Seizures

[Jumabaar]

The only information I can find all leads back to Jean Dodds so yeah, I'm very skeptical.

The statement about 77% of seizuring dogs tested being hypothyroid is just that. No mention of them being controlled by thyroxine alone so not sure where that stat came from.

Exactly. 77% of tested dogs being hypothyroid (probably from the medication) does not suggest that hypothyroidism causes seizures or that thyroxine is going to be of any benefit. You have a correlation that is explained by a medication involved and nothing I can find suggests any causation.

As an aside.. here is a list of symptoms/disorders jean Dodds attributes to hypothyroidism:

Weakness, stiffness, laryngeal paralysis, facial paralysis, tragic expression, knuckling or dragging feet, muscle wasting, megaesophagus, head tilt, drooping eyelids, seizures, mental dullness, exercise intolerance, neurologic signs, polyneuropathy, lethargy, weight gain, cold intolerance, mood swings, hyperexcitability, stunted growth, chronic infections, dry/scaly skin and dandruff, coarse/dull coat, bilateral symmetrical hair loss, rat tail, puppy coat, hyperpigmentation, seborrhea or greasy skin, pyoderma or skin infections, myxedema, chronic offensive skin odor, infertility of either sex, lack of libido, testicular atrophy, hypospermia aspermia, prolonged interestrus interval, absence of heat cycles, silent heats, pseudopregnancy, weak, dying or stillborn pups, slow heart rate (bradycardia), cardiac arrhythmias, cardiomyopathys, constipation, diarrhea, vomiting, bleeding, bone marrow failure, low red blood cells, low white blood cells, low platelets, corneal lipid deposits, corneal ulceration, uveitis Keratococonjunctivitis, sicca or dry eye, infections of eyelid glands, lgA deficiency, loss of smell (dysosmia), loss of taste, glycosuria, chronic active hepatitis, other endocrinopathies adrenal, pancreatic, parathyroid.

Just about every vague or common symptom you can think of. The majority of these things would have likely causes elsewhere but by listing every common complaint she can think of as being something possibly linked to hypothyroidism, she's just created herself a huge market of dogs that "should" be tested.

I doubt I'm going to change the minds of any Jean Dodds believers here but hopefully, other people who are considering wasting their money (or risking their dog's health based on her recommendations) will think very carefully before they do so.

Another point with the 77%- it would be the dogs where vets had other signs of hypothyroidism that would strongly recommend testing. I doubt that it is 77% of all the entire population of dogs with seizures.

The 33% could be the individuals sending off blood tests with no other symptoms because they have seen the 77% stat!

No judgement either way- just pointing out that statistics can be difficult to interpret without information about how the information was obtained i.e. numbers and sample population because it could be an exceptionally biased piece of data if taken out of context.

[Mum to Emma]

Emma started having the occasional seizure (about one every 4 months) in 2013. By September 2014 it was happening every four weeks. She had full blood panels twice and nothing showed up. Was put on a low dose of phenobarbitone in November and has not seized since (touch wood!!).

[BC Crazy]

My girl has been on Phenomav since March last year & 'touch wood' hasn't had a seizure since. She was having 3 to 4 major seizures a week & at least 6 less severe. Sometimes she would have 2 a day. The major ones were the ones that were so upsetting to me. The longest 5 mins of my life. She would lose total control over her bowels, vomit etc & would thrash around very dangerously on her stomach. I was always frightened she would hurt herself as a couple of times she threw herself at our glass back door

[Mum to Emma]

My girl has been on Phenomav since March last year & 'touch wood' hasn't had a seizure since. She was having 3 to 4 major seizures a week & at least 6 less severe. Sometimes she would have 2 a day. The major ones were the ones that were so upsetting to me. The longest 5 mins of my life. She would lose total control over her bowels, vomit etc & would thrash around very dangerously on her stomach. I was always frightened she would hurt herself as a couple of times she threw herself at our glass back door

That sounds terrifying! It's amazing how this little white pill can transform them.

[BarbedWire]

My vet told me that the phenobarbitone would not stop my dogs's seizures completely only make them less frequent and less severe. She only has about four seizures each year and they are horrible to watch and she urinates afterwards, but I have truly just learnt to live with them although it's no fun seeing her bang her head against the washing machine with a sickening thud. I have tried really hard to find triggers but I have had no luck. BC Crazy - your dog has done well. This website is useful.

http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/

ETA This is the part where it talks about triggers

http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/SeizureTriggers.htm

Edited February 6, 2015 by sarsaparilla

[BarbedWire]

There are issues with plane flights for dogs who have seizures. They have to be sedated first and the sedation only lasts a few hours, so they can't go for long trips: for example from the east coast to the west coast of Australia.

[VizslaMomma]

You are all gems thank you love it when you get so much information on this forum it really does help to give people their next course of action. Well she took a video of it and saw the vet, they will be getting blood test I did mention to her the thyroid whether or not she does it Im not sure. Its only happened once and apparently exactly a month ago and same time

Interesting point there. Did the dog get medications a month apart? Is your friend aware of anything happening at the time of seizures with the dog?

Just my 2 cents, can you make sure the Vet gets told about this as well, please.

:D

[Steph M]

There are issues with plane flights for dogs who have seizures. They have to be sedated first and the sedation only lasts a few hours, so they can't go for long trips: for example from the east coast to the west coast of Australia.

I agree.

Issue with sedation. being as well there's no studies (that I've seen) showing how sedation affects a dog in a pressurised environment, I've heard anecdotes along the lines of it wearing off a lot faster, or not being as effective. My concern would be a dog coming to and becoming aware of being in a crate, alone with aircraft noise would be very stressful.

Its also worrying that they're down there on their own, so no one can keep an eye on them or offer assistance if they're struggling.

Personally if I had a dog who had underlying health issues or needed sedating we would drive.

Edited February 7, 2015 by Steph M

[BC Crazy]

My girl has been on Phenomav since March last year & 'touch wood' hasn't had a seizure since. She was having 3 to 4 major seizures a week & at least 6 less severe. Sometimes she would have 2 a day. The major ones were the ones that were so upsetting to me. The longest 5 mins of my life. She would lose total control over her bowels, vomit etc & would thrash around very dangerously on her stomach. I was always frightened she would hurt herself as a couple of times she threw herself at our glass back door

That sounds terrifying! It's amazing how this little white pill can transform them.

Yes it is very frightening MTE. I always try & move Stella to a safe place so she doesn't hurt herself but this is very tricky as she is thrashing about & she could bite you accidently. I have learnt to read her body language & I can tell when she isn't well & maybe about to have a seizure. She knows it too. She becomes more clingy to me than usual for one & you can see fear in her eye's . So I just stay with her. Poor baby girl. Must be so scary for them.

Wonderful how effective Phenomav is.

[DeltaCharlie]

Still no internet so limited in what I can do but here are my personal experiences.

Litter of 3 pups from a repeat breeding (first litter perfect in every way and no issues known).

Pup 1- started cluster seizures at age of 15 months. Put on phenobarb but had no impact. Has had cluster seizures every 2-3 weeks for the last 6 months and they were getting worse. Only ever cluster seizures, never single seizures. Sought a second opinion and it was suggested to test thyroid function even though the dog had absolutely no other symptoms of thyroid issues (other than the seizures). Everyone else said waste of money but went ahead with test anyway.

Pup 2- all the researching of symptoms described this pup very well. Never looked like coming into season, behavioural issues, hyperactivity (which I had previously thought was characteristic of hyperthyroidism but apparently can also by hypothyroid in some cases).

First 2 pups were tested and came back as being hypothyroid. Pup 1 quite low but pup 2 incredibly low. 6 weeks of meds and noticeable difference in pup 2 (whose levels have just tested as being in normal range now). Pup 1 had her last cluster a little over 3 weeks ago but nowhere near the severity (her levels have still come back a little low though).

Pup 3- as of yesterday has now had a cluster of seizures. Thyroid levels will be tested (despite no other symptoms). Will keep you posted.

Needless to say the lines were desexed.