Both Sick Again Tearing My Hair Out.

[persephone]

Ok - a vet that isn't comncerned with 'a little vomit' when dogs are being investigated for illnesses would worry me.

Some detective work :

In the backyard ..are any structures made of the green treated pine?

What sort of water containers do they drink from? Do they drink from a pond or anything?

What detergents/carpet cleaners do you use?

How often (if any) do you flea bomb thehouse?

What insect control do you use around the house/yard?

I can't remember if the dogs have any bought treats/toys - what do they chew on ?

Do dogs spend time in a shed or workshop or similar?

Do they share your shower/bath?

[Charjas]

I did change vets and my previous post listed results Charlie high pancreas enzymes , liver ok. Jasper NO thyroid issue. Hence I've only fed RC hypoallergenic except for the weekend when they vomited. I actually think it's the biscuits. Ok on rice / chicken mix. She's talking about switching to a lower fat food. Waiting t see if Charlie goes a month. Their water is in my laundry. I have no ponds. Pool which is fenced. Small grass area. Nothing different in yard for years. Have fenced off area that possum poo was found and have spikes along fence so they can change route. Haven't done worm tab since last month. Due soon. Have NOT done frontline and do not flea bomb my house as we don't have fleas do not shampoo carpet. The other thing I've made a note of is jasper is scratching more these last few weeks and that would coincide with the new food?? I didn't have a problem with the holistic select per se but as now Charlie needs low fat food it wouldn't be suitable. Jasper was ok on it. I've had so many different views, feed raw , feed cooked meat, vets all natural White rice brown rice sweet potato , etc etc. it just gets more confusing. When we had some chicken neck some kibble jasper was ok but not always Charlie. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Edited September 17, 2014 by Charjas

[cavNrott]

Hence I've only fed RC hypoallergenic except for the weekend when they vomited

Again I suggest a low fat dry food such as Canidae Platinum for the dog with Pancreatitis.

I'm confused. What biscuits are you referring to? You said you only fed the RC hypoallergenic except for the weekend when they vomited. OK so what did they eat on that weekend that resulted in them vomiting?

Are you referring to the dry food as biscuits? If so it seems they only vomited when you didn't feed the RC hypoallergenic on that weekend.

[persephone]

C&R - I read that as the dogs were fed differently after they vomited?ie: had chicken/rice .....

[cavNrott]

Hence I've only fed RC hypoallergenic except for the weekend when they vomited. I actually think it's the biscuits. Ok on rice / chicken mix.

The way I read is that they were only fed RC except for the weekend when they vomited. OK on rice/chicken mix. I'm reading that they were also not vomiting on the rice/chicken, Perse, since Charjas said they were OK on it.

If they didn't vomit while on the RC dry food and they were OK on the chicken and rice. What did they eat in the period between the dry food and the chicken and rice that made them vomit?

Charjas, with respect, do you mind me asking you to make your posts a little clearer. We can't try to help if we're not quite sure what's happening.

edited to say:

On reflection I suspect Charjas is saying they were doing alright on the RC dry until the weekend when they vomited. She then switched to the rice/chicken mix.

If this is the case and the RC is the cause of the vomiting I would not be 'waiting for a month' whether the vet said so or not. I would be changing the dry food right away.

Edited September 17, 2014 by cavNrott

[Charjas]

Hence I've only fed RC hypoallergenic except for the weekend when they vomited

Again I suggest a low fat dry food such as Canidae Platinum for the dog with Pancreatitis.

I'm confused. What biscuits are you referring to? You said you only fed the RC hypoallergenic except for the weekend when they vomited. OK so what did they eat on that weekend that resulted in them vomiting?

Are you referring to the dry food as biscuits? If so it seems they only vomited when you didn't feed the RC hypoallergenic on that weekend.

No. They've had RC HYPOALLERGENIC for 3 weeks but as Charlie vomited once Thursday, Friday and jasper Saturday I gave chicken and rice for the weekend and went flack gradually to RC. However Charlie vomited 3 times yesterday so I'm now on RC gastrointestinal , started tonight.

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[Charjas]

Hence I've only fed RC hypoallergenic except for the weekend when they vomited. I actually think it's the biscuits. Ok on rice / chicken mix.

The way I read is that they were only fed RC except for the weekend when they vomited. OK on rice/chicken mix. I'm reading that they were also not vomiting on the rice/chicken, Perse, since Charjas said they were OK on it.

If they didn't vomit while on the RC dry food and they were OK on the chicken and rice. What did they eat in the period between the dry food and the chicken and rice that made them vomit?

Charjas, with respect, do you mind me asking you to make your posts a little clearer. We can't try to help if we're not quite sure what's happening.

edited to say:

On reflection I suspect Charjas is saying they were doing alright on the RC dry until the weekend when they vomited. She then switched to the rice/chicken mix.

If this is the case and the RC is the cause of the vomiting I would not be 'waiting for a month' whether the vet said so or not. I would be changing the dry food right away.

The vet was attempting to trial the hypoallergenic one for at least a month because every 4 weeks Charlie would have bloody, jelly poo. Despite ultrasound being clear, the blood test was redone and still high. She thinks chronic pancreatitis so RC was bound to be changed.

Even though he vomited a few times yesterday he was normal , running up stairs , chasing jasper this morning so it appears mild attack. Poos still normal.

Ate the new kibble tonight.

I fed nothing but RC , NO TREATS, until the vomits. So nothing else there to cause it

All good tonight still. Dinner was at 4. It's now 10.

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[persephone]

..if they don't vomit on chicken & rice ... why not use that as their food for a while ? Nice lean chicken /brown rice , and a small amount of veges (carrot/peas/spinach ). ?

[Charjas]

Hence I've only fed RC hypoallergenic except for the weekend when they vomited. I actually think it's the biscuits. Ok on rice / chicken mix.

The way I read is that they were only fed RC except for the weekend when they vomited. OK on rice/chicken mix. I'm reading that they were also not vomiting on the rice/chicken, Perse, since Charjas said they were OK on it.

If they didn't vomit while on the RC dry food and they were OK on the chicken and rice. What did they eat in the period between the dry food and the chicken and rice that made them vomit?

Charjas, with respect, do you mind me asking you to make your posts a little clearer. We can't try to help if we're not quite sure what's happening.

edited to say:

On reflection I suspect Charjas is saying they were doing alright on the RC dry until the weekend when they vomited. She then switched to the rice/chicken mix.

If this is the case and the RC is the cause of the vomiting I would not be 'waiting for a month' whether the vet said so or not. I would be changing the dry food right away.

Bought today the RC. GASTROINTESTINAL.

only other thing I've noticed is jasper seems to scratch more on this brand

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[persephone]

there is no way I would be continuing with a dry food if my dogs were vomiting

is this one a low fat one ?

Please remember that a good diet , with very low fat content, can be made using good raw food - no added anythings !!

[Charjas]

..if they don't vomit on chicken & rice ... why not use that as their food for a while ? Nice lean chicken /brown rice , and a small amount of veges (carrot/peas/spinach ). ?

I had been doing that and then introduced sweet potato.

It's pretty much always the same except the holistic select fish kibble( that we had up to recently) suited jasper but Charlie was sick on and off. That's why I changed and ended up with that silly cat hair ball control food which by the way also made Charlie vomit if he ate just that so I mixed with other basic food mix.

I did look into the Augustine approved and the vets all natural. Not changing too much though yet. See how this low fat one goes.

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[Charjas]

there is no way I would be continuing with a dry food if my dogs were vomiting

is this one a low fat one ?

Please remember that a good diet , with very low fat content, can be made using good raw food - no added anythings !!

Yes this one is RC gastrointestinal. The other choice is hills id. Will see how it goes. It is much lower fat content than the other.

I used to feed raw chicken necks, BARF , and some kibble. But switched to cooked because of Charlie.

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[frufru]

Perhaps the dogs would do better on separate diets - My allergy girl got different food to the rest - might help

[Charjas]

I'm trialling 'the vets all natural ' with raw chicken. Have also been in touch with AUGUSTINE APPROVED.

so far so good they are both eating every bit. Charlie has not been sick. Jasper still scratching but early days. I nearly got to the 3 month mark with Jaspers licking his feet but he licked his toes so soaked in calendula tea and wearing collar.

Has anyone tried FAITH. sold by Augustine approved. Promotes wellbeing and after a long discussion with the guy he questioned the interceptor which as made charlie suck every single dose, every month.

Do you really have to worm?? Are they at risk of heart worm??

They don't have contact with other dogs.

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[Sandra777]

Do you really have to worm??

No. Not unless a fecal exam suggests it's a good idea. My adults get wormed virtually never - the pups do get wormed regularly + mum when she's with the pups. Roundworms are the biggy here.

Only if a dog has regular access to wild animal droppings does it become a real issue. Normal suburban dogs are at much less risk than the TV adverts would have you believe

Are they at risk of heart worm??

They don't have contact with other dogs.

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Depends on where you live. Google the life-cycle of heartworm. One of the basics is the temp has to CONSTANTLY be over 14 degrees for a very specific period of time, so in winter probably no - however if your not going to treat in winter you need to think about the need to testing before starting again in summer. Google is you friend.

Edited September 26, 2014 by Sandra777

[persephone]

AS people have posted - worming/flea treatments do NOT have to be given every month ..especially if you have chemical-sensitive dogs.

Heartworm is a concern , as it is transmitted by mosquitoes. Check with the local vets , to see what the incidence in your area is . IF your dogs were to get heartworm ..treatment is not pleasant - as the adult worms live in the heart - and need Vet supervision to use special chemicals to kill/dissolve them so they do not clog up the heart/blood vessels.

and you will have a MUCH better idea if you stop continually changing foods!!! The raw is a great plan - keep them on it for a month or so ..and see how they go .

[schnauzer]

STOP changing the diet so often.

If you do a trial diet the minimum period (with NO other foods) is six weeks. I just successfully did this with one of mine who is sensitive to raw meat. He is now on fish and doing well. My bitch who had pancreatitis only once is on Eukanuba Intestinal and raw and is great on that with no further incidence.

You could use Sentinel Spectrum which covers heartworm/worms/fleas - monthly tablet.

Ensure your groomer is not clipping too close to the skin on your dogs paws, as that will also make them itch, as will grass/pollen/ivy/plane trees/ allergies etc.

Did you see Dr Linda Vogelnest - dermatologist as suggested?

[Erny]

Heartworm in your locality could be an issue. The best (i.e. "kindest") heart worm preventative is the one given by tablet daily (at least, that is what I researched and had Dr Jean Dodds confirm/support when I initially believed I had to use heart worm treatment down here). At least it is a medication that is not mixed to be a duel or multi-purpose approach and means you are not adding other compounds to your dog's system unnecessarily.

The trouble with the daily is that you MUST NOT FORGET to give it, and that's why most people opt for the monthly medications that are available to cover it.

And you'd need to check because my research knowledge on the "daily" med goes back 6 years ago, but I think you might need to double check via blood test if you switch to daily. Not sure about that though - just a vague thought off the top of my head.

And yes .... steady as she goes with the diet changes. It takes the body at least 6 weeks to rid itself of toxins that may have been the result of a dietary reaction. So even when you do switch, troubles could still persist for a while, although it is reasonable to expect the reactions to be progressively less. I prefer a diet where one can switch (or remove) one meat protein at a time, and sit on that (provided the dog's reactions aren't continuing to be intensive, such as regular vomiting), to see how the body responds. Apart from the fact that I prefer to feed as natural a diet as possible, it does make it easier to adjust in a more exact fashion than switching to or from different commercial kibble.

It takes time and patience. This is hard when we just want our dog to be well and we let ourselves panic over it unnecessarily. Using the benefits of Calendula Tea washes (avoiding all shampoos etc) will likely help to calm the skin and avoid secondary skin infections whilst you're trialling diet adjustments. It buys time, so to speak. Hasten slowly is generally a good attitude to maintain.

Edited September 26, 2014 by Erny

[Dave-o]

What a confusing thread. It's chaos in text. And I'll probably add to it just by posting :laugh:

All the chopping and changing - not good. Pick a decent food, stick to it, give medication at the correct intervals, and let the dogs get into a stable routine. You'll never get to the bottom of this otherwise, whether it's allergies, parasites, medical condition. Kibble's are formulated to provide all necessary nutrients, so I recommend that as a simple diet. Stick with what you're using now if it's working. Stop feeding them anything else for a while. Stabalise.

Side note: It's better for dogs to eat cat food than cats to eat dog food. Cats need more protein and taurine. Still, I wouldn't feed a dog cat food and can't imagine any vet suggesting that. They recommend Science Diet as the standard (and of course make money selling it).

I hope you get to the bottom of it, and I hope the wellness of your dogs improves :)

[cavNrott]

What a confusing thread. It's chaos in text. And I'll probably add to it just by posting :laugh:

All the chopping and changing - not good. Pick a decent food, stick to it, give medication at the correct intervals, and let the dogs get into a stable routine. You'll never get to the bottom of this otherwise, whether it's allergies, parasites, medical condition. Kibble's are formulated to provide all necessary nutrients, so I recommend that as a simple diet. Stick with what you're using now if it's working. Stop feeding them anything else for a while. Stabalise.

Side note: It's better for dogs to eat cat food than cats to eat dog food. Cats need more protein and taurine. Still, I wouldn't feed a dog cat food and can't imagine any vet suggesting that. They recommend Science Diet as the standard (and of course make money selling it).

I hope you get to the bottom of it, and I hope the wellness of your dogs improves :)

Yes this ^