New Organisation For Pedigree Registration

[Danois]

I think they will fill a demand - we turn heaps away who are breeding cross breeds and want to give papers out to their puppy buyers sure the CC must too.

What's the purpose of giving out papers?? What can a puppy buyer do with them?

I'd be concerned about the long term use of them - more and more people BYBing puppies and claiming they have papers.

Fact is that unless your puppy comes from a breeder registered with the official canine council and has been registered by that breeder then you simply don't get papers. If you're so concerned about having them then buy a puppy from the right sources.

[Steve]

I think they will fill a demand - we turn heaps away who are breeding cross breeds and want to give papers out to their puppy buyers sure the CC must too.

What's the purpose of giving out papers?? What can a puppy buyer do with them?

I'd be concerned about the long term use of them - more and more people BYBing puppies and claiming they have papers.

Fact is that unless your puppy comes from a breeder registered with the official canine council and has been registered by that breeder then you simply don't get papers. If you're so concerned about having them then buy a puppy from the right sources.

Thats one way of looking at it but the reality is that some breeders want to breed cross bred dogs and still be able to give out a registered pedigree certifying who the ancestors are - and in Victoria being able to do is part of the criteria for the breeders in a group to qualify for exemptions - which is why the AAPdb were considering doing the same - not sure if they do.

Edited October 14, 2014 by Steve

[Steve]

you have to understand that anyone can and many do provide pedigree papers for mutts - this is simply a third party offering accountability and registering the pedigree just as you register the birth of a child with a third party regardless of its heritage.

[pepe001]

I see it as a person/persons who want to make some money producing ancestry reports for members who wish to give an official looking document to puppy buyers. The trap is the general public will call these registration papers and say their cross breeds are an actual breed. I think many people would like to see what the parents/ grandparents etc of their puppies look like. I wonder if they will list the actual breed in their eyes - could get very long when they include all ancestors - even two generation back.

[Steve]

Most pedigrees including ANKC pedigrees list the breed of every dog in the pedigree.

[Steve]

I think they are about to get a fast education and embark on a steep learning curve. They have made assumptions which will soon be proven wrong.

They are no threat to ANKC registered breeders and their dogs.

[Tassie]

Wonder if I can register my cat if I tell them it's a special new cross breed dog :D :D

ROFL - well, the Wegies do come in all sorts of colours And they do tend to think they're dogs :D .

[Steve]

Wonder if I can register my cat if I tell them it's a special new cross breed dog :D :D

ROFL - well, the Wegies do come in all sorts of colours And they do tend to think they're dogs :D .

There are registries for cats that may be able to help. Some encourage new breeds and have registries for experimental breedings etc.

[_PL_]

I think I read something yesterday about this group and it sounds like 2 of the main people are disgruntled, (and now banned), Dogs NSW people... Speaks volumes really :) ...

Yeh, just seems like a tantie. Remember before FB when people got kicked off Dol they would go start a forum of their own? Happened not long ago as well. :laugh:

[Tassie]

Wonder if I can register my cat if I tell them it's a special new cross breed dog :D :D

ROFL - well, the Wegies do come in all sorts of colours And they do tend to think they're dogs :D .

There are registries for cats that may be able to help. Some encourage new breeds and have registries for experimental breedings etc.

Sorry, Steve - that was a private joke. AFAIK RJ's cat is a registered purebred (with the main 'official' registry

- as mine are :laugh:

[Steve]

Wonder if I can register my cat if I tell them it's a special new cross breed dog :D :D

ROFL - well, the Wegies do come in all sorts of colours And they do tend to think they're dogs :D .

There are registries for cats that may be able to help. Some encourage new breeds and have registries for experimental breedings etc.

Sorry, Steve - that was a private joke. AFAIK RJ's cat is a registered purebred (with the main 'official' registry

- as mine are :laugh:

[Riley James]

PMSL@Tassie,

Sometime I think he is a bit of a registered retard

But yes he is a purebred lol

The thing that concerns me is simepoeple wont uderstand they are buying crossbred dogs if they are given papers.

I remember a few years a go a friend purchased a Maltese shitzu cross then proceeded to tell me they didn't get papers.

I had to explain to her ithat her dog is a Maltese cross Shitzu she thought it was a purebred call that.

Now imagine if someone could have charged extra to people like her who don't understand about all the crosses out there.

I don't have a problem with them documenting the parentage of the dogs but not in a way as to mislead the general public.

Which I feel may be the outcome.

[Steve]

But why does it have to be they will mislead people - surely when a breeder sells a pup they have to represent them for what they are anyway.

[Riley James]

Yes honest people do and will but and this is my concern

Not everyone is honest.

Maybeits up to the buyer to research more and understand.

But life has told me not everyone does this.

And so many people hear the word "Papers" and presume the pup is purebred.

Maybe I am scewed with my thinking but there are a lot of gullible people out there.

[Steve]

Yes honest people do and will but and this is my concern

Not everyone is honest.

Maybeits up to the buyer to research more and understand.

But life has told me not everyone does this.

And so many people hear the word "Papers" and presume the pup is purebred.

Maybe I am scewed with my thinking but there are a lot of gullible people out there.

Its not up to the buyer - in Australia you cant represent something you are selling as something its not.

[The Spotted Devil]

Agreed but it's so often about perceptions and not outright lies. I get a lot of pups from legal puppy farms in my classes and people really believe they've made an ethical choice from a "breeder".

[Cosmolo]

So do I TSD- all the time!

[Steve]

Agreed but it's so often about perceptions and not outright lies. I get a lot of pups from legal puppy farms in my classes and people really believe they've made an ethical choice from a "breeder".

Yes but that's happening now because the councils are ticking off on them - and by approving them legitimising them and making them appear ethical - its nothing to do with a bit of paper to say who the parents were.

[Pjrt]

I just spotted an ad on dumb tree for cav(alier) / (p)oodle from a registered breeder with C.C.S.A , which apparently is the Canine Community of South Australia ?? New one to me!

[Steve]

Look I really think these guys are in for some big shocks and if they do last the distance it’s going to be tough and slow.

For me much of what they say shows a lack of knowledge and naivety. It’s also contradictory but will fill a niche market especially when what is being planned behind the scenes with animal welfare is put into action in the next 12 months.

Personally I’d rather see breeders who think this way in their own group rather than operating on their own with no third party accountability or staying in a CC and breaching the codes until they get caught.

No point for me in someone ticking all of the boxes, getting a vet to look at your property once a year, showing or any other activity and breeding any dogs regardless of what your goals are etc – with or without papers - if a major part of it isn’t about how they feel about the dogs they own, their base philosophies and what they are and are not prepared to compromise on.

One thing that you can absolutely be sure of with a purebred is that what is required to own it and live with it and manage it is predictable. Without a standard or mating one purebred to a different breed it’s difficult to see how anyone would think that this is showing that a breeder cares about the survival and protection of a breed.

The other is that purebred breeders are not supposed to be only interested in the outcome for the dogs in a current litter. Their interests and goals include how what they breed today will impact on what comes later for generations long after they pack up their whelping boxes.

People who buy my puppies know that I use a registered pedigree to help me select and keep records on what I’m breeding to try to avoid things I can’t test for and to focus on what is best for my dogs and their breed. They know that their registered pedigree isn’t just a record of who the ancestors are but an indication that for generations the people breeding them gave a toss for what they are taking home in their arms today.

What I do and think is different to them and it’s a good opportunity for us to say so and explain why. We don’t need to say they are wrong or get involved in having to make them look bad or defending ourselves. It’s just not what we do because we don’t think its what is best for the dogs or any breed into the future.