Bark Bark Bark Bark Bark Bark Bark

[Lablover]

I have a 2 year old field bred Labrador. Extremely high drive. I would guess one of the highest in this country.

She barks. She barks before I send her for a retrieve. She barks just before she picks up the article in her mouth. She barks just as she has picked up the article.

I have only been to a couple of agility trials, watched youtubes or spoken to agility lovers.

I have heard barking during agility, most at guess, before being released to start the course (hope my terminology is correct).

How do you try to decrease barking? Do you consider barking more frequently found in young agility dogs, or caused by excitement or frustration.

Thanks!

[Kavik]

In am following your thread with interest! I am also having a barking issue with my young dog Nitro. He barks when frustrated, unsure, over aroused, excited etc. I am not used to dealing with this as Kaos is completely different! Most of the time when he barks (especially repeated barking) his brain is not in gear.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Kavik

[Lablover]

Do you train for agility with Nitro?

[Kavik]

Yes, I am training Nitro for agility.

Not ready to compete yet :laugh: the barking is one of the things I am trying to sort out.

[Lablover]

My problem barker is not a barker in other situations. Her sire and dam did not bark. Mind you they were both high drive, her sire especially.

Nature V nuture? I wonder!!

Anyway, is Nitro a vocal type generally? Was Nitro sire and/or dam vocal?

[megan_]

I was at the Justine Davenport (agility) seminar the other week with a young kelpie who would bark, bark, bark, bark....

Justine's advice:

i) If the dog is working well and barking, she'd accept that and carry on

ii) If the dog was barking because of overstimulation and not working (as was the case with this young kelpie) the game was over. Owner stood relaxed, stared blankly. As soon as the kelpie stopped the owner would re-engage (impulse control = fun happens, no impulse control = fun stops). Only had to be repeated a few times for the dog to get hte point. Of course, this behaviour has become ingrained so it is going to take a fair bit of work to get rid of it. It also means a lot of agility training opportunities get missed (eg might go to club and never actually do agility because the dog is over-aroused).

You also see a lot of "what do you want me to do" barking at agility trials (especially from BC's?). If that's the case I'd suggest it just means more work on handling and independence (eg verbals).

[aussielover]

Maybe your lab is part kelpie? Lol

Most agility people appear not to notice or care if their dog barks around course. I've run a barky dog and when you're running you are so busy concentrating on the course you don't really hear much...

There is not much incentive to stop barking as you don't get penalized in agility.

Many dogs bark in frustration which improves or ceases

when the handler gives clear directions.

Do you lose points in retrieving for barking?

[aussielover]

I know another lab who whines and barks at retrieving, she isn't what I'd describe as high drive.

Doesn't bark at agility at all.

No offence to kelpie people but I've generally found them to be quite vocal.

Edited November 6, 2014 by aussielover

[Kavik]

I was at the Justine Davenport (agility) seminar the other week with a young kelpie who would bark, bark, bark, bark....

Justine's advice:

i) If the dog is working well and barking, she'd accept that and carry on

ii) If the dog was barking because of overstimulation and not working (as was the case with this young kelpie) the game was over. Owner stood relaxed, stared blankly. As soon as the kelpie stopped the owner would re-engage (impulse control = fun happens, no impulse control = fun stops). Only had to be repeated a few times for the dog to get hte point. Of course, this behaviour has become ingrained so it is going to take a fair bit of work to get rid of it. It also means a lot of agility training opportunities get missed (eg might go to club and never actually do agility because the dog is over-aroused).

You also see a lot of "what do you want me to do" barking at agility trials (especially from BC's?). If that's the case I'd suggest it just means more work on handling and independence (eg verbals).

Yeah Nitro is point (ii) - barking and not working. That is what I am trying at the moment, have only just started to completely stop the game so it might take a little while to sort it out.

[Nekhbet]

Break down the exercise. You do not engage until quiet. You finish the exercise if she barks and start again. Teach that barking = failed exercise. It will make it stop.

It can be a byproduct of frustration. In some persuits you want it, in others you dont.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Nekhbet

[Lablover]

Maybe your lab is part kelpie? Lol

Most agility people appear not to notice or care if their dog barks around course. I've run a barky dog and when you're running you are so busy concentrating on the course you don't really hear much...

There is not much incentive to stop barking as you don't get penalized in agility.

Many dogs bark in frustration which improves or ceases

when the handler gives clear directions.

Do you lose points in retrieving for barking?

Yes we loose points at retrieving trials. The last American field trial trainer and an USA vet who also was part of a training seminar, suggested as you, and Megan (thanks too, very much appreciated), that I ignore her. (They also stated she was the highest drive in Australia) I think she is a nutter myself. (I can say that as I bred her!).

I had experienced highly regarded search and rescue friends observe us, they suggested I quicken my sends. Only problem is with triples, the dog has to learn to not bark or any vocalisation between retrieves. Blinds also, we have 12 article circles, say one as each number of a clock. I have to be slow so she focuses on the selected/right retrieve.

[Lablover]

Break down the exercise. You do not engage until quiet. You finish the exercise if she barks and start again. Teach that barking = failed exercise. It will make it stop.

It can be a byproduct of frustration. In some persuits you want it, in others you dont.

I have tried for non rewarding. I have tried for non rewarding. I have tried with non rewarding. I WILL TRY AGAIN ! HA! She is doing my head in!

[Lablover]

I know another lab who whines and barks at retrieving, she isn't what I'd describe as high drive.

Doesn't bark at agility at all.

No offence to kelpie people but I've generally found them to be quite vocal.

Sure I have seen or rather HEARD low drive barkers. Or when handlers walk the course and their dogs vocalise then amble around. EECK!

[Kavik]

Break down the exercise. You do not engage until quiet. You finish the exercise if she barks and start again. Teach that barking = failed exercise. It will make it stop.

It can be a byproduct of frustration. In some persuits you want it, in others you dont.

Sometimes with Nitro it is certainly due to frustration.

[Lablover]

Break down the exercise. You do not engage until quiet. You finish the exercise if she barks and start again. Teach that barking = failed exercise. It will make it stop.

It can be a byproduct of frustration. In some persuits you want it, in others you dont.

Sometimes with Nitro it is certainly due to frustration.

I know the vocalisation makes me frustrated!

[Kavik]

Me too!

Initially when the barking occurred during shaping I treated it like I do when the dog stalls out and stands there and doesn't offer anything else (something I am used to, as this is what my other dogs do) - I waited him out to see if he would offer something else. Only just recently have I tried stopping the game.

[Lablover]

Kavik, had you trained your dog to bark on command??????

[Kavik]

No, I haven't trained him to bark on command.

[aussielover]

I know another lab who whines and barks at retrieving, she isn't what I'd describe as high drive.

Doesn't bark at agility at all.

No offence to kelpie people but I've generally found them to be quite vocal.

Sure I have seen or rather HEARD low drive barkers. Or when handlers walk the course and their dogs vocalise then amble around. EECK!

Does she have a quiet command?

Perhaps teaching her what you want and asking for a moments silence before being released would help?

Or even a "look at me" type command where she had to focus on you (silently) before being released?

I have a speak and quiet command (although it sometimes changes to shut up lol) but my dog is not a problem barker

[Vickie]

I have a young dog who barks going to the startline in agility, but now as soon as I put her in a down she will stop & focus. She pretty much never barks on course. Initially she would bark in any position she was waiting for release from, ie startlines, contacts, table.

I introduced the word "good", nice calm long drawn out word. Initially paired it with treats, but don't need to anymore. I can see her visibly go down just a notch when I say it. She's still high as a kite, lol, but it seems to be enough to stop the barking.

She still barks on her way in until I engage with her, but I can cope with that.

Interestingly enough, I was working with one of your pups a bit yesterday Lablover. She was anticipating the behaviour we were asking for & her barking clearly said "get with the program you idiot, I'm doing it! Either release or reward me!" Gorgeous pup, super smart & full of drive. Since the behaviour will also require duration, we tried the gooooooood word with her & she was settling a bit on it & the barking stopped.

I think it's easy to create/allow barking in a young high drive dog & once you have it, it can be very hard to get rid of. I know nothing of retrieving, but in agility foundation it is often the handler moving (mentally) too slowly for the dogs learning capability.