Advice From The Trainers/behaviourists Please!

[Simply Grand]

This week I had a rather forceful noise complaint from my next door neighbour regarding my dogs barking when I come home from my night job in the middle of the night. Here is a thread I started in Off Topic that explains the situation if you want the details, the first post explains what happened.

http://www.dolforums.com.au/topic/260284-just-a-vent-noise-complaint-from-neighbours/

Because I needed a fast and effective solution I have put citronella spray anti bark collars on Riley and Quinn (the culprits). They've been wearing them for a few days now and we seem to be going well with resolving the issue.

I understand the theory behind these collars (I believe) so have decided that the dogs will wear the collars all the time while they're at home so they learn not to bark here. Outside of home they will remain free to bark to their hearts' content.

My instincts say to just put the collars on when I go to my nights job as I know they will understand collar on means no barking, collar off means barking ok however my knowledge says that that isn't the right way to do it. Below is how I explained it in the other thread:

I decided to do collars on all the time, no barking at home for the dogs' sake, not the neighbours'. It should be quicker and easier for them to learn and therefore get less sprays if they have the clear distinction of at home vs. away from home rather than sometimes having the collar on at home and sometimes not. The distinction of when I will be home late from work vs. other times probably won't be clear enough for them.

I know they would learn pretty quickly collar on vs. collar off but then the collar becomes unpleasant in itself even when it isn't spraying them and I want them to be able to be relaxed and still do normal things while they are wearing them, just quietly!

Oh I do take them off when we all go to bed.

It does seem to be working, over the last couple of days they are staying quiet but becoming more relaxed and playful, and behaving pretty normally while wearing the collars and I'm hoping that will continue. However I still feel a bit mean

I'd be interested in hearing others' thoughts on this.

Thank you :)

Edited November 16, 2014 by Simply Grand

[Jemmy]

I don't think you're mean. It sounds like they are picking it up quickly... If they had it on every day for weeks on end and were still barking just the same, I'd say it was time for a rethink.

I'm not in off topic, so don't know the nature of the complaint, but if it were me I'd rather use the aversive option than have poison or something thrown over my fence.

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

You do need to be aware of dogs becoming collar smart - or working out if they don't have the collar on and they bark - they get away with it...

I've also read about one dog who would bark continuously until the citronella was all gone, at least you don't have that problem.

I'd try to mix up when the collars were on and working and when they were on the dog but not switched on so that there is less collar smarts...

And training the dog not to bark so much when you come home (be more boring and only reward quiet dogs with attention)...

And the collars - depending what sort - sometimes they can rub holes in the dog's coat if they're left on all the time. This is particularily true of the invisible fence type. Not so sure about the citronella sort.

I think doing something is better than having the dogs taken away (or worse) because the neighbours are upset.

[Simply Grand]

I think they've already figured out collar off means they can bark as normal. I think most dogs would pick that up quickly and that's why many people say their dog doesn't bark with the collar on but does when it's off. If I just stopped at that it would be easy to eliminate the problem by just putting the collar on but then there's no chance of them continuing the 'no barking' behaviour when the collar is off. And I also think it will make the collars a negative thing in themselves.

I don't think you can do collar on but switched off otherwise they will sometimes be barking and getting sprayed and sometimes not. That makes the behaviour unlikely to become extinct. The key to punishment working successfully is that they have to receive the punishment every single time they perform the behaviour.

Jemmy, long story short I work nights and the dogs were waking up and barking when I got home in the early hours. I didn't realise it had been disturbing the neighbours for some time until last week one of the neighbours yelled abuse at me over the fence. I do understand why they are upset, just wish they had let me know in a slightly nicer way. I definitely wanted to stop the noise quickly though so decided on the collars.

[VizslaMomma]

It does seem to be working, over the last couple of days they are staying quiet but becoming more relaxed and playful, and behaving pretty normally while wearing the collars and I'm hoping that will continue. However I still feel a bit mean

I'd be interested in hearing others' thoughts on this.

Thank you :)

Why? You are taking positive steps to have the dogs OK.

Bear in mind you are moving so this is a temp measure.

Whilst it may be outside of your usual methods, it's needed steps to maintain harmony with neighbours.

More power you for trying.

[Simply Grand]

Thanks all for the earlier comments. Just bumping in case any of the trainers are around...

It seems to be working, they are certainly relaxed wearing the collars and are happy to come over to have them put on. I have been paring that with food treats from the beginning.

They will still give an alert bark or two if they have heard or seen something unusual but don't generally bark with the collars on. Riley has figured out he can whine and it won't go off but he's only doing that sometimes when I've just come home and he's excited to see me. I'm hoping it isn't loud enough to wake the neighbours. There have been a few instances of the dogs hearing a noise or Saxon barking while the collars are off (before I've put them on when we get up) and they have stayed quiet for that whereas I think they would have barked then previously.

Edited December 3, 2014 by Simply Grand

[hankdog]

Yes you're being mean but you have to prioritize and right now you need the dogs to not bark. I don't think a spray falls into the realm of cruel, just moderately unpleasant but what you need to do. I'm interested to hear how they've worked it out. Good for them and since they're not barking with the collars on they're not actually being sprayed.