Greyhound Carcasses Found In Bundaberg Bushland

[HazyWal]

Labadore you are wrong, greyhound racing was established in this country long before the 60's. If you are going to question peoples knowledge it's best to arm yourself with some facts. m-j has worked many years in the industry, if you listen you may learn.

Modern Greyhound Racing Commences in Australia 1927

In Australia racing with a mechanical lure, often called the “tin hare” began in 1927 when the Lang Labour government amended the Gaming and Betting Act to allow legal wagering. The Greyhound Coursing Association was formed and the first race took place at Epping (later known as Harold Park) on 18 May.

While horse racing was generally a pastime for the wealthy, Greyhound racing attracted the working class man due to the low admission charges, ability to place small bets and the timings of races which were often at night and suited their leisure hours. It created much opposition from the conservative and religious elements of the population against public gambling.

[Rebanne]

My ex racing dog was put into GAP by his owners, they visited us once and told me how my dogs brother had "gone to live on a farm". They had their young daughter with them. There was no farm. Why save one but not the other???

[labadore]

Labadore you are wrong, greyhound racing was established in this country long before the 60's. If you are going to question peoples knowledge it's best to arm yourself with some facts. m-j has worked many years in the industry, if you listen you may learn.

Modern Greyhound Racing Commences in Australia 1927

In Australia racing with a mechanical lure, often called the “tin hare” began in 1927 when the Lang Labour government amended the Gaming and Betting Act to allow legal wagering. The Greyhound Coursing Association was formed and the first race took place at Epping (later known as Harold Park) on 18 May.

While horse racing was generally a pastime for the wealthy, Greyhound racing attracted the working class man due to the low admission charges, ability to place small bets and the timings of races which were often at night and suited their leisure hours. It created much opposition from the conservative and religious elements of the population against public gambling.

My apologies, should have said The Australian Greyhound Racing Association was established in 1960's and I will amend my other post accordingly. Thanks :)

[Maddy]

My ex racing dog was put into GAP by his owners, they visited us once and told me how my dogs brother had "gone to live on a farm". They had their young daughter with them. There was no farm. Why save one but not the other???

Perhaps they knew he would not be a suitable pet?

[SkySoaringMagpie]

And there is something magnificent about watching a dog, any dog, do exactly what it is designed and bred to do. I don't like the industry, but racing does allow these dogs to run in a relatively safe environment. And they are glorious when they do.

Racing on a track behind a mechanical lure is only 100 or so years old. Greyhounds were bred as hunters, that is their purpose, not racing. Racing is the outlet for their instincts.

The industry has some issues that will never be cleaned up as long as the gambling revenues are relied upon by state governments IMO. I would rather see options for dogs to course and/or race that have no money attached. Yes ego by itself can be damaging for dogs, but not nearly so severe as when it involves a lot of cash. I am particularly hoping that we will see Greys at lure coursing as it gets off the ground because as Rebanne says, a lot of people don't realise that they were originally a coursing/hunting dog, not a racer.

[Sabbath]

I would like to see the argument FOR greyhound racing. What exactly does it do that we need. Need it so much that it's legal and sponsored and defended.

Speaking only for myself, I'd prefer it was simply a hobby dog sport. So it's no longer an 'industry' with an association with gambling and high levels of financial pressures riding on the dogs' backs. Just specialty lure-coursing attracting owners who love the breed doing what they can mostly do so well ... run.

But that's Pollyanna-ish. Billions of dollars of revenue from betting on greyhounds is generated each year just in one state, NSW. Lot of vested interests.

Yep, this I could get on board with. I'm all for dog sport! I just can't see this industry as anything we need. I do love seeing dogs perform a task. I do love a well conditioned dog going to work. I just don't like commercial interests ruling the treatment of these poor dogs.

[Steve]

m-j all dog owners already have laws and by-laws in place regarding the care of their dogs. Registered businesses that accommodate or breed animals would also be subject to additional laws/by-laws. If they were a member of a key organisation regarding the breed of dog or commercial industry the dog was part of there would also be more conditions they had agreed to with membership. So the issue is not the percentage of people who are doing the right thing but the number of people who are blatantly doing the wrong thing. They are the ones ruining it for everyone and these dogs are paying the ultimate price for it.

And as far as an industry goes, how is it morally ok with anyone that a healthy animal is killed simply because it can't run fast? Where has this industry set up proper rehoming options for the hundreds/thousands of dogs that they know don't make the cut each year? The rescue stories regarding greys are often appalling. They clearly don't have any value to a lot of owners and trainers if they can't make them any money. This is a very different scenario to normal canine breeding situations where those that don't meet purpose go to pet only homes - they don't take them off somewhere and shoot them. And do you really think those dogs couldn't sense fear in that paddock? They didn't just take one or two at a time. There were 55 there! They could probably already smell the decay of other canines!

Laws, culture and consequences have not worked with alcohol either. Go for a walk at club closing time or visit an ER on a Saturday night and see the damage people are doing to themselves and others. The amount of crimes committed under the influence of alcohol is also staggering. And this costs our communities more money than the alcohol industry makes. Laws do not make greedy people suddenly good people.

Dogs are PTS everyday by their owners for all sorts of reasons ,working dogs which don't do the job well enough have a similar fate. Ive personally met registered breeders who have killed puppies they don't want to keep for breeding or showing rather than have to advertise them. Bumping them off for reasons other people don't think are valid or moral wont ever be stopped whilst ever they are our property and we get to choose.

[m-j]

I would like to see the argument FOR greyhound racing. What exactly does it do that we need. Need it so much that it's legal and sponsored and defended.

The dogs are doing something they really love to do everyday. Not many dogs can claim they get to do that. If the human's attitude to that dog is one of racing as a hobby and that person is accountable (accountable being they need to rehome the dog when it has finished racing and have high regard for the dog's welfare until it is) why would it be different to any other sport?

Laws, culture and consequences have not worked with alcohol either. Go for a walk at club closing time or visit an ER on a Saturday night and see the damage people are doing to themselves and others. The amount of crimes committed under the influence of alcohol is also staggering. And this costs our communities more money than the alcohol industry makes. Laws do not make greedy people suddenly good people.

Yes it has!!! I have worked in pubs for 35 yrs when I first started the publicans attitude was sell sell sell, now it is sell with caution. I'm quite happy to oblige as I don't want to cop an $11,000 fine, plus in the past I have been the victim of alcohol fuelled violence. The only stats that I know of are in the seventies pre alcohol laws there were 10,000,000 cars on the road in Australia and 4 times the amount of alcohol related deaths on the roads than there is now. At a guess there might be 10,000,000 cars on the road in Sydney and Melbourne alone these days. If the alcohol is monitored and policed you don't have the issues you mentioned, unfortunately alcohol consumed at home cannot be monitored and some publicans are greedy or desperate (these laws have killed many small pubs). Drugs are a contributing factor to the violence and crimes committed by drunk people also. A girlfriend of mine who is a nurse in an Er unit told me this.

The greyhound racing industry culture will NEVER change to the standards the community in this day and age expect. To do that would mean they would need to put the welfare of the greyhounds above all else and that is just not going to happen. Greyhound racing was established in Australia in the 1960's and it is still stuck in this time warp with outdated practices and policies. They have had over 50 years to significantly improve the welfare of the greyhounds and they have failed miserably in doing this. They are only making noises about changing things now that they are firmly and squarely in the spotlight. Once the spotlight goes away, they will return to what they have always been doing.

The spotlight shouldn't go away, as I have mentioned in the other thread on this topic it should be policed by an independent body with owners, breeders, trainers and the TAB and bookies should be financing it for all racing. This would weed out the greedy and unethical. It may well end the industry but at least it will be a slow death and lives of many dogs would be saved unlike if the industry comes to an abrupt end.

3000 greyhounds were killed each year in the NSW racing industry. You can almost guarantee the number is double of what was admitted and that is in NSW only.

Does anyone know the stats of dogs euthanized in pounds each year? I feel pretty confident the stats would be higher than for Greyhounds and they are the ones we know about. I have rehomed non greys and have an ACD in my yard at the moment that were going to be shot, they weren't going to make it to the pound to become a stat either and I'm sure they aren't the only ones.

[Sabbath]

I would like to see the argument FOR greyhound racing. What exactly does it do that we need. Need it so much that it's legal and sponsored and defended.

The dogs are doing something they really love to do everyday. Not many dogs can claim they get to do that. If the human's attitude to that dog is one of racing as a hobby and that person is accountable (accountable being they need to rehome the dog when it has finished racing and have high regard for the dog's welfare until it is) why would it be different to any other sport?

Sure they love running/racing but you can't convince me that trainers or owners have the dogs enjoyment of running at heart. If there was no money involved, you think many trainers would do it? Most other dog sports COST the owners money, not make it. I have previously stated I like dog sport. Also greyhound racing is an industry, not a hobby.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Sabbath

[HollyMilo]

Bundaberg Greyhound Club Trainer of the Year 2013.

http://www.news-mail.com.au/news/greyhound-trainer-put-notice-rspca/2596500/

BUNDABERG horse and greyhound trainer Narelle Mulcahy's Bundaberg property has been visted by RSPCA officers in the region investigating the gruesome discovery of 55 greyhound carcasses at Coonarr.

RSPCA spokesman Michael Beatty confirmed RSPCA investigators visited the property of a trainer again yesterday.

"The greyhound trainer was issued with a number of welfare directions in regard to animals on the property," he said.

The directions were in relation to animals including horses, greyhounds and poultry, kept on the property of the Bundaberg Greyhound Club trainer of the year 2013.

While it is believed police are still investigating the discovery of the dead greyhounds at the Vera Scarth-Johnson Wildflower Reserve on Wednesday, the NewsMail understands it will be difficult to bring animal cruelty charges against those believed to be involved, unless it can be proven the dogs were inhumanely killed.

Bundaberg greyhound trainer/owner/breeder Ron Brook said the investigation should be left up to the RSPCA, Queensland Police and Racing Queensland and any speculation until those finding were finalised wasn't helpful.

"The industry has had a lot of criticism levelled at it recently, some justified some unjustified," he said.

He urged people to remember that people were presumed innocent until found guilty and said there was a process that needed to be followed.

Mr Brook said he hoped the industry would come out the other end of everything that has happen in recent times a lot better off.

Bundaberg Greyhound Club president Stephen Bland said the club was yet to discuss the ramifications of the find at Coonarr and said they would wait for finding of the autopsies to get a clear picture of what had occurred.

He said as far as he was aware injured, sick or old greyhounds should be euthanised by a vet and he had no idea anyone in the Bundaberg industry was using any other method.

"Queensland Racing has to be informed on the death of a dog and the reason why, should it be badly injured, sickness or old age," he said.

"I've still got my original racing dogs and they'll hang around the house until they are old and die."

Mr Bland said the one dog Ms Mulcahy had running in tomorrow's meet, had been scratched.

Police issued charges in relation to the greyhound carcasses on Thursday night with the 64-year-old woman being charged with one count each of unlawful possession of a firearm and obstruct police after a search warrant executed at a Bundaberg residence allegedly located a rifle and ammunition.

A 71-year-old Bundaberg man was also charged with the unlawful possession of a firearm.

The pair was released on bail on Thursday night to appear in the Bundaberg Magistrates Court on May 1.

Edited April 3, 2015 by HollyMilo

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

I would like to see the argument FOR greyhound racing. What exactly does it do that we need. Need it so much that it's legal and sponsored and defended.

The dogs are doing something they really love to do everyday. Not many dogs can claim they get to do that. If the human's attitude to that dog is one of racing as a hobby and that person is accountable (accountable being they need to rehome the dog when it has finished racing and have high regard for the dog's welfare until it is) why would it be different to any other sport?

Sure they love running/racing but you can't convince me that trainers or owners have the dogs enjoyment of running at heart. If there was no money involved, you think many trainers would do it? Most other dog sports COST the owners money, not make it. I have previously stated I like dog sport. Also greyhound racing is an industry, not a hobby.

Not all trainers are the same. Some (many) see their greyhounds as part of their family. The same as most of us who train and compete in agility sports. There are also lure coursing clubs that are for not-greyhounds but any kind of dog that wants to run. There's no money to be made doing that, no TAB betting, and the participants pay for the equipment and ground hire and there's some risk of vet expenses if the dog injures themselves making a bad turn. So it's not about profit.

My dog loves to run flat out and chase things (usually me), total joy and can we do it again please... eg if we're practicing start line stays the only thing she wants is permission to run. It trumps even food treats. She's sorely disappointed if she gets a treat for her stay instead of to run and chase.

You make a sweeping generalisation saying all greyhound trainers are in it only for the money. It might be true of the horrible person who dumped 55 dead dogs in the park (they should get done for toxic waste dumping if nothing else).

But if every slow greyhound was dealt with this way - there would be a lot more.

I think I remember a couple of years ago - some NSW dog pound officer got into trouble for taking the unwanted dogs to the nearest country rubbish tip and shooting them dead there and dumping them. That was cruel and stupid too, and he saved money in vet and green dream drug costs but he didn't actually get to pocket any of that saving.

Cruel treatment of animals is not always about profit. And making money from animals is not always about cruelty.

I think if greyhound racing got banned, then so might agility, obedience (I actually see people beating up their dogs at obedience competiions and training - it's horrible), and lure coursing, earth dog, tracking...

And then there would be more bored barking dogs because we're not allowed to train the dogs to do what they were bred to do - or an approximation of it?

[Sabbath]

I would like to see the argument FOR greyhound racing. What exactly does it do that we need. Need it so much that it's legal and sponsored and defended.

The dogs are doing something they really love to do everyday. Not many dogs can claim they get to do that. If the human's attitude to that dog is one of racing as a hobby and that person is accountable (accountable being they need to rehome the dog when it has finished racing and have high regard for the dog's welfare until it is) why would it be different to any other sport?

Sure they love running/racing but you can't convince me that trainers or owners have the dogs enjoyment of running at heart. If there was no money involved, you think many trainers would do it? Most other dog sports COST the owners money, not make it. I have previously stated I like dog sport. Also greyhound racing is an industry, not a hobby.

Not all trainers are the same. Some (many) see their greyhounds as part of their family. The same as most of us who train and compete in agility sports. There are also lure coursing clubs that are for not-greyhounds but any kind of dog that wants to run. There's no money to be made doing that, no TAB betting, and the participants pay for the equipment and ground hire and there's some risk of vet expenses if the dog injures themselves making a bad turn. So it's not about profit.

My dog loves to run flat out and chase things (usually me), total joy and can we do it again please... eg if we're practicing start line stays the only thing she wants is permission to run. It trumps even food treats. She's sorely disappointed if she gets a treat for her stay instead of to run and chase.

You make a sweeping generalisation saying all greyhound trainers are in it only for the money. It might be true of the horrible person who dumped 55 dead dogs in the park (they should get done for toxic waste dumping if nothing else).

But if every slow greyhound was dealt with this way - there would be a lot more.

I think I remember a couple of years ago - some NSW dog pound officer got into trouble for taking the unwanted dogs to the nearest country rubbish tip and shooting them dead there and dumping them. That was cruel and stupid too, and he saved money in vet and green dream drug costs but he didn't actually get to pocket any of that saving.

Cruel treatment of animals is not always about profit. And making money from animals is not always about cruelty.

I think if greyhound racing got banned, then so might agility, obedience (I actually see people beating up their dogs at obedience competiions and training - it's horrible), and lure coursing, earth dog, tracking...

And then there would be more bored barking dogs because we're not allowed to train the dogs to do what they were bred to do - or an approximation of it?

I think you're not quite understanding me. I am in no way against dogs undertaking the exact sport they are bred for. I am against an industry that exploits dogs for the profit of people that do not care.

I love seeing a dog in an agility run, or doing obedience or tracking or protection or lure coursing or weight pull or ET or herding. You name it, if a dog is being used for it's design I'm right behind that. I love dog sport. I defend some of the sports that even other dog people don't agree with.

I'm sure there's horrible people involved with every one of those disciplines. I'm also sure that if one could gamble on these events legally that the motivation for competing would inevitably change for the worse.

There is no need for an industry worth so much money to be based on racing dogs. I can't get my head around that. It's not pig-headedness. I just don't think in the future that anyone will look back on greyhound racing as it stands today as a very enlightened pursuit.

[Rebanne]

My ex racing dog was put into GAP by his owners, they visited us once and told me how my dogs brother had "gone to live on a farm". They had their young daughter with them. There was no farm. Why save one but not the other???

Perhaps they knew he would not be a suitable pet?

yes agree. But I badly worded it cause I was at work and couldn't correct it now. It was more save one and take the other out and shoot him when they could have at least taken him to the vet.

[m-j]

I would like to see the argument FOR greyhound racing. What exactly does it do that we need. Need it so much that it's legal and sponsored and defended.

The dogs are doing something they really love to do everyday. Not many dogs can claim they get to do that. If the human's attitude to that dog is one of racing as a hobby and that person is accountable (accountable being they need to rehome the dog when it has finished racing and have high regard for the dog's welfare until it is) why would it be different to any other sport?

Sure they love running/racing but you can't convince me that trainers or owners have the dogs enjoyment of running at heart. If there was no money involved, you think many trainers would do it? Most other dog sports COST the owners money, not make it. I have previously stated I like dog sport. Also greyhound racing is an industry, not a hobby.

Anybody who thinks they are definitely going to make money out of racing dogs is an idiot. Some do but the trainers and other involved in the industry that I know have a job that supplements their hobby A girlfriend of mine makes more in monetary terms with the dog food she wins trialling dogs than the vast majority of greyhound owners ever do racing their dogs. Just for the record she is a very ethical trainer her dogs are truly enjoyable to watch working because they love doing it.

[WreckitWhippet]

I would like to see the argument FOR greyhound racing. What exactly does it do that we need. Need it so much that it's legal and sponsored and defended.

The dogs are doing something they really love to do everyday. Not many dogs can claim they get to do that. If the human's attitude to that dog is one of racing as a hobby and that person is accountable (accountable being they need to rehome the dog when it has finished racing and have high regard for the dog's welfare until it is) why would it be different to any other sport?

Sure they love running/racing but you can't convince me that trainers or owners have the dogs enjoyment of running at heart. If there was no money involved, you think many trainers would do it? Most other dog sports COST the owners money, not make it. I have previously stated I like dog sport. Also greyhound racing is an industry, not a hobby.

I raced purely as a hobby. The only reason I am not currently doing it is time.

My dogs were checked every week, attended a chiro once a week, fed on premium dry and cuts of meat, given plenty of attention (including lounge time )and given everything that my show and house dogs are. It all cost money (winning was a bonus ) just as any other hobby does.

[melzawelza]

Suggestions that some of the dogs may have been beaten to death:

Some of the 55 greyhounds in mass grave may have been beaten to death

[Maddy]

My ex racing dog was put into GAP by his owners, they visited us once and told me how my dogs brother had "gone to live on a farm". They had their young daughter with them. There was no farm. Why save one but not the other???

Perhaps they knew he would not be a suitable pet?

yes agree. But I badly worded it cause I was at work and couldn't correct it now. It was more save one and take the other out and shoot him when they could have at least taken him to the vet.

A lot of trainers I knew when the Ted Medhurst case happened said that although they disagreed with his dishonesty (in forging paperwork), they believed that shooting a dog was kinder than taking it to a vet. To be honest, I'm not sure there's necessarily much difference, depending on circumstances.

I don't agree with m-j that it's a one or the other thing but both have the potential to be bad so.. I don't know. I've been out the back at a vet, holding a greyhound while it was put to sleep in front of other dead greyhounds. That poor dog struggled and was obviously very distressed. Then there are the dogs who fight the drugs- they scream and struggle and it's horrific to watch. And on one occasion a dog who, several minute after receiving a full dose, still had a heartbeat and shallow respiration. A careless vet might have just bagged that dog up and tossed it out the back to die slowly of asphyxiation in the bag.

On the other hand, shooting equally has potential to bring about welfare concerns, this case is a perfect example. Although that said, at the end of the day, the dog is still dead and that's the problem. If trainers were forced to have their dogs assessed and to rehome those who were suitable, less would have to be put to sleep to start with.

Edited for typo

Edited April 4, 2015 by Maddy

[cavNrott]

Suggestions that some of the dogs may have been beaten to death:

Some of the 55 greyhounds in mass grave may have been beaten to death

OMG it's getting worse the more we hear about it. Look at the sweet face on the Greyhound at the fence on the property of the accused. How in hell could anyone hurt these beautiful dogs? I really hope the remaining dogs on that property are very quickly removed and taken safely away from these people.

[gwp4me]

The lovable greyhound in the photo, most likely, loves the people who will eventually - without pity - butcher it.

[Greyt]

M-J,

There is no other breed of dog killed in the numbers that Greyhounds are every year by the racing industry.

If Greyhounds live such happy and active lives, why are so many healthy dogs in the PRIME of their lives killed every year?