airway surgery as well as the palate surgery. If he is skinny and struggling to breathe, how is his quality of life? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 How sad for you the breeder needs to be told immediately . Bottle feeding? if pup was smaller while breast feeding - then a bottle won't really help, IMO. Please -- don't let your heart rule your head - get a very thorough check of this pup - how is his eating/breathing going to cope as he grows ... will he be able to run /cope with hot weather ...will he be at a big risk of infections? Will he possibly get food into his airway , and maybe get aspiration pneumonia??? These are things you NEED to think about - the poor puppy should have been thoroughly checked before sale - the breeder has let you, and him, down. he should not have been rehomed with congestion, and /or breathing problems :( Thinking of you .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfletcher Posted June 1, 2015 Author Share Posted June 1, 2015 Hi guys, Thank you for all your replies, I really appreciate the feedback. We are going to the specialist tomorrow to see what they can do for Hercules, and how severe it is. I am yet to talk to the breeder, honestly I wouldn't mind the refund because it could go towards his surgery, but I wouldn't want to give him back or get another puppy in exchange, I chose him for a reason, and I am a sucker for the little ones. We have been boiling chicken breast and he seems to eat that a lot easier, less sneezing, less runny noses, overall more happy from what we have gathered. I think his diet will play a big part, and depending on what the specialists say tomorrow we will decide what's best for him, not for us. We are already in love with him and attached, so fingers crossed & positive thoughts! Thanks again :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 Sorry, just picking one thing here. Is the boiled chicken all he's getting? For a couple of days until you get him to the specialist and get an idea of what's going on it'll be OK if this is all he gets, long term it's a really bad diet for a growing pup. All the best with whatever you decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessicaM Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 I would DEFINITELY tell the breeder immediately! I would want to know of one of my pups had one, of he is from a registered breeder they might have had another in the past and offer help and advice. The breeders should/will be able to help you along the way. Make sure you speak to them before you book any surgery, they might require their own vet to go over and make a conclusion of the refund. And yes he is still a growing puppy and will need a good balanced diet, not just boiled chicken it wouldn't be good for him in the long run. ☺ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretel Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 I would DEFINITELY tell the breeder immediately! I would want to know of one of my pups had one, of he is from a registered breeder they might have had another in the past and offer help and advice. The breeders should/will be able to help you along the way. Make sure you speak to them before you book any surgery, they might require their own vet to go over and make a conclusion of the refund. And yes he is still a growing puppy and will need a good balanced diet, not just boiled chicken it wouldn't be good for him in the long run. ☺ Couldn't agree more! Please contact the breeder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jed Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 Yes, do let the breeder know. But- surely anyone breeding dogs would know enough to check for cleft palates ---- or their vet would. Perhaps they knew all along. It is difficult to close clefts at the back of the mouth, according to the specialist advice I had, as the stitches tend to tear away. However if the pup has managed for 9 weeks, he may manage for a lifetime with no lessening of quality of life with some special care. Good luck with Hercules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfletcher Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 Sorry, just picking one thing here. Is the boiled chicken all he's getting? For a couple of days until you get him to the specialist and get an idea of what's going on it'll be OK if this is all he gets, long term it's a really bad diet for a growing pup. All the best with whatever you decide. No, not only boiled chicken, he has kibble and some wet food as well, we mix it up as much as we can. The chicken just goes down the best without complications. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfletcher Posted June 3, 2015 Author Share Posted June 3, 2015 I did speak with the breeder and told her the scenario, she didn't know he had it and wasn't overally concerned, she said she is not having any more litters and will no longer breed pups. I didn't ask for the refund, it would of been a pointless conversation and I don't like conflict, and that's fine with me. We want Hercules, perfect or not, so it's not going to matter what the breeder says. Hercules met with the specialist yesterday, they said it isn't as severe as most cases, actually best case scenario for this condition, he needs more time to develop and in a couple of months have a look again for surgery. His heart & lungs are all good, he is healthy for his size, he just needs to catch up. Thanks guys :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 That is sounding positive :) Do we get photos of the cutie in question??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I think it's really sad that you've bought a defective puppy - and the breeder isn't concerned, hasn't offered to help with the vet bills or a partial refund or something. Doesn't seem right to me that the breeder gets rewarded for providing a car with a broken engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JessicaM Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 (edited) I think it's really sad that you've bought a defective puppy - and the breeder isn't concerned, hasn't offered to help with the vet bills or a partial refund or something. Doesn't seem right to me that the breeder gets rewarded for providing a car with a broken engine. I would be incredibly upset that I sold a defective pup to a new pet owner, although i might not offer a refund if the pup was to have no ill life problems, I would be interested in vet reports and offer some sort of concern to the new buyers. I do strive to be helpful, approachable and friendly as possible. Glad he should be ok, hopenyounhave a blast with your puppy. Edited June 3, 2015 by JessicaM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 How can you blame a breeder when puppy buyers won't return a puppy for a refund or a replacement ? You can't have it both ways. Shame on any breeder who knowingly sells a puppy with an issue. In this case the new owner should cut their losses and return the pup to the breeder for a full refund and look elsewhere for a puppy that is in good health and has had the best start to life. It doesn't guarantee things won't go wrong, as illness and injury happen to all animals but at least they aren't pushing it up hill from the get go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YippeeGirl Posted June 3, 2015 Share Posted June 3, 2015 I think the issue is, most people want to keep the puppy they purchased. I mean it's not a faulty television. You do get attached, and I imagine for some dogs, a return to their breeder equals immediate euthanasia or being flogged off to some other unsuspecting buyer. My dog has hip dysplasia, and even if I had known the day after she was purchased, I would not have returned her to the breeder. I personally have always been interested as to what would be the breeder's solution if the puppy is returned? The only possible outcomes I can see are that the breeder will have to pay the medical costs for the puppy, the puppy is rehomed, or the puppy is put to sleep. I can understand the last option if it's about quality of life, but what about an issue like hip dysplasia? The OP sounds like a very diligent pet owner. I wish them the best of luck with their puppy, and it's a real shame they are forced to deal with this problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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