Montana Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 My 8 month old male Swiss Shepherd puppy has recently started showing aggression to other dogs. Correct me if i'm wrong but i have reason to believe it is his testosterone causing most of the issues.. He has always been very well socialised, the week before the "start" of all this we took him to a busy pet cafe and he was totally fine with the other dogs. The week after, i took him to our dog park as I do every Sunday afternoon, and he was playing nicely with a female labrador, but he started to hump her, but i called him away and that was that, they just continued playing. Soon after, probably 10 other dogs came into the park and i think he freaked out, he stood behind me barking at them if they came near us. So we left. I tried taking him back the following week as maybe it was a once off, but 2 dogs came running towards him and he ran straight for the exit, when he was cornered by them he barked and lunged at one of them. So we left again. That night we took him to the people cafe and he was fine with other people. So.. we took him to the park a few days later again, this time i brought my partner with me to help me correct this behaviour. After 20 minutes trying to walk from the car to the park (he kept barking at the smaller dogs in the other area) we got there and he 'met' a dog that was leaving, and that was all well and good for the first 5-7 seconds, then he started barking at it. When we got in the park he wee'd probably 3 times in different area (maybe marking his territory?" We were planning to wait until 12 months to neuter as he is a large breed but this behaviour is upsetting as he used to come with us everywhere, beaches, parks, cafes etc. Now i'm not so confident about him behaving. Especially because he WAS trusted off lead at the dog beaches etc. Any suggestions of ways I can correct this behavior? I think we are going to neuter, do you think it would help? Thanks :) ;;; Picture is him playing with a great dane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Posted February 1, 2015 Author Share Posted February 1, 2015 (edited) http://i60.tinypic.com/21ctc3p.png Edited February 1, 2015 by Montana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Posted February 1, 2015 Author Share Posted February 1, 2015 (edited) Edited February 1, 2015 by Montana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Could well be a fear period...and his behaviour sounds more like fear than anything else...personally I would not put him in these situations but work on counter conditioning - you may need to enlist the assistance of a trainer if you are in any way unsure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 This should work: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Ah you got it! Just to add my Dally developed an unholy fear of Great Danes at about 9 months despite NEVER having had a bad experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Posted February 1, 2015 Author Share Posted February 1, 2015 Took me a while to get it, havent used forums in so long! We have book one on one training sessions starting from next week :) I just dont quite know how they can help without experiencing what hes like, but we'll see? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Definitely does not sound like male aggression , but rather a fear/anxiety thing which, when you insist on exposing him , leads him to want to protect himself .if he can't run - then, well, he needs to bark/growl/hide. he looks very puppyish/submissive in that pic .Please don't desex him yet . Book in to a GOOD trainer/behaviourist . NOT necessarily the one with teh flashest website, the "guarantees" or the one you can see the quickest. The ones working in a franchise may also not be the most appropriate for this time . Kathy Kopellis-Mcleod has some excellent recommendations :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simply Grand Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Could well be a fear period...and his behaviour sounds more like fear than anything else...personally I would not put him in these situations but work on counter conditioning - you may need to enlist the assistance of a trainer if you are in any way unsure. Yes, if this is fear based, and it sounds like it is, the last thing you want to do is force him into situations and/or punish his reaction - not saying you are doing this but if you have been or if a trainer advises you to you will make the issue worse as he will not only feel fearful around other dogs but also associate them with you punishing him. As TSD says you want to change his mind set so that being around other dogs becomes a positive experience rather than a scary one. My Sheltie's behaviour changed at around the same age, he became reactive towards other dogs as his hormones kicked in but desexing didn't fix things and neither did trying to tell him off or using a leash correction, it wasn't until I realised I needed to create a positive association for him that we started making progress and he has improved greatly :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Posted February 1, 2015 Author Share Posted February 1, 2015 Thank you for your responses, I also thought it was fear. However I don't know what has caused it :s Can I ask you how you created a positive association with other dogs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Thank you for your responses, I also thought it was fear. However I don't know what has caused it :s Can I ask you how you created a positive association with other dogs? Counter conditioning is one way....there's a game that's been developed called Look At That! (LAT) by Leslie McDevitt. Basically you change how the dog feels about the scary thing - not just how he BEHAVES but how he FEELS. Look at the scary thing, look at me, get a treat. It really does work :) As mentioned already if your trainer wants to use aversives on a fearful dog I would be running a mile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Fear periods are a normal part of development - it just means the dog perceives various situations to be more fearful than normal. If you're not sure what to look out for these fearful situations can have a lasting impression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheena Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Thank you for your responses, I also thought it was fear. However I don't know what has caused it :s Can I ask you how you created a positive association with other dogs? Counter conditioning is one way....there's a game that's been developed called Look At That! (LAT) by Leslie McDevitt. Basically you change how the dog feels about the scary thing - not just how he BEHAVES but how he FEELS. Look at the scary thing, look at me, get a treat. It really does work :) As mentioned already if your trainer wants to use aversives on a fearful dog I would be running a mile. I would like to "second" LAT but you have to start off slowly...don't just throw him in at the deep end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonElite Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Its clearly a fear based agression, he barks when he is cornered when dogs rush to him etc. And he obviously doesn't like the dog park and the dogs there, so why put him through it? Not every dog wants to be a socially butterfly, don't force him to be one, just because YOU want him to be one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YippeeGirl Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 I agree it sounds like a fear based aggression. Our youngest girl is fear-aggressive around other dogs and will start hackling up and barking when we pass dogs on the street. We never force her into situations with strange dogs, and we are always alert when walking. I've found it's best to redirect her attention away from the other dog before she even has a chance to react. IMO punishing them when they are responding out of fear, does nothing but validate their fear because it tells them bad things happen when other dogs are around. I would avoid the dog parks if your puppy is not comfortable. None of our three go to the dog parks, and I feel in most cases they are a recipe for disaster, as it's very easy for a nervous dog to be overwhelmed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 (edited) Why does your dog need to have a positive association with all other dogs? It certainly isn't part of his original breed function to greet strange dogs as friends and the negative experiences he is getting are making him defensive. If he cannot escape the unwanted attention of other dogs and you don't step in, he has little choice but to aggress. Heed what he is telling you and don't place him in situations where he feels he has to be defensive. Timing wise, this is his second fear period. He needs controlled socialisation with reliable dogs who will not overwhelm him and a dog park is the last place I'd be taking him for that. Edited February 2, 2015 by Haredown Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airedaler Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 I agree with the others re a fear period and also with Haredown Whippets in saying that your dog does not need to have a positive association with all other dogs. Neutering him is most unlikely to stop this issue and IMO is never a solution to any behavioural problems. Many people think it is the answer to any negative situation but in reality it has very little if any impact on those situations. Training is what will impact on your problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana Posted February 2, 2015 Author Share Posted February 2, 2015 Its clearly a fear based agression, he barks when he is cornered when dogs rush to him etc. And he obviously doesn't like the dog park and the dogs there, so why put him through it? Not every dog wants to be a socially butterfly, don't force him to be one, just because YOU want him to be one. He used to enjoy the dog park.. this is a new thing. I'm not forcing him to do anything, we had previously been probably 8-9 times without any problems. I took him after the first experience to see if it was a once off or not. The first time we went no dogs rushed to him, they almost ignored him if anything and he reacted to them walking past. IT was the second time some dogs rushed towards him, and i got that he was scared. I took him one more time after that in a more controlled manner with my partner to see if we could help his fear. As I have stated in a previous post that I am doing one on one training with a behaviourist starting next week. It makes it hard to excersise him if I cant take him for walks because he will bark at dogs a kilometre in the distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 he may have had a fright - and now, he is making his views know first ! I hope the person you consult is experienced and useful :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted February 2, 2015 Share Posted February 2, 2015 It makes it hard to excersise him if I cant take him for walks because he will bark at dogs a kilometre in the distance. Then you need a program of desensitisation to other dogs. What you need to avoid with fear based responses is "correcting" them. If he is worried and you "punish" him for displaying his worry, you make it worse. It goes without saying that you don't place him in situations that make him fearful or defensive AT ALL while you work through the issues. Hopefully a good behaviourist (not some franchise owner with six weeks training) can work through this issue but it sounds to me like your boy is not a candidate for the free-for-all that can occur in dog parks. Don't worry, he has plenty of company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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