Topic Closed

[Akay]

Topic closed! Have a great day everyone

Edited October 19, 2014 by Akay

[kelpiecuddles]

Can you go back to the original vet? In my experience continuity of care can be a good thing in cases like this

[Akay]

Can you go back to the original vet? In my experience continuity of care can be a good thing in cases like this

I agree, but no, I've moved interstate, which I did only a week after the initial vaccine.

[kelpiecuddles]

bummer. Is it possible that the coughing which occurred initially as a side effect fro the vaccine has worsened the murmur therefore causing the coughing to continue and the fluid build up. Bit of a circular problem

[Akay]

bummer. Is it possible that the coughing which occurred initially as a side effect fro the vaccine has worsened the murmur therefore causing the coughing to continue and the fluid build up. Bit of a circular problem

That's what I'm thinking is a possibility as well. I'm just wondering if it can happen that way. This is the kind of information I wanted from the vet but it's a bit difficult to explore the possibilities when she wouldn't entertain the idea that the dog had side effects from the vaccine in the first place. I'm not willing to go to another vet unless I know they're a bit more open-minded or willing to admit that their precious vaccines can actually cause negative side affects.

Edited October 18, 2014 by Akay

[kelpiecuddles]

You could try calling your original vet and asking if they will do a phone consult with you to discuss. Explain you are having trouble finding a vet in the area and want to discuss an ongoing issue that your vet was managing.

[Akay]

Thanks KelpieCuddles, I might have to do that if I don't have any luck in Canberra.

[gillbear]

It could have been kennel cough that was picked up in the waiting room at the vets. Any dog in heart failure is prone to deterioration especially when unwell with a virus etc. Heart failure and the buildup of fluid in the lungs can cause coughing which may or may not be associated with a potential case of KC. IMHO you can't just blame the vaccine.

[Rappie]

I'm sorry this response is going to be short but I'm in the midst of toddler wrangling...

The answer to all your questions is likely to be yes, possibly. Certainly the live intranasal vaccine can induce mild upper respiratory tract signs due to the local immune response but it does not typically also result in lower respiratory signs. 3 months in the life span of a dog that already has a grade 5 heart murmur is a long time and thing can change rapidly, or they may progress very slowly. The often confounding thing about dogs with mitral valve disease, especially CKCS is that they will often have concurrent dynamic airway disease / chronic bronchitis which can contribute to the clinical signs and require additional management. There was a recent paper published headed by a cardiologist here in Sydney that was investigating the theory of left atrial enlargement causing compression of the mainstem bronchi and resulting in a cough, and after bronchoscope was performed found that in many of the dogs there was no compression but there was evidence of bronchitis. In your case, management of the heart failure may require a medication review, some chest radiographs, and consideration of medication options for chronic bronchitis (of which there are many but usually commencing with a course of doxycycline prior to other respiratory medications)

If you're not happy with your current vet then ask around for another well respected vet for a second opinion, or consider getting a referral to see a medical specialist or cardiologist (depending on your location). You're welcome to PM me or post here if your have other questions.

[Akay]

Thank you so much for your expert reply Rappie! What you have said makes complete sense to me. Thank you also for saying that the KC vaccine can cause upper respiratory issues, which is more likely than him picking it up in the waiting room. I'm going to take you up on your offer of sending a pm through :)

ETA: I've just been doing some reading on Canine Bronchitis and what is happening fits. It also says that KC can precede Bronchitis. At least now I have something to go on. Now to find a decent vet in Canberra.....

Edited October 19, 2014 by Akay

[seregil]

just to add to Rappie's awesome reply, I would have thought the time between the visit to the vet and the dramatic increase in coughing would have been too soon? I would think the incubabtion period for kennel cough would be more than two days? more like 5 days or so.

[Akay]

I can't really see how your post has added to Rappie's because she wasn't doubting that he developed symptoms after the vaccine like you are. The emergence of the increased, louder and more intense coughing was within the incubation period for Kennel Cough, which is typically 3-7 days. It was 3 months ago remember, so maybe I should have said a "few" days instead of a "coupla". Whatever the time period it was at the time fits within the incubation period, hence why I am convinced it was the vaccine. Given the fact it can happen I still don't understand why people are still doubting it. He's a 12 year old dog with a compromised immune system. Kennel Cough can precede Bronchitis.

Edited October 19, 2014 by Akay